Auto fire on an area of effect attack?

[Troll]

Would the rest of you let this type of attack in your Champions game?

4d6 RKA autofire, area effect one hex

Not sure what the player had in mind for it, but I thought it was a bit too much to combined area of effect with auto fire.

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

that depends entirely on what the armor level of the game is and what the attack is supposed to be, but i've seen worse. How much AF?

[Supreme Serpent]

Depends. Given that he could have instead bought an 8d6RKA, if that sort of power is OK in the campaign, maybe. But it is an example of advantage stacking that can get icky. Active points parity does not equal power parity/game balance.

In one game I was in, a character eventually bought a 3d6 AE Autofire NND. "Oh, he takes 12-15d6 NND" was common, when most of the other characters were throwing 14-16d6 normal damage. :jawdrop:

If he uses the autofire AE to hit different targets/hexes, I would have less of a problem with it. If he uses it to hit one person multiple times to try for a lucky stun mod or two, I would have more issues.

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

Depends. Given that he could have instead bought an 8d6RKA, if that sort of power is OK in the campaign, maybe. But it is an example of advantage stacking that can get icky. Active points parity does not equal power parity/game balance.

In one game I was in, a character eventually bought a 3d6 AE Autofire NND. "Oh, he takes 12-15d6 NND" was common, when most of the other characters were throwing 14-16d6 normal damage. :jawdrop:

If he uses the autofire AE to hit different targets/hexes, I would have less of a problem with it. If he uses it to hit one person multiple times to try for a lucky stun mod or two, I would have more issues.

autofireing NND is an ugly ugly thing

[NuSoardGraphite]

The effect the person with that attack is trying to achieve is an Autofire attack that almost always hits with multiple shots.

Attacking an AE you always attack DCV 3 (or 0 if adjecent) even if the target standing in the Hex is DCV 10. That way it is much easier for multiple shots to be achieved. Its also easier to hit higher numbers of multiple enemies as well.

I wouldn't allow it. Why? Cause the damage is too high. 4D6K damage is pretty significant. This kind of damage can instantly kill normals and KO most supers without too much of a problem. An Autofire attack at that level of damage can be devastating.

I'd allow such a construct at a much lower level of damage..say 2D6K damage. Dangerous to normals (agents etc) but not much threat to Supers with decent to high defenses.

As mentioned above, be sure to observe active point caps. They may seem limiting, but there's a good reason for them. 90 active point caps are a good ceiling for moderately high powered games. Anything higher starts to resemble Justice League...

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

yeah, i'd agree 4d6 is too high, 3d6 is high but not obscene and 2d6 is ok, then just get lots of skill lvls to add to damage if you need more damage

[Troll]

Thanks for all the comments. Maybe I will suggest scaling the attack back to 2d6 RKA.

[Supreme Serpent]

Also consider that the "SFX" the player says they want (multiple shots hit, so more damage) can be easily represented by mechanics other than autofire. "It hits you with five shots so it does 5d6K instead of the normal 3d6K" is entirely valid, like some of the speedster "million punch" type effects that are bought as one larger attack, not tons of autofire.

[Killer Shrike]

Would the rest of you let this type of attack in your Champions game?

4d6 RKA autofire, area effect one hex

Not sure what the player had in mind for it, but I thought it was a bit too much to combined area of effect with auto fire.
Not only would I allow it, I have allowed similar attacks.

Depends entirely on the genre.

[Dust Raven]

autofireing NND is an ugly ugly thing

Why do you say that? :eg:

Flurry of Nerve Strikes: HA +2d6 (4d6 with STR), AE: One Hex (+1/2), Autofire (5 shots; +1 1/2), NND (defense is hard armor, extremely thick skin or no nervous system; +1), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1) (40 Active), HA (-1/2). Real Cost: 27 (or 3u in a Multipower). Just think... up to 20d6 NND with a single attack against a DCV of 0...

[Dust Raven]

Would the rest of you let this type of attack in your Champions game?

4d6 RKA autofire, area effect one hex

Not sure what the player had in mind for it, but I thought it was a bit too much to combined area of effect with auto fire.

If you'd also be okay allowing a 12d6 RKA, then there should be to problem with this. Basically, those modifiers are multiplyin the base cost by x3, so as a guideline, take the most killing dice you'd allow and divide that by 3 and you'll have the number of AF, AE killing dice you'd be most comfortable with in your game.

[BlackSword]

Would the rest of you let this type of attack in your Champions game?

4d6 RKA autofire, area effect one hex

Not sure what the player had in mind for it, but I thought it was a bit too much to combined area of effect with auto fire.
Had a GM use that attack against us, but I doubt he would have let us have that kind of fire-power. Fortunataly it was the brick who walked into the room first, though my speedster probably could have dived for cover easily enough. It was enough to take one brick out with a single salvo (though I think the GM got lucky with one of his stun lotto dice).

Don't think it was 4d6 though, might have been 3d6.

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

Why do you say that? :eg:

Flurry of Nerve Strikes: HA +2d6 (4d6 with STR), AE: One Hex (+1/2), Autofire (5 shots; +1 1/2), NND (defense is hard armor, extremely thick skin or no nervous system; +1), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1) (40 Active), HA (-1/2). Real Cost: 27 (or 3u in a Multipower). Just think... up to 20d6 NND with a single attack against a DCV of 0...

I once made a *squeegie* which was an autofireing, hits 1 hex NND, for knocking out the driver to a killa-can (think a crappy mech), which the NND was being inorganic. So the can was completely fine, and we could just pull the stunned orc out, but he was so far gone.

[prestidigitator]

I wouldn't worry about the AoE portion of the Power. On something as big as this attack, buying enough 2-point CSLs with the attack to effectively drop just about any target to 3 DCV (minus double the number of Autofire shots, if you want to go that far) or less is probably going to be much cheaper in character points (not to mention End and AP limit issues) anyway.

[Onyxclaw]

I would also agree that it would depend on the game and genra. My current Star Hero Character would soak that damage easy. in adverage it will deal 14 body and that X multiplier stun per hit. It would stun Zekari, but it couldn't deal her body even at full value, unless her forcefield wasn't up.

also, since it's only AoE 1 hex, any sucessful DFC would negate the damage anyway. it the AoE was larger it would be more of an issue. He's basically just using it to negate DCV bonuses, but any character with high dex can still get away.

[Dust Raven]

I wouldn't worry about the AoE portion of the Power. On something as big as this attack, buying enough 2-point CSLs with the attack to effectively drop just about any target to 3 DCV (minus double the number of Autofire shots, if you want to go that far) or less is probably going to be much cheaper in character points (not to mention End and AP limit issues) anyway.

That's a good point. :D

RKA 4d6, AE: One Hex (+1/2), Autofire (5 shots; +1 1/2) Cost: 180 points

RKA 4d6, Autofire (5 shots; +1/2) (90 points) plus +45 with RKA Cost (90 points) Total Cost: 180 points.

A +45 is likely to hit nearly anything... unless they dive for cover of course ;)