C.U. alternate world, after "Independence Day"

[Ghosberr]

I am building a modified Champions Uninverse and would like input on my proposed alternate world. The premise is CU is the same up to 1996 when the massive Alien invasion occured from the movie "Independence Day". Many Supers, both good and bad, joined the fight to save humanity, yet many were destroyed (explaining the loss of many older villains/heroes).

It is now 2005, how well would the world have been reconstructed, what major changes might have occured as a result of the invasion? These are what I am looking to garner more information about.

Reconstruction of the world has paralleled that od Millenium City, on a world scale though. The alien technology was recovered/scavenged modifiying once again what was already a technologically advance Earth. Now however advanced tech is a more common than before. A suggestion was given from a local for either City States or MegaCities, ala Judge Dread.

I envision this as the same basic government structure, however UNTIL is now even more prominent as a world defense organization/policing force. The UNTIL space station is rebuilt under the program of FARSTAR, a directive to extend humanity into space and provide an adequate defense for future Invasions. An extensive Moon base has been built and a small base on Mars is also under construction.

This is my idea thus far. I welcome the many opinions and suggestions you all might have. Thank you.

[Major Tom]

If advanced technology that has been reverse-engineered from the ruins of
the invaders' ships is available, then one possible use would be to institute
a program of exploration followed eventually by colonization of any habitable
worlds. Assuming that there are worlds orbiting either star, Alpha Centauri
and Proxima Centauri would be likely candidates for exploration/colonization,
if for no other reason than to establish an early-warning outpost for human-
ity.

Another possible application would be to advance medical technology beyond
its current state, hopefully providing treatments or even cures for such things
as Alzheimers' Disease, cancer, or Level 4 or 5 killers such as AIDS or Ebola.
Extension of the human lifespan is also a possibility.

Improved power-generation technology also becomes possible, assuming that
the broadcast-power technology of the aliens can be understood and dupli-
cated.

Of course, the major application would be in the field of military technology.
While large vessels like the city-killers might be outside the ability of human
engineers to construct, fighter craft capable of reaching orbital space to
engage enemy fighters in combat are within the realm of possibility. Of course,
such craft would not be constructed with the Achilles' Heel that allowed man-
kind to defeat the invaders (their dependence on broadcast power from their
mothership).

That's all that comes to mind right now, but if anything else suggests itself,
it'll be posted.


Major Tom :cool:

[Marketeer]

I'm going to take a literal extrapolation from the events of Independence Day, and use it to present an absurd, if somewhat amusing, universe.

Ok, in one particular scene during the movie, a map of the entire world is displayed, with red dots signifying all the alien strikes. Most of the world is decimated, with major cities all over the globe vaporized.

HOWEVER, the area North of the 49th parallel is completely untouched. For some reason, Canada is unscathed.

By 2005, Canada is the major industrial power. With a plethora of natural resources, and an infrastructure-decimated US desperate for funds and finished goods, the trade balance between the two nations has completely flipped.

Further, due to the long and largely unguarded land border between the US and Canada, there have been numerous cases of US citizens sneaking across the border--since most of the Canadian urban centres are close to the border anyways, many Americans have tried to move to Canada, seeking a better life. This has led to tightened border security, which is causing tensions between the US and Canada.

Much of the rest of the world is also suspicious. Why has this one country been untouched? Where the Canadians conspiring in some way with the aliens? If Canada had some kind of defence, why didn't the country share it with the rest of the planet?


:eg:


PS, seriously, if you rewatch Independence Day, that map of the alien strikes honestly does completely ignore Canada. It's baffling--but in a Champions game, it makes for a good plot thread.

:sneaky:

[ghost-angel]

I've always assumed Canada's defense force consisted of 1 Tank. Just to say they had one.

apparently it is one HELL of a tank.


[too all Canadians ... this is a joke.]

[OddHat]

I noticed the Canada thing as well. :)

Canada, China, and to a lesser extent Australia are quickly becoming the dominant world powers post invasion. America has become a sad shadow of what it once was, its influence colapsing much as that of the UK did post WWII. Educated Americans are fleeing to Central Ameria, Canada and Asia looking for work, while most deal with perpetual shortages and a collapsing living standard at home. The EU constitution is quickly and strongly accepted (in contrast to the real world), as Europe pulls together to try to rebuild.

Since this is a Supers world, Gadgeteers start to carve out private empires, as their Science Cities become centers of wealth and progress, unhampered by the laws of petty, short-sighted "normal" humanity. Gorilla City reveals itself to the world, and Africa begins to become a far more attractive place to be under the furry guidance of Grodd. VIPER and DEMON start to attract massive followings as well, as their own organizations emerge from the shadows, offering hope for a better life.

Doctor Destroyer died in the war, when Jeff Goldbloom (the superhero "Fly Guy") used a laptop computer to hack into his armor's control systems and launch him as a living missile at the alien mother ship.

[tinman]

I think such a post-invasion world would see a sharp decline in nationalism and a new perspective on terrestrial concerns. I could see much cooperative effort to cobble together not only a means to defend the planet, but perhaps an expedition to try to find the aliens and assess their capacity for another attack. Once that expedition leaves effort would switch to building a fleet with which to carry the war to the enemy.

Supers would definitely be a critical part of all three endeavours, as without them the technological gap would be too large to easily surmount.

Earth's reaction to the crash-landing of the SDF-1 in the Robotech universe might not be too far off.

[Yogzilla]

Let's see... The Earth is now littered with *dozens* of crashed 5mile wide city-ships. The additional tonnage could have affected the planet's orbit. Even ignoring that, what about all the alien goop and such that's undoubtably spilled out an contaminated the crash sites; if not much wider areas.

The hard radiation from the mammoth mother ship that exploded probably had some kind of effect - - sterility, genetic defects, cancer, increase in people developing superpowers, etc. Depending on the nature of your campaign, it ranges from annoying to way nasty to genocidal, but it *must* have an effect...

Assuming the aliens aren't total morons (yeah, I know, a real stretch for the ID4 creative team), some of the more tech minded ones probably realized what happened, ran their anti-virus software, and set up resistance cells that still have functional fighter crafts with shields. The invasion was to get our resources (ugh; why that reason?? :( ); but now it's personal!!

Disclaimer: ID4 is a fun movie to watch. Whenever it's on, I get sucked right back into it and have a blast! But as soon as it's over I realize what a totally BAD movie it truly is and must rip it apart as much as humanly possible... :D

[ghost-angel]

The invasion was to get our resources (ugh; why that reason?? :( );
Because almost every human war since we came into existance has been over the same thing?

There's a whole can of worms I could open up regarding ID4 and the underlying premise of the movie (the eye-candy execution was rather ... silly).

But when you get down to it - ID4 was simply a Galactic Scale version of what we on Earth have: Limited Resources over which we constantly fight. Land, Food, Oil, Iron, Coal, Fresh Water, Cows, Whatever.

[tinman]

But the premise breaks down when you consider that they can either get what they need from non-inhabited places or grow it in their huge giant ships, or the habitats they could likely build instead of huge giant ships if they were so inclined (this includes the need for the biproducts of biological activity, such as fossil fuels).

When you consider that they obviously have mastered gravity and surely benefit from the amazing spinoffs that this technological breakthrough would entail then the whole movie seems like the equivalent of sending a carrier battle group to steal a fish from a guy in a rowboat on the other side of the world. Not worth the effort barely begins to describe it.

[OddHat]

Because almost every human war since we came into existance has been over the same thing?

There's a whole can of worms I could open up regarding ID4 and the underlying premise of the movie (the eye-candy execution was rather ... silly).

But when you get down to it - ID4 was simply a Galactic Scale version of what we on Earth have: Limited Resources over which we constantly fight. Land, Food, Oil, Iron, Coal, Fresh Water, Cows, Whatever.

"The Aliens came for our cows."

"One came for our sheep."

[Vanguard00]

But the premise breaks down when you consider that they can either get what they need from non-inhabited places or grow it in their huge giant ships, or the habitats they could likely build instead of huge giant ships if they were so inclined (this includes the need for the biproducts of biological activity, such as fossil fuels).

When you consider that they obviously have mastered gravity and surely benefit from the amazing spinoffs that this technological breakthrough would entail then the whole movie seems like the equivalent of sending a carrier battle group to steal a fish from a guy in a rowboat on the other side of the world. Not worth the effort barely begins to describe it.
I always had it in the back of my mind that the aliens were pretty much NOT an invasion force as much as they were moving from place to place in their every-present search for new materials to power their ships/homes. Having decimated their own home world they set out in search of new planets to strip. A vicious circle, if you will, of "we have all this power but need fresh/new resources to power it; to get the fresh/new resources we need we must have all this power."

Just my take on it.

[tinman]

I always had it in the back of my mind that the aliens were pretty much NOT an invasion force as much as they were moving from place to place in their every-present search for new materials to power their ships/homes. Having decimated their own home world they set out in search of new planets to strip. A vicious circle, if you will, of "we have all this power but need fresh/new resources to power it; to get the fresh/new resources we need we must have all this power."

Just my take on it.

The plague of locusts version. That would definitely make more sense.

[csyphrett]

A lot of things like energy weapons, terra forming, and artificial environments would suddenly be easier with their technology.

Of course since the aliens were telepathic, and did act like locusts, would there be another force on the way to earth for revenge, or following in the first force's footsteps?

Would they have enemies trying to stop them, or did they just pick planets with low tech?
CES

[Yogzilla]

The plague of locusts version. That would definitely make more sense.
Well, not really. If they were only interested in stripping the planet of resources, why were they so intent on destroying a major source of protein??

O, wait, that's right - - they were pale and weak; obviously they subsisted on Jolt and Mallomars... :D

[rjcurrie]

I've always assumed Canada's defense force consisted of 1 Tank. Just to say they had one.

apparently it is one HELL of a tank.


[too all Canadians ... this is a joke.]

Who do you think arranged the alien invasion in the first place? :)

[Trencher]

Really fast fighter planes! :bounce:
With forcefields! :yes:

[ghost-angel]

But the premise breaks down when you consider that they can either get what they need from non-inhabited places or grow it in their huge giant ships, or the habitats they could likely build instead of huge giant ships if they were so inclined (this includes the need for the biproducts of biological activity, such as fossil fuels).

When you consider that they obviously have mastered gravity and surely benefit from the amazing spinoffs that this technological breakthrough would entail then the whole movie seems like the equivalent of sending a carrier battle group to steal a fish from a guy in a rowboat on the other side of the world. Not worth the effort barely begins to describe it.
There are certain non-renewable resources you cannot grow:
Uranium, Iron (for steel), Coal, Plutonium, Gold, Silicon, Magnesium, Natural Gas (in quantities), etc... (lotsa heavy metals and some gases).

They obviously weren't too intent on working with the population of the planet, so destroying them is just as easy. I always got the impression they also had the Locust Bent to them, move from chunk of rock to chunk of rock removing what they need from each chunk.

ID4 Aliens: Move into an area they don't control, destroy the local culture and populace, take what they need, move on.

We weren't given a complete rundown on Alien culture - we have no idea what resources they were chewing up at what rate, if they reached a population density where importing (by whatever means) became required to sustain it, or if they even had thought about hydroponics.

Saying "Resources" is a stupid reason is silly.

[wcw43921]

There are certain non-renewable resources you cannot grow:
Uranium, Iron (for steel), Coal, Plutonium, Gold, Silicon, Magnesium, Natural Gas (in quantities), etc... (lotsa heavy metals and some gases).

They obviously weren't too intent on working with the population of the planet, so destroying them is just as easy. I always got the impression they also had the Locust Bent to them, move from chunk of rock to chunk of rock removing what they need from each chunk.

ID4 Aliens: Move into an area they don't control, destroy the local culture and populace, take what they need, move on.

We weren't given a complete rundown on Alien culture - we have no idea what resources they were chewing up at what rate, if they reached a population density where importing (by whatever means) became required to sustain it, or if they even had thought about hydroponics.

Saying "Resources" is a stupid reason is silly.


One other thing to consider as far as their resource management--it occurred to me that perhaps, for all their power and technological superiority, they had never developed faster-than-light travel.

That would explain their "locust" mindset and modus operandi--they strip a solar system of all its resources, then spend the next several decades (or centuries) moving on to the next star system. At that point they've depleted the resources from the previous system, and are ready to repeat the process.

Which means for us, while we may get a great deal of significant technological advancements from the salvage of the ID4 aliens' ships, a working FTL drive will not be one of them. But we will, at last, have the tools to personally explore and colonize our own star system.

[Richard Logue]

I'm not sure why, but the locust theory has always been what I had assumed as well.

Meanwhile, I've always wanted to run a Twilight:2000 campaign where not all of the aliens were killed off or disabled in the viral attack. When Goldblum and Smith are flying their stolen alien fighter in the mother ships' mother ship (the grandmother ship?) you see loads of the guys preparing for full scale assault. They're all hanging out in rank and file getting inspected by some stuffy alien general... And there are other ships moving about that are not of the "fighter" configuration...

The premise of my T:2000 game would be that many of these assault ships and soldier aliens escape the genocidal tragedy the evil President Bill Pullman (who, by the way, seems to be not only a hero of the battle, but one of extremely few world leaders surviving, and therefore the US is still A-Number 1 on the world scene) pulls off. While the credits rolled, what Roland Emmerich didn't show you was the massive amounts of troops in speedy little force-shielded tanks and battle armor stream out of the wreckages and making war upon the silly humans. And then there were the (smaller) invasion ships still in orbit commanded by aliens who aren't going to fall for the same trick twice.

Something like that could lead into a cool "V" style (the Michael Ironsides seasons) Champions campaign (or Twilight:2000).


Richard

[Kirby]

I could see UNTIL becoming a more prominent force. For every city that was destroyed, there's a space vessel that was downed. Recycling will have a hayday (or is that heyday?). I could see one of the alien ships being modified as a moon base, maybe two (one facing earth, one facing away). Another could possibly be UNTIL's new GATEWAY. With as many as were present in the US, I'm sure the Air Force would "fix" one to use.

I haven't seen the movie in quite some time, so I don't recall where all the ships were, but if you could figure it out, you could modify what's happened to the countries that had them.

If one was in China or India, they'd probably no longer have a population problem. If the one in Africa was in Rwanda, Somalia or Mogadishu, it would probably be left alone by UNTIL as local gang warlords would have fought over it (even if they didn't know what to do with it). Any in Japan or the US would probably be reversed engineered followed by lots of recycling to rebuild cities (a memorial museum of sorts would probably pop up in several countries).

There would possibly lots of new tech supers out there, though overall, it may not have a great effect on gaming other than origins and the occassional stories. Thinking though, it might be fun to do a game "the day after" ID, with possibly the heroes going inside a ship to clear it out, perhaps leading local military forces.

It does sound like a neat idea, though; I wouldn't mind playing in a game like that.

[Ghosberr]

I would presume that since they showed a City Ship over Iraq and Moscow, that other East Asia Cities were decimated also. Provided this was a Western World slant, there would only be so much time alloted, in the movie to show world wide coverage by the City Ships. Also if you note that during the preparations for the final battle, they do show a Chinese contact.

Reverse engineering was the premise leading to space exploration and a more unifed world outlook, rather along the lines of the UNITY campaign concept on another thread. Part of my question involves how might the city structure be rebuilt. I am looking along the lines of Millenium City, but with touch of the Judge Dread like Megacity incorporation. Ostensibly this campaign is based in the NW of US from Portland to Seattle, at least initially. Any ideas about how that might come across?

Thanks for the input so far, great stuff.

[csyphrett]

Cities would probably have broadcast power similar to the alien ships to run buildings, and public transport. Hopefully in more than one place so knocking one out, wouldn't knock the whole city out.
CES

[Kirby]

Part of my question involves how might the city structure be rebuilt. I am looking along the lines of Millenium City, but with touch of the Judge Dread like Megacity incorporation.
If you've seen Tokyo's Super City (http://dsc.discovery.com/convergence/engineering/skycity/interactive/interactive.html) on Discovery Channel's "Extreme Engineering," you might consider that as a new concept. If you're really feeling bold, Shimizu Mega-City Pyramid (http://dsc.discovery.com/convergence/engineering/pyramidcity/interactive/interactive.html) is another idea for Japan (and could be used elsewhere, of course).

[Hypnotoad, the]

Another possible idea: Converting the crashed ships into cities.

We already convert old warehouses and such into loft living, depending on where folks are located (and the problem with cleanup), this might be a viable and attractive way to house a populace initially, and the "regular" city can branch out from there.

Well...I thought it was neat anyway.