Transformation

[CapnHowdy]

Hey all--

Like I've said, I'm new to the system.

If I want to make a hero that has to _transform_ into his heroic form, how would I do that?

If he can only use his powers in this form _and_ he becomes extremely grotesque in the process, how would it look on paper?

If the form only lasts for x amount of time, or if he can change back at will, could you please describe this disadvantage?

Thanks for helping a noob out!

[Lord Liaden]

Howdy, Capn! ;) Glad you could join us. I hope you enjoy your visits here.

Changing from one form to another can be accomplished in more than one way (as is the case for most things in HERO System), depending on the specific effect you want. The most common methods are through the Power, Multiform, or by used of the Limitation, Only In Hero ID. Multiform is normally used for characters whose second form has significant character differences from his base form: not just more powerful, or even very different looking, but with a different personality, Disadvantages, and so on. Essentially the second form is another person from the base form. The classic example is the Hulk, whose mindset is notably unlike Bruce Banner's.

If the character retains his basic personality, attitudes, and Disadvantages in his altered form, that's most often handled by buying his increased Characteristics, additional Powers, and the like with the Limitation OIHID. The character in "super" form is still himself, only moreso. Super characters often written up this way in HERO include Thor (when he had his mortal identity) and Captain Marvel (the "Shazam" version). The change can also include the character taking on a very different appearance - in this regard it's not fundamentally different from a hero putting on a costume and mask.

Note that OIHID implies the character has some restriction on changing his form. Thor needed his hammer to change, while Captain Marvel must speak his magic word. Some of the restrictions you suggest for this power can be subsumed into that element of OIHID, while others might be substantial enough to warrant a Physical Limitation for the character. We'd probably need more details of what you specifically want to do to suggest how to deal with that.

I hope that helps. If not feel free to post followup questions. :)

[Greywind]

Instant Change ~ Cosmetic Transform 2d6, Limited Target

Put a Continuous Charge on it bought to the time factor desired

Buy back COM, OIHID

Buy up PRE, OIHID

Possibly Distinctive Features as a disad

[Captain Obvious]

It's so nice to see you post inside our dreamy little world.

You've opened up an immense gaming resource by posting here, rather than on Steve's personal playground. I've done my good deed for the day.

[CapnHowdy]

Thanks for your help and quick responses!

I am familiar with superhero rpgs (Villians and Vigilantes, Mutants and Masterminds), but I just started HERO and I'm still wrapping my head around it. I've picked up Sidekick, but haven't bought the big 5th Ed volume yet.

My idea for a hero is Suicide Girl, a Goth chick that is powerless until she kills herself (discovered after a suicide attempt). Her powers are triggered when she dies by her own hand (not being killed by others--thus, she can be "stopped" from transforming). She gains invulnerability, life support, great HTH combat skills...other powers that you guys can suggest?

Anyhow, I figure that when she kills herself, her dead looks and body invulnerability (blows, bullets, etc. just rip chunks out of her) are disturbing to look at by others nearby. This is a disadvantage for diplomatic negotiations, but could be helpful for intimidation.

I think that I'll give her the option to change back at will (her body full regenerates and she returns to the living). After all, it's only the initial transformation that is a pain in the @$$...

Suggestions?

[Captain Obvious]

Damn, but that's dark!

Yeah, buy her powers as Only in Hero ID. I guess killing yourself is a fairly easy thing to do, so no need to stat that out in too much detail...if she can be restrained safely, she can't go into her Hero ID, and OIHID should cover it.

As far as being scary, but not very diplomatic, buy her some PRE with the limitation Intimidation Purposes Only (-1/2). This will let her scare the hell out of people with a Presence Attack, but won't let her get bonuses to her Seduction roll while she has gray matter dribbling from the back of her head.

Pure opinion here, but I'd say a willing change back to living form might be too easy. I'd probably give it a time limit, like an hour or two, or maybe set a return-to-living event, like whenever she sleeps or when the sun rises. These would probably be best represented as a Physical Limitation. What level of Disadvantage they provide would depend on the exact conditions.

[Vestnik]

The classic example is the Hulk, whose mindset is notably unlike Bruce Banner's.



The Hulk is just an excuse Banner made up.

"It wasn't me that forgot your birthday honey -- I was in my Hulk form when that happened! I didn't destroy that tank column -- that was the Hulk!" Yeah, Banner, right. You can't fool us all forever. :rolleyes:

Sort of like "I was drunk at the time!", but taken to a whole new level.

[Lord Liaden]

"Hulk not excuse for puny Banner!" ("CRUNCH!" "SPLAT!")

[ghost-angel]

I good way to go if you want the character to Change Back after an alloted amount of time is simply the Accidental Change Disadvantage. The trigger becomes the time frame you change back in.

As for the initial transformation. . .

I assume that her undead form has "full" body, stun and end scores as a Hero? (Otherwise, it's a mighty short game).

That means killing herself should fall outside the standard damage rules (after all, a villain killing her doesn't trip the transformation).

So really, it's a GM call, mostly a flavor concept. A bit morbid to start out adventures by going "Ok, I shoot myself in the head." or "I'll slit my wrists before we invade the VIPER base." This is something the GM should just let happen, without going into trying to have you actually kill yourself with dice rolls.

I would use OIHID Limitation as the mechanics for this.

[jkwleisemann]

Mmm... generally agreed (particularly on the Dark element), but I might also (as a GM) let it through as a MForm with Gestures instead.

After all - if you keep her from killing herself, she can't transform. OIHID includes that part, but if you went the MForm route instead....

Of course, if you go the MForm route... I might actually consider Restrainable instead of Gestures too. Reason why: Not only can you Grab her to keep her from killing herself, but you can make sure she doesn't have anything on her that'll let her to it to herself. She gets nabbed by somebody, and standard suicide watch procedures will keep her depowered indefinitely. Unless she beats her brains out on the inside of her cell, of course, she'd have to get creative to pull it off on a regular basis....

[jkwleisemann]

One Possible Build:

Death is Only the Beginning: 350 point MultiForm, Extra Time (Full Phase, -1/2), Restrainable (-1/2; must commit suicide, can be restrained by Grabs,and/or by having various implements taken away from her. Reasonably complicated, but anybody can do it with a bit of effort.) Active Cost: 70 points. Real Cost: 35.

It can, of course, be made more complicated, but that should suffice for a starting ground.

[CapnHowdy]

Thanks for the help, guys!

But how about turning back?

How do you put a time limit on the power? Say, if her body "heals up" and she "returns to life" after twelve hours, etc.? How is a power with a duration limit handled in Hero 5th?

Or does anyone have any suggestions as to how to handle the change back?

How would you make a power that let's you speak with the dead?

[Captain Obvious]

I don't have the book in front of me, but I'd say the "changing back" could be a limitation on the Multipower, if that's how you go, or else a Physical Limitation if you go with the Only in Hero ID build.

Speaking with the dead, to me, would be Telepathy, with Transdimensional to the Realm of the Dead. Or depending on how you set up the multiverse, you could put the "related group of dimensions" option on Transdimensional so you could contact Heaven and Hell, or Heavens and Hells to be more ecumenical.

[ghost-angel]

Thanks for the help, guys!

But how about turning back?

How do you put a time limit on the power? Say, if her body "heals up" and she "returns to life" after twelve hours, etc.? How is a power with a duration limit handled in Hero 5th?

Or does anyone have any suggestions as to how to handle the change back?

How would you make a power that let's you speak with the dead?

I would use the Accidental Change Disadvantage. The Change Conditions become a time limit.

As for talking to the dead, you'll need to know how the GM treats the dead in your game. It could be as simple as a Transdimensional Advantage on your senses (specifically hearing and speach), or Telepathy as Captain Obvious suggested. It could even be a Summon.

[Kevin Schultz]

Another way to do "duration" powers is by using a Continuous Recoverable Charge, I believe:

ie, Multiform, 350 point - restrainable (must kill self), 1 Continuous Recoverable charge (1 hour).

[Greywind]

Depending on how you do it, the activation should be a rather... interesting... Presence attack.