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Blue
Dec 14th, '04, 02:30 PM
A player came up with this concept and I think it's kind of neat so I'm thinking about how to make it work.

So far my builds on this have been fairly costly (I don't have them in front of me or I'd post them). So I'm going to give you the effect and you tell me what you'd suggest...

------

The character is essentially a spirit. Each day when they appear to the super-team they show up looking like someone completely different. Basically they appear as the nearest freshly dead body, because they have taken over that vacant husk. But each day the body deteriorates enough that they have to inhabit a new one.

Picture the characters getting their morning briefing and a total stranger walks in. It's a police woman with an obvious bullet wound that has stopped bleeding. The're extremely pale and they take a seat at conference table.

"Good Morning, Anostopheles," the team leaders says. "Well, at least all you're body parts are present today."

-------

Naturally this will wreak havoc on base security (as the hero has different voice & finger prints every day when they they show up for work). But all that aside, how do I build this simple but entertaining effect.

I tried it as: Shapeshift, requires a material component (Newly deceased body), no conscious control (because the whacky GM comes up with the resulting form), happens once a day. Most physical stats would be in a characteristics pool with similar limitations.

Tricky part is that it has to be linked to a teleport of some kind to get them to the nearest body. That makes it more expensive for a simple special effect-type power, and it's hard to get a TP to work blind and to a source you aren't even aware of.

Is there a better build? Am I better off just making the characteristic pool and giving a free ride on all the body-changing stuff, just giving a limitation that the body slowly deteriorates and only resets between adventures or something like that (So she doesn't wind up getting out of a Viper prison by simply suiciding).

Trebuchet
Dec 14th, '04, 02:44 PM
I'd just handwave this as a special effect. After all, a new body every day is going to be as much a problem as a boon. Sometimes an old man, sometimes a child. The commonality should be that the body is always clearly dead to anyone who makes an INT roll or has mystic senses.

As for identification, perhaps a special ring with an encrypted ID chip that the character picks up from its hiding place before he goes to HQ...

CrosshairCollie
Dec 14th, '04, 02:44 PM
Always On Inherent Desolidification with TK, Affects Real World, only to animate corpses?

Blue
Dec 14th, '04, 02:48 PM
Hmm. It occurs to me I can make it a susceptability that harms stats; Only healable with the presence of another body; At which point the transformation takes place.

That's brutal though. It puts heroes in the position of needing to find a dead body to save the character. If they're on a long adventure they'd have to think about offing someone to make room for her soul. But mechanically it kind of works.

Victim
Dec 14th, '04, 02:50 PM
Distinctive features: always some type of dead body.

Blue
Dec 14th, '04, 02:50 PM
Always On Inherent Desolidification with TK, Affects Real World, only to animate corpses?
The character would never be in any danger (unless all the villains carried "affects desolid" weapons.

Blue
Dec 14th, '04, 02:54 PM
Distinctive features: always some type of dead body.
Well, it would certainly leave the character all their points to work with. It's just not as close to what the character wanted as I'd like. But it may come down to this.

CrosshairCollie
Dec 14th, '04, 03:05 PM
The character would never be in any danger (unless all the villains carried "affects desolid" weapons.

Maybe put Feedback on the TK to simulate the possession?

Blue Jogger
Dec 14th, '04, 03:34 PM
10........Physical Limitation: Spirit, Every day is drag against its will to the nearest dead body and forced to animate it. (Freq, Slightly)
15........Distinctive Features: Dead Body (Conceal w/Effort, Major)

Then the 25 points should be enough to buy 61 points of Shaprshift with NCC (20 points)

Lightray
Dec 14th, '04, 05:00 PM
If the character can't actually use this quirk to do something, then it's not a Power.

You need to figure out what being in a different dead body does, how it benefits (or hinders) the character.

Character can't be traced by mundane methods? Perk: Anonymity

Enemies can't tell which person the character is this time? Shapeshift.

The character can pose as another person (i.e., as the dead body)? Shapeshift. or maybe some variation of Perk: Deep Cover. and really high Disguise and Mimicry skill rolls.

Being in someone else's dead body going to cause the character problems (i.e., how is the dead guy's family going to feel about the character using - or abusing - his body?)? Disadvantage: Hunted or DNPC or Social Limitation.

Hyper-Man
Dec 14th, '04, 05:32 PM
This sounds an awful lot like DC comics's Deadman who is a ghost (Persistent Desolidification AND Invisibility) who can temporarily take over the body (but not the mind) of a living person. I think his real name was Boston Brand and he was a circus trapeze artist so he has incredible DEX and Acrobatic skills that go with him into whatever body he posseses. Seems like the possesion part is just a special effect of his ability to affect solid (+2). I can't remember if Deadman can use this power to take over just anyone like Jericho of the 80's era Teen Titans though.

HM

Derek Hiemforth
Dec 14th, '04, 06:09 PM
I think we're getting ahead of ourselves. Is it possible to permanently kill this character if there is no dead body nearby to inhabit, or is it just assumed that he will inhabit the nearest dead body (even if it's some distance away)?

If the latter, then forget about building the whole effect of getting a body. It's just a Phys Lim or something (Character begins each day at the location of the nearest freshly dead body).

I wouldn't worry about Shape Shift or anything to change the appearance, either. Since the character has no choice in who he appears as, he can't use it to his advantage. So the benefits of changing appearance (confusing enemies, etc.) are basically balanced by the drawbacks (possibly confuses teammates, makes security problematic, etc.) Just chalk it up to SFX.

At that point, it becomes buildable. Buy the max level of CHA's you think he'll ever need, and apply a Limitation to them, "Only Up To Amount Possessed In Life By The Corpse du Jour". Alternately (or in addition) a modest VPP with the "No Choice In How Powers Change" Limitation can fill in gaps as well.

OddHat
Dec 14th, '04, 06:15 PM
Spirits are very expensive.

If the character can't move around as a disembodied spirit, and can't do this at will, it's a little unfair to make them pay anything for what is basically the SFX of a few perks and disads. However, one option:

Build the character as a ghost in his natural form, with no APW powers at all.

Now, give him a VPP, Cosmic, Multiform Only, Only to Inhabit Dead Bodies, No Control Over How Points Shift, Expendible Focus: Dead Body. Total Limit on the control cost = -3. If he's a 350 point character in Walking Dead form, the cost will be 96 points.

His Spirit Form will need a Detect: Dead Bodies at Range, and maybe telescopic, and Megascale movement to get to them. You should be able to build the rest of his Spirit Form for the 200 or so points you have left, as long as you let him put the Invisibility (always on) and Desolid (always on) in an EC.

Now, if his body is about to die he can try to "leave", becoming a spirit and droping it. However, he will still take damage, get knocked out, etc. Each body can have the same skill set, and a fe powers reflecting its status as undead as well. If the body is destroyed with him in it, he's dead forever.

Guzalot
Dec 14th, '04, 06:20 PM
I'd just handwave this as a special effect. After all, a new body every day is going to be as much a problem as a boon. Sometimes an old man, sometimes a child. The commonality should be that the body is always clearly dead to anyone who makes an INT roll or has mystic senses.

As for identification, perhaps a special ring with an encrypted ID chip that the character picks up from its hiding place before he goes to HQ...
Sometimes the simplest solution is the best :)

OddHat
Dec 14th, '04, 06:35 PM
I'd just handwave this as a special effect. After all, a new body every day is going to be as much a problem as a boon. Sometimes an old man, sometimes a child. The commonality should be that the body is always clearly dead to anyone who makes an INT roll or has mystic senses.

As for identification, perhaps a special ring with an encrypted ID chip that the character picks up from its hiding place before he goes to HQ...

This kind of reminds me of a ruling by Steve about turning on your powers. If you turn on your powers by teleporting a suit of armor from your house, you don't need to buy long range teleport UAA; you paid points for your powers, and they just turn on. If you can teleport that armor back to you wherever it may be it's not even a Focus; at most it's OIHID or a Physical Manifestation.

So, yes, way agreed. ;)

Rapier
Dec 14th, '04, 07:04 PM
Player or GM?

If NPC handwave it. No need to go to the bother of the build.

If a player, design a basic corpse body (build it as an automoton).

Build the spirit as a computer or some mental stat only type thing. Give the spirit a "possession" type power (super TK, transform etc).

Blue
Dec 14th, '04, 07:29 PM
All very good suggestions, folks.

Gives me fodder to write up a few builds and take them to the player now.

Thanks very much :D

KA.
Dec 14th, '04, 07:38 PM
Regeneration: Healing 3d6, Resurrection, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Persistent (+1/2); Extra Time (1 Day, Only to Activate, Character May Take No Other Actions, -2 1/4), OAF Corpse (-1), Self Only (-1/2) [Notes: No Healing Max (see FREd p. 120).]

(So you Regenerate the next morning, in the new body, but you must have a corpse. Until you get one, you basically just don't exist.)

Plus:
Physical Limitation : Dies Every Night, Body is destroyed.
Distinctive Features : Undead

I would just assume that the Characteristics are held within the "soul" so that the new body is always the same, it just looks different.

KA.

Rapier
Dec 14th, '04, 07:54 PM
Regeneration: Healing 3d6, Resurrection, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Persistent (+1/2); Extra Time (1 Day, Only to Activate, Character May Take No Other Actions, -2 1/4), OAF Corpse (-1), Self Only (-1/2) [Notes: No Healing Max (see FREd p. 120).]

(So you Regenerate the next morning, in the new body, but you must have a corpse. Until you get one, you basically just don't exist.)

Plus:
Physical Limitation : Dies Every Night, Body is destroyed.
Distinctive Features : Undead

I would just assume that the Characteristics are held within the "soul" so that the new body is always the same, it just looks different.
Instead of the PhysLim I would take a Susc to time. Cost it out so that the
'body' will take just enough BODY to kill it in 24 hours. This would very nicely simulate the deterioration of the body. Might even consider some kind of END drain also to reflect how difficult it is to keep animating the body.

That would work well with the Healing Regen.

Kristopher
Dec 14th, '04, 07:55 PM
This leads to some very intense plot hooks, as sometimes the body will be one of a murder victim, and sometimes the murderer will still be there.

Will the character know how the person died, or will he be left guessing as to how and why?

Will the character sometimes be saddened or enraged by what she comes upon each morning? Imagine a him waking up in a small child's body. Or will he be hardened and unmoved by it?

Champsguy
Dec 14th, '04, 09:18 PM
Okay, I think I have to ask this question, because I honestly think it doesn't get asked enough.

How in the world is this a superhero?

I think too often, many Champions players get caught up in trying to do something "different". They want a different power construct, and come up with some off the wall idea for some reject villain from a Spawn comic or some escapee from the World of Darkness. I mean, seriously, the guy's power is that he shows up everyday in a dead body? No, that won't scare the kiddies. :no:

No offense to your player, but maybe he ought to look at a character whose powers are less gruesome.

Rapier
Dec 14th, '04, 09:35 PM
How in the world is this a superhero?

o offense to your player, but maybe he ought to look at a character whose powers are less gruesome.
Eh. To each, his own. It all depends on the thematic genre of the campaign. Maybe they are playing Spawn Hero. Champions doens't necessarily 4 colour. It could be Sandman, Spawn or some Hentai Hero...doesn't necessarily have to be the League of Super X-Bat-Lantern.

KA.
Dec 15th, '04, 12:17 AM
Okay, I think I have to ask this question, because I honestly think it doesn't get asked enough.

How in the world is this a superhero?

I think too often, many Champions players get caught up in trying to do something "different". They want a different power construct, and come up with some off the wall idea for some reject villain from a Spawn comic or some escapee from the World of Darkness. I mean, seriously, the guy's power is that he shows up everyday in a dead body? No, that won't scare the kiddies. :no:

No offense to your player, but maybe he ought to look at a character whose powers are less gruesome.

Champsguy,

First, congratulations on reaching 1000 posts in your latest incarnation.

Second, I agree with the "How is this a superhero?" question.
When I was first teaching Champions to my teen nephews, one of them kept coming up with a string of Spawn-wannabe's.
"I want to raise armies of demons that kill people!"
"And what exactly makes that heroic?"
"Because they kill bad people!"
:slap:

However, we did only learn one aspect of this character.
While it is a bit grisly, it may be that the character's motivations are more heroic, kind of like a silver age cross between Deadman and The Spectre.
I mean we havent' heard anything about RKA Flying Maggots, or summoning an army of zombies to tear flesh from the bad guys.
Yet. :eg:

And, even though you and I appear to have pretty similar ideas about what makes a hero, there are people who are really into the "Iron Age" stuff.

I think of it like a church picnic. They come for the fried chicken, but they may pick up a little gospel along the way.

As long as new people keep joining the Hero flock, some day, when they have played out all the bloodthirsty butchery, they may get bored and decide to make a "real" Superhero.

And then we've got them. :D

KA.

lemming
Dec 15th, '04, 12:28 AM
Okay, I think I have to ask this question, because I honestly think it doesn't get asked enough.

How in the world is this a superhero?
Depends on campaign tone and how it's presented. Somehow I don't see this hero getting the key to the city anytime soon or in a public type of role, but the character could be heroic without the traditional trappings of a hero.

Now if he took over someone's living body each day and discarded an empty husk at the end, you might have a better point.

Blue
Dec 15th, '04, 06:16 AM
Okay, I think I have to ask this question, because I honestly think it doesn't get asked enough.

How in the world is this a superhero?

I think too often, many Champions players get caught up in trying to do something "different". They want a different power construct, and come up with some off the wall idea for some reject villain from a Spawn comic or some escapee from the World of Darkness. I mean, seriously, the guy's power is that he shows up everyday in a dead body? No, that won't scare the kiddies. :no:

No offense to your player, but maybe he ought to look at a character whose powers are less gruesome.Actually, this is a "she" player. As far as I know she barely even reads comics these days, but she's got a decent sense of what's superheroic.

Anyway, this hero (and yes, I did dare use the word hero) is a spirit of vengeance, something dedicated to correcting past wrongs and curing the evils of others, and each time it takes on human form it puts itself in danger by risking it's immortal soul. It could wander forever, disembodied (as most souls that escape their afterlife destinations typically do) but instead it is so dedicated to writing wrongs that it puts itself back into the bodies of the dead knowing that if it dies there again it will be swept off into damnation.

What's more heroic than that?

Blue
Dec 15th, '04, 06:20 AM
Second, I agree with the "How is this a superhero?" question.
When I was first teaching Champions to my teen nephews, one of them kept coming up with a string of Spawn-wannabe's.
Well, okay, now I'm getting annoyed. If you guys like I can move this to the Hero System rules, thereby resolving any connection to what you guys feel "Champions" is. :rolleyes:

Thanks, great arbiters of style.

Blue
Dec 15th, '04, 06:40 AM
[deep breath]

Okay, sorry for getting all testy there.

Let me put it this way: I've got a player trying to think outside the box. How cool is that?. There's no chance I'm going to discourage her when I think this can work.

She's the player who shows up least for the games, due to work and family, etc. I plan to make showing up for a game as enticing as possible. And if a concept can be made to fit into my game world, it's going to. Because I'm having fun if they're having fun.

Lightray
Dec 15th, '04, 06:49 AM
I plan to make showing up for a game as enticing as possible. And if a concept can be made to fit into my game world, it's going to. Because I'm having fun if they're having fun.
Now that's superheroic.

Ignore all accusations that you're having badwrongfun. With comics like The Authority or Spawn that are so Iron Age they're more like Depleted Uranium Age, the "superheroic" genre can easily accomodate a character like this.

In fact, as a spirit of vengeance, she's right there with the Spectre -- who with the JSA would probably fit into the late-Golden / early-Silver Age genre insofar as mood and "feel".

Champions and superheroes should not limit you to playing characters that don't scare the kiddies.

ArgentLupe
Dec 15th, '04, 07:17 AM
So, because I prefer a grittier, pseudo-realistic campaign style, my characters are not heroes? Some of us don't like 4-color trappings. Some of us <gasp> don't even read comics!

I always thought what made a hero was a willingness to take extraordinary efforts to solve a problem, irregardless of personal concern?. Now I find out it's all about the tights.

Kristopher
Dec 15th, '04, 07:22 AM
I always thought what made a hero was a willingness to take extraordinary efforts to solve a problem, irregardless of personal concern?
Now I find out it's all about the tights.


REP!

Myrmidon
Dec 15th, '04, 07:31 AM
Personally,

I'd build this a vehichle type construct.....

Essentially the Character is riding around in mecha that slowly breaks down and gets replaced after each adventure. Sure it may be a new corpse but who said that vehichles couldn't be made out of the dead.

I'd then steal a page from cyberpunk and make the spirit buy a 'jack to run the vehicle that transfers stun and body damage.

So when your dead character gets blasted by with a nasty RKA from the decidely scared supervillian the body and stun damage after defences roll over and hurt the spirit like she's an occupent of a vehichle.

The different bodies is simply the SFX of what happens to destroyed vehichles and how she gets the new one which is oddly enough almost entirely the same.

Cheers, David





Is there a better build? Am I better off just making the characteristic pool and giving a free ride on all the body-changing stuff, just giving a limitation that the body slowly deteriorates and only resets between adventures or something like that (So she doesn't wind up getting out of a Viper prison by simply suiciding).

Kristopher
Dec 15th, '04, 07:32 AM
Now that's superheroic.

Ignore all accusations that you're having badwrongfun. With comics like The Authority or Spawn that are so Iron Age they're more like Depleted Uranium Age, the "superheroic" genre can easily accomodate a character like this.

In fact, as a spirit of vengeance, she's right there with the Spectre -- who with the JSA would probably fit into the late-Golden / early-Silver Age genre insofar as mood and "feel".

Champions and superheroes should not limit you to playing characters that don't scare the kiddies.


Some of my best experiences with Champions came from a game in which, without any collaboration, three of us showed up with characters that "scared the kiddies". I had T'Shenk (http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?p=541375&highlight=Kennet#post541375), who is posted in the New Circle thread (with a lot of added power). There was a guy who could change into an amorphous black blob and had all sorts of stretching and shapeshifting and a VPP. There was a guy who changed into a humanoid snake creature.

Yet they were all heroes.

We called the team Aegis -- the shield with the horrible visage.

Lightray
Dec 15th, '04, 08:19 AM
All very good suggestions, folks.

Gives me fodder to write up a few builds and take them to the player now.
And to let us know what she chooses, of course. :)

KA.
Dec 15th, '04, 07:50 PM
[deep breath]

Okay, sorry for getting all testy there.

Let me put it this way: I've got a player trying to think outside the box. How cool is that?. There's no chance I'm going to discourage her when I think this can work.

She's the player who shows up least for the games, due to work and family, etc. I plan to make showing up for a game as enticing as possible. And if a concept can be made to fit into my game world, it's going to. Because I'm having fun if they're having fun.

Blue,
No problem, really.
You weren't getting testy, so much as expressing your opinion.

Which is the same thing I was doing.

As you may have noticed, the next paragraph in my post started with:
"However, we did only learn one aspect of this character.
While it is a bit grisly, it may be that the character's motivations are more heroic, kind of like a silver age cross between Deadman and The Spectre."

And, in an earlier post, I offered a possible way to model this effect.

All I am trying to say is, I wasn't intending to insult you or your player.

And I don't really think I did.

I do have fairly strong opinions on what I consider a Superhero, but I don't think expressing them is the same thing as shouting down anyone with a different concept.

My strong preference for Blackberry cobbler is not intended as an insult to those who prefer Apple, or Cherry, or none at all.

I don't think anyone suggested that this character has no business on the Champions board, other than you.

I do admit to a somewhat kneejerk reaction.
It is just that usually when someone combines "superhero" and "graveyard" the result is not exactly what I look for in my games.

On the other hand, one of my first Champions characters was The Grim Reaper.
He worked at a graveyard and carried a scythe, but his main power was a Mental Entangle, so people would be more "comatose" than actually "dead".
And, as far as motivations, actions, etc. he was pretty much Four Color all the way. He looked scary, but he wasn't evil.

Much like the character your player is describing.;)

I guess both sides are a bit oversensitive to this issue.

I have seen practically every character and comic I used to read go further and further in the direction of becoming an amoral Iron Age bloodbath.

On the other hand, fans of Iron Age comics feel put upon by those who compare everything to the Good Old Days, even things that are meant to be original, and frankly, have nothing to do with what went before.

Not trying to prove anything here, but there is one point I would like to make about this overall question. I know that no one here has anything to do with the publishing of comics. So it would be foolish to "blame" anyone for what the publishers do.
However, one reason that Four Color fans can be a bit testy is this.
If someone is a fan of The Authority, or Spawn, or some other Iron Age comic, you are allowed to have those characters in all their bloodthirsty glory.
It is accepted that this is the way they are.
But, if you are a fan of many of the Four Color heroes of the past, you have to put up with them being retconned to fit the new mold.
"Oh, you just thought Captain Heroic was a good guy!
He is actually a fascist pedophile working for Cthuloid aliens that want to enslave the Earth.
You were a naive fool to believe anything else!"
It is hard to not rankle a bit at that sort of thing.

I drink Coke. Others prefer Pepsi. I have no problem with that.
But if others still got to enjoy their Pepsi, while all of my Coke was converted into Pepsi, you can see how I might be a bit sensitive on the topic.

I think you responded to what you saw as an attack reasonably.

I hope that I have done the same.

Tomato, Tomahto, I am more than willing to call this whole thing off. :)

KA.

Blue
Dec 15th, '04, 08:19 PM
Oh, I was just a little blindsided. I posted a request about how to do a power and when I log in the next day there's a rant about what's heroic and what's not (Like I hadn't been reading comics for 28 Years), then it was sustained. Suddenly I'm thinking "Don't lecutre me, help me with what I asked for", so I needlessly blew fuse. Well, not too bad. Just a little fuse. The one that powers the juicer or other small appliance.

I appreciate the constructive help that you and everyone else has offered.

bblackmoor
Dec 15th, '04, 08:31 PM
The character is essentially a spirit. Each day when they appear to the super-team they show up looking like someone completely different.

It's an interesting idea.

I would probably call it Shapeshift, 1 charge per day, no conscious control, linked to Teleport, same Limitations. It that's more expensive than you think the ability is worth, toss them both in an EC and shave a few points off that way.

Most of the side-effects I would just hand-wave as SFX. A player shouldn't be needlessly penalized for coming up with an idea just because it's hard to approximate it with the usual Powers and Limitations.

Champsguy
Dec 17th, '04, 08:21 PM
Champsguy,

First, congratulations on reaching 1000 posts in your latest incarnation.

Thanks. I didn't even realize it.


Second, I agree with the "How is this a superhero?" question.
When I was first teaching Champions to my teen nephews, one of them kept coming up with a string of Spawn-wannabe's.
"I want to raise armies of demons that kill people!"
"And what exactly makes that heroic?"
"Because they kill bad people!"
:slap:

However, we did only learn one aspect of this character.
While it is a bit grisly, it may be that the character's motivations are more heroic, kind of like a silver age cross between Deadman and The Spectre.
I mean we havent' heard anything about RKA Flying Maggots, or summoning an army of zombies to tear flesh from the bad guys.
Yet. :eg:

True. And you know, I could probably do something with this character. He doesn't have to be gross and disgusting.


And, even though you and I appear to have pretty similar ideas about what makes a hero, there are people who are really into the "Iron Age" stuff.

I think of it like a church picnic. They come for the fried chicken, but they may pick up a little gospel along the way.

As long as new people keep joining the Hero flock, some day, when they have played out all the bloodthirsty butchery, they may get bored and decide to make a "real" Superhero.

And then we've got them. :D

KA.

I'm just leery of characters like this. I've gamed with too many people who wanted to play floating balls of blue light, or abstract concepts ("I'm the incarnation of time!"), or yes, undead spirits of vengeance. I was in one game where a guy played a tiny little man who sat inside a spaceship that was the size of a half-dollar. His power? He'd sit on someone's shoulder and give them +30 defense (he might have had an attack, but I don't remember it). His goal was to not get knocked unconscious. I don't think he ever did anything during that whole game.

I just wonder how characters like these are going to save a kid from a burning building.

Lightray
Dec 17th, '04, 09:24 PM
... I was in one game where a guy played a tiny little man who sat inside a spaceship that was the size of a half-dollar. His power? He'd sit on someone's shoulder and give them +30 defense (he might have had an attack, but I don't remember it). His goal was to not get knocked unconscious. I don't think he ever did anything during that whole game.

I just wonder how characters like these are going to save a kid from a burning building.
Duh. He gives the kid +30 defense and pushes him out of the window.

You need to get your Munchkin-responsemeter recalibrated if you didn't see that one coming...

nexus
Dec 18th, '04, 02:22 AM
First off, I haven't read the entire thread so if its been resolved I apologize. I did feel I had a little to contribute to this conversation though so here's my 2 cents.

I can understand how both sides feel. On one hand, we have a creative, original idea for a character that isn't either blatantly silly, a excuse for a abusive construct or both. Those are pretty rare in my experience. But it is rather disturbing and just a little bit grisly. Its defeinitely not mainstream comic fare which is ok, not all games attempt to emulate mainstream comics. There's nothing innately non heroic about the character, but from the view we were given of it initially a certain gut reaction is to be expected I think.

As for the ability itself I would call it a special effect. Overall, the positives and the benefits, IMO, balance out or skew negative. Every now and again based on GM's fiat the character might be able to make some really effective Pre attacks ("You..you can't be...I KILLED YOU!") but think of the negatives. Consider how some reacted to the idea of a being that existed like this, now imagine the PR problems for the character and his team in "real life", the ethical considerations of a genuinely heroic character might have about "stealing" the body of someone's dear departed or how the family and loved ones might react to having the corpse get up and walk away to likely be abandoned (albeit accidently) Heaven knows where. Since I gather the spirit's powers don't halt decomposition any, there are sanitary and asthestic problems to consider. You may even get some new temporary Hunteds ("Looks like Carlos isn't as dead as we thought. Lets fix that.") I'm sure Blue has thought of all these and more though, just tossing out some ideas for consideration.

bblackmoor
Dec 18th, '04, 06:30 AM
You may even get some new temporary Hunteds ("Looks like Carlos isn't as dead as we thought. Lets fix that.")

That's a fun wrinkle. Weekend At Bernie's meets The Crow. :)

JMcL63
Dec 18th, '04, 07:27 AM
I'd just handwave this as a special effect. After all, a new body every day is going to be as much a problem as a boon. Sometimes an old man, sometimes a child. The commonality should be that the body is always clearly dead to anyone who makes an INT roll or has mystic senses.

As for identification, perhaps a special ring with an encrypted ID chip that the character picks up from its hiding place before he goes to HQ...This is a wacky concept and no mistake! Trebuchet has hit the nail on the head when it comes to approaching it IMO. I don't think there is any point in modelling the daily corpse thing as a power per se, this is the SFX of all the other powers of the character. Beyond this, what are we dealing with? It seems that the concept breaks down into the following elements:

The character is a disembodied spirit who can only affect the material world by occupying a corpse.

Being occupied by the spirit accelerates the corpse's decay so that fresh corpses are needed regularly.

Multiform is the power that comes to my mind here. There could be a basic spirit form. This would have to have desolid on everything, meaning that its powers would be expensive. Most of them would be unable to affect the solid world, though I'd suggest that some powers should be able to do this, because sure as eggs are eggs, sooner or later this character will end up in their desolid form because there are no suitable corpses handy to possess. The possessed form would be the other multiform. There could even be several possessed multiforms, representing different stages of decay if the spirit must possess the same corpse for an extended period.

Another thing I would suggest is that the actual powers aren't tied to the multiforms. What I mean by this is that the corpse possessed doesn't actually determine the character's powers, all the possession does is make the spirit's powers usable in the material world. There are several other issues I can think of that need to be addressed to get this concept to work, but that's enough to be going on with. ;)

bblackmoor
Dec 18th, '04, 07:40 AM
I don't think there is any point in modelling the daily corpse thing as a power per se, this is the SFX of all the other powers of the character.

Ordinarily, I would agree with you. The only reason I would take the step of making it an actual power is because it happens so often, and it happens at range. If the old bodies wore out slower -- once a month, say -- and if the transfer from an old body to a new one required that they both be in proximity, then I'd just hand-wave it as a special effect.

Rapier
Dec 18th, '04, 08:46 AM
Ordinarily, I would agree with you. The only reason I would take the step of making it an actual power is because it happens so often, and it happens at range. If the old bodies wore out slower -- once a month, say -- and if the transfer from an old body to a new one required that they both be in proximity, then I'd just hand-wave it as a special effect.
I agree. There needs to be some unifying power. Why? Because the Master of the Dead (tm) is going to run around with his Dispel Spirit and knock you right out of your temporary fleshy fortress of solitude. I wouldn't hand wave a SFX that is going to too juicy as a plot hook to miss.

bblackmoor
Dec 18th, '04, 08:52 AM
Why? Because the Master of the Dead (tm) is going to run around with his Dispel Spirit and knock you right out of your temporary fleshy fortress of solitude.

SuperBob: "Gasp! You kill Revenant! You fiend!"
MegaChris: "Um, Bob... Rev was dead already."
SuperBob: "Yeah, I know. Boy, will she be pissed."

JMcL63
Dec 18th, '04, 11:15 AM
Ordinarily, I would agree with you. The only reason I would take the step of making it an actual power is because it happens so often, and it happens at range. If the old bodies wore out slower -- once a month, say -- and if the transfer from an old body to a new one required that they both be in proximity, then I'd just hand-wave it as a special effect.You might well be right, in which case as a GM, I'd probably want to rejig the definition of the corpse thing to make it a simple SFX. Maybe replacing the corpse daily is excessive. There're lots of other things you could do, but with a concept like this, I feel that the main thing would be to simplify the execution to leave the whole corpse thing as an SFX. YMMV. ;)