Some more WG changes & possible bug

[RPMiller]

Sorry for all this work I'm giving you Dan, but as you may be able to tell, I am spending WAAAAAY too much time with HD and the WG. I think I have made it a mission or something ;) .

Here's what I've got for you:
Some minor changes to comply with the WG:

_General - Following parens in Skill Enhancers there should be 2 spaces
Absorption - Should read as Absorption #d6 (type(, to What)), Can Absorb Maximum Of # Points' Worth Of Type Energy. However, Maximum should only be shown if it exceeds normal amount.
Age - Age: (2 spaces) should be added to the Age text box since it will be a separate disad.
Aid - Should be similar to Absorption, ie Aid STAT #d6, modifiers/adders
Change Environment - Should be written as Change Environment #" radius, effects
Dependence - Not sure about how to express this one... the commonality should be the only thing in parens. The description is written out.
Endurance Reserve - Displaying REC: after parens even if all text has been deleted
Explosion - Shouldn't show anything in parens unless there is anything other than defaults if so, only show difference from default.
Extra- Dimensional Movement - Info in parens should be in lower-case
Flight - Noncombat multiple should be displayed without parens and as x# Noncombat
Images - Shouldn't have an x in front of the radius, it should just have the value
Martial Arts Maneuvers - There should be tabs instead of spaces between each column Name, OCV, DCV, Effect with no commas after each, and no colon after name and no phases, and no repetition of OCV or DCV (Will implement this in export template if you don't want to change the MA_TEXT, assuming that I can get the tags working as they should.)
Mental Defense - the word "total" shouldn't be inside the parens it should be like Power Defense
Reduced Endurance - Inside the parens the fractional value should not be spelled out, ie 1/2 instead of Half
Running - Needs to have the total added after the inches bought, ie Running +3" (9" total)
Susceptibility - If damage is instant it should read like 1d6 damage instantly and in lower case (actual time is uppercase), a comma needed after description

Possible Bug:

Requires A Skill Roll - Edits to name don't "take"


As always Dan, I appreciate you working on these items, and I think we are closing in on the end. Of course you could always say no, but I think you are too thoughtful and considerate, and intelligent to do that :D :rolleyes: :D Thanks!

[Simon]

1: Done

2: Done, to the extent that it will be (the text for maximum will read "Can Absorb Maximum Of XX Points")

3. Try actually selecting Age before griping on the format.

4. Done.

5. Done.

6. Dependence is currently formatted per the WG. To get the example in the WG, you would select "Incompetence", "Very Common" and "Addiction" under substance, you would type in "must drink liquor at least once per hour or suffer ". A little circuitous, but then, so is the WG.

7. Because the REC is a separate Power in the example that you're using. It is listing the Mods that have been put on the Recovery for the Reserve. If you put the same Mods onto both the Reserve and the REC, then you won't have that.

8. Done.

9. Since the options are "starting points" which should be edited to match the actual Power being constructed, no change is necessary here. You don't want "Extra-Dimensional Movement (Single Dimension, Any Location)"....You want "Extra-Dimensional Movement (Durnin's own, private Hell, any location)". Since you need to type that in anyway, there is no change necessary.

10. Done.

11. Done.

12. No there shouldn't. If you want this, you will need to do it in your export template.

13. Per the example listed in the WG:
<i>Psionic Shield:</i> Mental Defense (12 points total) (10 Active Points); OIF (Helmet; -1/2). Total cost: 7 points

This is the way HD is already formatting it. <b>With</b> "total" included in the parens.

14. Done.

15. Done.

16. That will be up to you to format on your own by changing the display of the damage to include the word "instantly" and clearing the text "Instant" from the time selection.

17. RSR has the display put together from the options selected.

[RPMiller]

First thank you very much for doing what you could. Second, I am not trying to be difficult, but Steve has continuously told me in my private emails to him that the examples in the WG are not correct. Ask him and he'll tell you. He told me that the character write-ups in CKC are per the correct WG. That is where some of my changes are coming from.

3. Sorry about that. I was looking at old characters I had made, and wasn't changing Age twice to get the new format. Thanks, and I don't gripe especially to someone that I am asking favors of :) . I honestly hope you don't think I'm complaining because if you do please send me a private email and I'll discuss it with you, again.

6. While your answer is indeed extremely close to the first example in the WG it doesn't work so well for the second. Also, as I mentioned above, this format is not what is actually being used.

7. Umm... I don't have any mods... that's why I thought it was odd.

9. Fair enough. (note to self, remember to think outside of box ;) )

12. I was afraid you were going to say that... :( That means I have to use all the Maneuver tags right? I had some issues with those, but I'll tackle them again later. Thanks.

13. Umm... no. I don't know what version of the WG you are looking at, but mmine doesn't have the word total, and neither do any of the characters in CKC. Also, as you, and I have complained about inconsistancies in the WG, this is actually one that is consistant. Once changed it will be the same as all the other "X Defense" powers such as Power Defense.

16. You got it. Again, I have to remember that I can change anything in HD. Thanks.

17. Right that's what I thought, but if you use a Skill such as Acrobatics, the "A" should be "An", and that's what I couldn't get to change except in post-edit of course.

Dan, thank you again for all your awesome work, and I hope you aren't thinking I'm being difficult because I don't think I am. I am hoping that I'm actually helping. I have learned over my many years that it's always better to have more than one point of view, set of eyes, and/or thoughts. Thanks again! :)

[Simon]

6. It remains the way it is.

7. I've build Endurance Reserves for tests....unless you have mods assigned, the only "REC" that displays is the value of the REC for the reserve (e.g. "Endurance Reserve (100 END, 10 REC) (20 Active Points)")

13. It remains the way it is.

17. It will remain the way it is, though I may take a look at it moving forward.

[Simon]

To get a bit more specific on #13:

Mental Defense is different from Power Defense. Specifically, the total is not simply the amount that you have purchased, it also includes the "base" that you get from your EGO. This base is only available once you purchase Mental Defense.

So...for Power Defense, the format "Power Defense (12 points)" makes sense. Since the amount of Power Defense is the total.

For Mental Defense, it's very different, however. "Mental Defense (10 points)" doesn't give you much. You don't know how much was purchased without actually doing the math. Therefore the format "+8 Mental Defense (10 points total)" is used.

"+8 Mental Defense (10 points)" is confusing and potentially misleading.

So...once again...it stays the way it is.

[Simon]

Originally posted by Durnin
If I may give an opinion? I'm not trying to change your mind, but rather give you something to think about for the future. Again, I'm not arguing because it goes without saying you will do what you want, but consider this:

I understand your argument regarding Mental Defense and see your viewpoint, and it does make sense. Doesn't it say in the description for Mental Defense that it will be the total of the points purchased + the EGO/5? Thus it represents the total. Anyone making a character using the Hero System would read the description and know this. Just as figured characteristics reflect totals, but there isn't a need to say they are the total. Are we not striving to make the output of HD match the WG as we have discussed so many times in the past? Are we not talking about a formatting issue again? Just as you have told me time and time again I will be responsible for changing the format in HD, and I accept that, couldn't you not include the word "total"? The problem is that you are "forcing" me to have the word total in the final output when this isn't per the WG, and forces me to have to once again fix it in post-edit. This was just my two-cents, and again please understand that I am not trying to be difficult. I'm simply being logical, and consistant with everything that we have discussed thus far.

Yes, Durnin, I am "forcing" you to have the word "total" in the Power's description. Since you want to draw the comparison to Characteristics, every single Characteristic has a "Total" column. Running is displayed with the total in parentheses.

Mental Defense will act the same.

Period.

I am NOT going to get into this crap every time I tell you that I'm not going to implement one of your changes.

I have done more work at your behest than for anybody else, barring only Steve. Let this drop.

Are the items that you're pointing out helping? Yes. However, you are one of a VERY select few that care whether there are two spaces or one after a colon, or whether there is a comma or a semi-colon after an Adder's description. So don't push things, ok?

If I say that something is not going to be changed, just accept it and move on.

[RPMiller]

Originally posted by dsimon
Period.

I am NOT going to get into this crap every time I tell you that I'm not going to implement one of your changes.

I have done more work at your behest than for anybody else, barring only Steve. Let this drop.

Are the items that you're pointing out helping? Yes. So don't push things, ok?

If I say that something is not going to be changed, just accept it and move on. Dan, I have never once taken an angry or bitter or griping tone with you, and I'm not going to here either. I am a very civil and professional person, (I have to be, I'm a teacher) and I have only ever wanted to help.

I reread my last post to see if I was being demanding or some such to cause you to be outraged at me, and I apoligize for questioning your decisions.

I told you before that I appreciate and recognize everything you have done "for me", and hope that you realize that I'm only trying to help you as well. So I am now moving on.

[JohnTaber]

Hi Gents: Sorry to jump in here...I just wanted to thank you two for finally making all of these changes to match the WG. I really appreciate it. :)

[Simon]

Originally posted by JohnTaber
Hi Gents: Sorry to jump in here...I just wanted to thank you two for finally making all of these changes to match the WG. I really appreciate it. :)

I'm perfectly happy to continue with any changes necessary....so long as it is understood that the primary purpose of HD is <b>not</b> to produce spot-on WG formatted output.

When I say that something won't be done I don't want to sit around and argue/debate about it. It simply won't be done.

[JohnTaber]

Ok. :)

Thanks Dan!

[RPMiller]

Originally posted by JohnTaber
Hi Gents: Sorry to jump in here...I just wanted to thank you two for finally making all of these changes to match the WG. I really appreciate it. :) I won't be providing anymore WG suggestions or questions. So if you would like please feel free to pick up the ball and run with it.

[Talon]

Durnin,

Some of what happened in here was just "Dan being Dan" (no offense Dan, you're a great guy and a capital programmer). I'd suggest taking a few days' breather...then come back and see how you feel. It seems just a wee bit possible that you've got a case of burnout. :)