"Living" Hero

[TechnoViking]

Has DOJ given anymore thought about starting something similar to the RPGA "Living" worlds?

The reason I ask is because at CONduit (a smallish con in Salt Lake City) I had to wait in line for 90 minutes to schedule my Champions games for the weekend. The line was around the corner with all the people signing up for Living Greyhawk/Force/Spycraft games. People seem addicted to it.

I know DOJ is stretched pretty thin resource-wise, but I can't help but feel you are missing a opportunity to promote Hero Games.

Mike

[Steve Long]

We've looked into it, and it's not practical for a whole variety of reasons. That long line of people comes mainly from the fact that they're signing up for D&D/D20 games sponsored by manufacturers with a lot of money to throw at support and advertising, I think, not any inherent attraction for "Living" programs.

[Rage]

whats a living program?
Is it like a Larp?


*GASP!!!* HERO USED IN A LARP!!! no, wouldn't work. Or would it?

[Tom McCarthy]

I believe Living Greyhawk is a campaign setting run by volunteer GMs at conventions (under RPGA ?). There are several adventures set within the city, and convention goers use the same character at convention after convention, gaining XP and advancing the character. There's no small amount of bookkeeping involved to keep characters authentic and prevent the same character taking the same adventure repeatedly.

[TechnoViking]

Originally posted by Rage
Is it like a Larp?
*GASP!!!* HERO USED IN A LARP!!! no, wouldn't work. Or would it?

BAD IDEA!!! :)
Could you imagine the news coverage of the first person to fall from their wire that they used show they were flying.

Mike

[TechnoViking]

Originally posted by Steve Long
I think, not any inherent attraction for "Living" programs.
Probably true, but I do think some people like playing RPGA style games and only play D20 games since there is no other option.

Mike

[BobGreenwade]

With Tom's explanation (I'd been unfamiliar with the concept before), I think this is something that Hero Games should consider -- though not with any haste. I actually considered trying to organize something like this back in the 3rd-Ed days. The various settings of the Hero Universe would be just right for this sort of thing, once they're fleshed out. With the great breadth and variety of those settings and the limited time and budget for publishing books, this won't happen for a few years. I say wait until this fleshing-out process is well under way, see what happens to the idea of "Living" games in the meantime, and decide from there. :)

[rjcurrie]

I have to wonder though, that with a game that is as character-oriented as Hero, do players really want to play in adventures that are designed for any group of characters whatsoever? Also, such adventures would be completely devoid of any real hooks for the characters brought by the players. Certainly, these would not be games that I would want to play in.

Personally, I think that Hero Games would be much further ahead continuing with their current program of sponsoring and creating Hero-based events (most of which use standard Hero characters and settings) for major conventions. Such events with pre-generated characters can be designed specifically for those characters which, in my mind, yields a much more satisfying game.

[BobGreenwade]

Originally posted by rjcurrie
I have to wonder though, that with a game that is as character-oriented as Hero, do players really want to play in adventures that are designed for any group of characters whatsoever? Also, such adventures would be completely devoid of any real hooks for the characters brought by the players. Certainly, these would not be games that I would want to play in.

Personally, I think that Hero Games would be much further ahead continuing with their current program of sponsoring and creating Hero-based events (most of which use standard Hero characters and settings) for major conventions. Such events with pre-generated characters can be designed specifically for those characters which, in my mind, yields a much more satisfying game. Not untrue at all. This is another good reason to leave this on the back burner for a few years -- though I'd still leave the eventual possibility open.

[Crimson-Hawk]

Originally posted by Mike Basinger
BAD IDEA!!! :)
Could you imagine the news coverage of the first person to fall from their wire that they used show they were flying.

Mike

Well, considering that most game company sanctioned LARP games follow a strict (and I mean strict) code of no touching, no weapons, and NO STUNTS, I seriously doubt such news coverage will ever happen. Most supernatural effects or statuses are indicated by how the player places his hands in respect to his body (crossing his arms across his chest to indicate he is invisible and so on).

However, that being said, it might indeed be difficult to make a Champions LARP. The obstacle isn't the concept of "Live Action." The obstacle is resolving skill checks, attack rolls, and damage rolls in a LARP environment. Needless to say, carrying around 16d6 and rolling them on the spot when you're walking around and play-acting your character is difficult in the least.

So, to transform Champions into a LARP, an alternative rules system, one less dice oriented, would have to be developed. A difficult undertaking, but a possible one.

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Crimson-Hawk
So, to transform Champions into a LARP, an alternative rules system, one less dice oriented, would have to be developed. A difficult undertaking, but a possible one.

No disrespect intended, but why?

The whole point of Champions is that you play it with Hero system. There are alot of games where the world setting is the draw, this isn't one of them.

I love Dr. Destroyer and Mechanon as much as the next guy but when was the last time you heard anybody ask for Heros Unlimited stats for Firewing?

Larping is good, but tabletop concepts usually don't translate well. A Superheroic Larp would be great, but I wouldn't call it Champions.

[BobGreenwade]

Originally posted by Crimson-Hawk
So, to transform Champions into a LARP, an alternative rules system, one less dice oriented, would have to be developed. A difficult undertaking, but a possible one. Go take a look at issue #1 of Digital Hero. :D

[MarkusDark]

I know that Dreams of Deidre, a LARP group that runs games at Cons out here in the Bay Area, produced a 'Dark Champions' LARP at the last DunDraCon. I so wanted to play it but apparently, if you knew who were the GM's, you got into the game. So I don't know how well it went.

[allen]

Originally posted by Crimson-Hawk
... to transform Champions into a LARP, an alternative rules system, one less dice oriented, would have to be developed. A difficult undertaking, but a possible one.
[emphasis mine]

au contraire, mon frere!

if you look here: http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4078&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

you will notice that I carry around dice in my pocket 'just in case'! all I would require is a flat surface to roll them on...

[TheEmerged]

As I understand it, the "Living" campaigns are basically an attempt to run an MMOG with humans instead of servers...

[Rage]

Larps are alot of fun and I think a hero LARP could be done, but what is the point? I mean the source material isn't that well known and there are much freindlier Larping systems out there.

[highlander61]

Originally posted by BobGreenwade
With Tom's explanation (I'd been unfamiliar with the concept before), I think this is something that Hero Games should consider -- though not with any haste. I actually considered trying to organize something like this back in the 3rd-Ed days. The various settings of the Hero Universe would be just right for this sort of thing, once they're fleshed out. With the great breadth and variety of those settings and the limited time and budget for publishing books, this won't happen for a few years. I say wait until this fleshing-out process is well under way, see what happens to the idea of "Living" games in the meantime, and decide from there. :)

I have played HERO system in the past and currently play Living Greyhawk. There is no alternative to it right now. Hero Games is missing a great opportunity. The campaign administration is done by volunteers who maintain the campaign setting and adjuduicate rules effects and disputes. It acts as a great selling point for the D&D books. All that would need to be done is a group of players get together, develop a setting, decide on some guidelines, develop some adventure plot lines, get approval from Steve et.al. and pick a forum to premier (i.e. a convention) and bam you are there.

Hero Games can be as much or as little involved as they chose and thier time investment would be nominal and would reap great rewards in terms of increased sales. While that may seem a bit crass to some of you - the plain fact is, Hero Games people do this to be able to make money to be able to buy things (like gamimg products, dice and pizza :D ).

So this is a good idea that should not be put off too long. There is a certain window that you have to hit and it only has a few short years before it becomes closed to new entrants.

BWS

P.S.
Forgive my spelling. I am better at calculus than english.

[GreyGuardian]

for a decent explanation of Living greyhawk go to their website: Living Greyhawk (http://www.living-greyhawk.com) .

In a nutshell you get a person to run an adventure and people to play it and sit down at a table with dice and paper etc... it ain't a LARP usually... though some mini-larping can happen at special interactive events such as The Grand Dukes wedding etc.

I've been stuck playing mostly d20 since the ars magica game I was in folded. I've even been dragged into co-authoring a metaregional modual for LG (Shades of Gray) which has gotten very good reviews from the folks that have played it so they can judge it next weekend at Patriot Games.

The primary advantage of the living format is you get to play YOUR character and you can do it whenever you can get a group together to play or when you go to a locally run convention or when you go to a national or international convention.

With all that said, I am not at all sure that hero system is suitable for a living campaign because of the flexibility of character generation and design. After I get home from Patriot games I am going to start outlining a "mini series" campaign for champions. Ideally I will have from 4 to 12 adventure modules that take about 4 to 5 hours each and it will cover one overall plot arc with a bunch of subplots thrown in. I probably will set it up so people can play their own characters and will try and playtest it with LG players and other gamers I know that say things like, I really liked champions that would be cool. The until database is going to be a HUGE help, I was skeptical about the utility of the book since I have been playing hero off and on since 1984 - I bought it, I read it... darn fine job Steve.

I expect it will take me a lot longer than I think it will take... I know writting the LG module has gobbled enormous amounts of time. I'll certainly post results of the experiment after I get it rolling.

This all assumes that fantasy hero doesn't de-rail my brain back to my old fh campaign that has been on hold for a few years.

[highlander61]

Originally posted by GreyGuardian
for a decent explanation of Living greyhawk go to their website: Living Greyhawk (http://www.living-greyhawk.com) .


The primary advantage of the living format is you get to play YOUR character and you can do it whenever you can get a group together to play or when you go to a locally run convention or when you go to a national or international convention.

With all that said, I am not at all sure that hero system is suitable for a living campaign because of the flexibility of character generation and design. After I get home from Patriot games I am going to start outlining a "mini series" campaign for champions. Ideally I will have from 4 to 12 adventure modules that take about 4 to 5 hours each and it will cover one overall plot arc with a bunch of subplots thrown in. I probably will set it up so people can play their own characters and will try and playtest it with LG players and other gamers I know that say things like, I really liked champions that would be cool. The until database is going to be a HUGE help, I was skeptical about the utility of the book since I have been playing hero off and on since 1984 - I bought it, I read it... darn fine job Steve.

You have to limit the characters in some ways. Number of points, disads, adds ect. But everyone participating has to adhere to that standard. You give up a little of the flexability to be able to play your character in any modual.

BWS