Help with map drawing techniques

[caid]

Not sure this thread belongs in this forum, as it isn't a HERO System problem, but a fantasy problem in general, but I gather you are a bunch of experienced fellows and just maybe you would lend a hand anyways. If I'm wrong, perhaps a moderator could direct me to the propper place.

I'm in the process of mapping out the principal city location in my setting but am pretty inexperienced in this. I've relied on 3rd party maps before, but this time the city sports some really unusual concepts so I decided against using a map from a source book or similar and set out on my own. I'd appreciate any links to relevant tutorials or help for doing fantasy city maps that you can think of. I don't run Windows so any mapping software you have in mind must be available for Linux as well.

[Fitz]

Much depends on what you want to use this map for. Is it purely for your own reference, or do you want to show it to the players? Is geographical accuracy crucial -- by which I mean does the scale have to be precise?

Most of the time I find a crappy biro scribble on ascrap of paper does the job well enough.

[tkdguy]

What unusual concepts are in the city? And why not get a map from another source? You can always change what you need to change anyway.

I don't know if Campaign Cartographer 2 has stuff for Linux, but it does have City Developer. Personally, I had a hard time with the CC2 products, but that's mainly because I can't draw with a mouse.

Check out AUTORealm. It's freeware, and I think it has stuff where you can draw things on a smaller scale (ie detail houses and urban areas). I found it more user friendly than CC2. Again, I don't know if it supports Linux.

[grymlocke]

one of the things i've done for city maps is use a AAA road atlas, mostly shaded yellow for city outline, thick red line for highways, narrow black for streets---you've seen them?

simply change the 'red highway' lines to out defense walls (most city have a beltway...) a few name changes...dah-dah!! quicky map.

works in a pinch....

[tkdguy]

Interesting idea, grymlocke.

[Markdoc]

I've been using the same idea as Grymlocke with one refinement: you can buy an "atlas on a CD-Rom", which allows you to lift the image off the screen and into an image-editing program. I've been using "Street atlas of the USA" for about 10 years, but there are now similar products for Europe which would probbaly be better.

Nonetheless, as I understand it this doesn't answer the original question, which is how you design and map a city. Frankly, I can't be bothered with CC2 or its imitators - they tend to produce "samey" maps: I just use a crappy old basic drawing program for my maps and lots of people seem to think they're pretty whizzo. Any basic graphics program for linus should do what you need: sketch, LWN, etc. A vector-based program is essential if you want to produce maps for publication, otherwise bitmaps are OK. A program which lets you combine both is ideal.

More important than the specific software is knowing how a city fits together: that hasn't actually changed much in 5000 years. you need to think about how the resources (food, building materials, trade good come in), where the waste goes out, what (if any) threats the city faces and what resources they have to hand. You don't find wooden cities in arid lands, nor stone cities in fertile swampland. Think a little about the history of the place - planned imperial city will look different from a trading port that grew up to metropolis size over 5 centuries. The first will have parks and laid out street plans, the second will have an "old" section where the original port was and newer sections that grew out of it. Old parts may have been destroyed or renovated, and that will also leave marks.

Once you have that in your head sketch out the main streets, major buildings and the rest will follow easily.

Cheers, Mark

[caid]

Thank you everybody for interesting ideas. The reason I can't use premade maps is that the city is built around some major (and unusual) objects which will greatly influence the layout of roads and where certain buildings will tend to be. However, I'll be sure to use the city map idea for constructing other places in my campaign world. The Swedish phone company provides detailed electronic road maps of the country available on line (Swedish On-Line Phonebook with Maps (http://www.gulasidorna.se/?lang=en) , use the Maps-link on the top left), perhaps it could be of some use to you.

Fitz asked what I will use the map for. The idea is to have a large A3 (30x42 cm) map on the table when the group is in town, with all the known places marked out together with the major streets. From my limited experience, this tend to give the players a much better feel for the place than if you just describe eveything to them. I'll use a less fancy but more detailed map for myself.

For now, I've ruthlessly stolen a few available maps from the internet and am trying to learn a few techniques from these. I never imagined it could be so hard to draw a four-sided box so that it looks good. :)

[Talon]

Like Markdoc, I use a vector-based draw program for my maps, and have for many years. I'm no master artist, but I've acquired enough skill to do fairly decent maps.

For the kind of city map you're talking about, I will generally sketch the overall layout of the city (sometimes on the computer, sometimes on paper and then scanned), then refine it within the draw program so that it looks pretty. This usually includes walls, gates, major roads, castles, main trade districts, temples, and terrain features. Then, I create a repeating pattern of random-looking buildings, copy and paste it next to itself, rotate it, and place it in the background so the whole city looks "populated". The end result is something like the enclosed graphic.

[lemming]

Talon's got some nice ideas. And since you're on Linux, use the GIMP for your image editing. Layers would probably be the best way to go. Of course, I haven't done much in mapping, but this is where I'd start.

[BlackSword]

I haven't done a lot of mapping recently, but typically I start with pencil and paper and freehand it. Start to refine it to give the area details I am interested in and then begin to finalize it. I haven't made any maps on the computer, but I would probably move it from paper to computer by using a scanner (I have always had a hard time drawing on the computer using a mouse). If you start with a basic outline and a few major landmarks then you could use a program like GIMP to add layers which could be removed to make a GM map and a different Player map.

[Killer Shrike]

I freehand maps on paper generally, but every now and then Ill freehand a simple map with an airbrush tool in Adobe.

Mapping techniques of the Ancient World were fairly poor and crude by modern standards, so all the glitz and glam of a CG map is out of period any way {tongue in cheek}

[caid]

I appreciate all the good advice given here! I've done a bit of mapping using Gimp in the past with rather good results. Only problem is that those maps tend to look "too clean" for a fantasy campaign. Despite the usefulness of layers, I've decided to go to paper and pencil, just for the look and feel.

I've decided to scetch the city contours on a A3 paper and the photocopy it a few times. I'll use one copy to fill in the details for the players and the rest will be for me to do reference stuff on.

[Killer Shrike]

I appreciate all the good advice given here! I've done a bit of mapping using Gimp in the past with rather good results. Only problem is that those maps tend to look "too clean" for a fantasy campaign. Despite the usefulness of layers, I've decided to go to paper and pencil, just for the look and feel.

I've decided to scetch the city contours on a A3 paper and the photocopy it a few times. I'll use one copy to fill in the details for the players and the rest will be for me to do reference stuff on.

Rather than photocopying a lot, just print it on "Parchment" quality bond paper and then ball it up for some crinkles, maybe dog ear the corners a bit. I dont recommend tea-staining or burning as a) its unnecessary and b) it makes them hard to store and handle.

If you really really really want a more authentic feel, just get some brown ink from an art supply store and an ink brush, and just give the top a single undilluted pass and daub the whole layer quickly with a single paper towel sheet laid flat over it. Try not to smear, just "stamp it" with the paper towel to get the excess off.