THE ATLANTEAN AGE: What Do *You* Want To See?

[Steve Long]

Time for another one of our WDYWTS threads. ;)

I'm starting work on our latest FH setting, The Atlantean Age, a realm of ultra-powerful magic and equally powerful heroes. Here's the basic outline:

I. A History of the Atlantean Age

II. The Peoples of the Atlantean Age

III. Lands and Realms of the Atlantean Age

IV. Life in the Atlantean Age (Social Life, the Calendar, Trade, and So On)

V. Atlantean Character Creation (Package Deals, Game Elements, Equipment, and So On)

VI. The Gods of Atlantis

VII. Atlantean Magic

VIII. Gamemastering the Atlantean Age

IX. The Renowned of the Atlantean Age (villains, NPCs, monsters)



So, allowing for that kind of framework... what do you want to see? Please keep in mind that I'm only one guy and have a limited amount of time to write this book, so I can't provide exhaustive detail about everything. ;)

[Supreme Serpent]

Looks pretty complete to me. I assume the 'Lands and Realms of Atlantean Age' will have a good bit of info on the city of Atlantis itself.

[SAVeira]

A 101 interesting uses for the mineral orichalcum.

[Spence]

Chapter X "Atlantis at War"

[Mirgos]

Quick question - would The Atlantean Age be for Fantasy Hero or Champions?

[Steve Long]

I assume the 'Lands and Realms of Atlantean Age' will have a good bit of info on the city of Atlantis itself.

Absolutely. In approximate order it will cover Atlantis, the lands of the Dominion, the barbarian frontiers, and the rival realms of Lemuria and Arcadia.


A 101 interesting uses for the mineral orichalcum.

LOL. I can more or less give you that right now:

1. Powering magical spells and items
...
101. Powering magical spells and items

Things like that. ;) There'll be a little more detail, of course, but that's the gist of it.


Chapter X "Atlantis at War"

That would in theory come into Chapter IV, but I'll consider breaking it out into a separate chapter. Thanx for the suggestion!


Quick question - would The Atlantean Age be for Fantasy Hero or Champions?

It's a Fantasy Hero setting -- that's why I posted this thread here and not in the Champions board. That said, given the power levels of characters in the setting, you could very easily adapt it to a Champions campaign, or make it a place your Champions heroes visit via time travel or what have you. They'll love it! :)

[Lawnmower Boy]

Somewhere, somehow, I would love to see homages to the DC "historic" superheroes --the Silent Knight and the [Golden?] Gladiator. Since Atlantean Age is supposed to be "superheroic" fantasy, maybe here?

[teh bunneh]

This may be beyond the scope of the book, but I'd like to see GM tips for running/creating your own super-high-powered-fantasy games in general, not just in the Atlantean Age.

Very excited about seeing this book. :thumbup:

[OldChief]

I've been sporadically working on this sort of thing using the old Aaron Allston Mythic Greece supplement for guidance. Assuming you're talking about Plato's Atlantis, I'd like to see information about;
1. The properties of Orichalcum.
2. Some detail about the rulers of the 10 "kingdoms" of Atlantis.
3. A specific bestiary (although other HERO products could conceivably fill the bill).

Will you be touching on the wars with the Mythic Age Greeks and Egyptians?

[Steve Long]

Assuming you're talking about Plato's Atlantis

I'm not (though certainly his version of things is one of many influences on ours). This is one of the settings in our Hero Universe timeline; it's been talked about in bits and pieces in books like Hidden Lands and Champions Universe.

[Shadowsoul]

3. A specific bestiary (although other HERO products could conceivably fill the bill).


Some new critters would be fun.

Perhaps some stuff on Atlantean Age specific artefacts? Covered in the magic section I guess.

An Atlantean Martial Art would be cool. How do you combine Western Magic with martial arts I wonder?

[Lord Liaden]

LOL. I can more or less give you that right now:

1. Powering magical spells and items
...
101. Powering magical spells and items

Things like that. ;) There'll be a little more detail, of course, but that's the gist of it.

According to Champions Universe, orichalcum also makes an "incredibly strong" alloy with steel, so there's potential for nearly indestructible weapons and armor, with or without magic qualities.



It's a Fantasy Hero setting -- that's why I posted this thread here and not in the Champions board. That said, given the power levels of characters in the setting, you could very easily adapt it to a Champions campaign, or make it a place your Champions heroes visit via time travel or what have you. They'll love it! :)

Will the characters be buying equipment with money etc. as with heroic campaigns, or with Character Points as per superheroic? Perhaps the Character Creation and/or Game Mastering chapters could provide guidelines for both.

I assume that "Atlantean Magic" will include descriptions and possibly stats for major artifacts. I hope that also includes more about the Janus Key.

Will "The Renowned of the Atlantean Age" include any Empyreans?

Regarding an "Atlantean Bestiary," many interpretations of Atlantis include magical experiments to create hybrid creatures and unique monsters, some later entering the mythologies of succeeding civilizations. A few of these would spice up the setting, and survivors could provide potential threats or mysteries for future eras.

Any chance that any or all of the Crowns of Krim were active during this era?

[BobGreenwade]

Well, obviously, Sharna-Gorak is going to be in this book.

I think it'd be a hoot to see an NPC heroic team who are a cipher for the modern-day Champions, kind of like the ancient League in the JLA's "Age of Obsidian" storyline.

This might be a fun period to have the Elder Worm try to make a comeback, so Atlantis may have its own version of the Slug and/or something equally ugly. But in this case play up the Lovecraftian aspect of it all.

Some other hints at other eras of the Hero Universe, like maybe a stranded Mandaarian explorer or a leftover Drakine, might be cool too. (That's mostly just a suggestion, though.)

Chapter V will definitely need to discuss where in the balance/mix between Fantasy and Superhero characters should be. By similar token, Chapter VIII should discuss the general "feel" of the setting in these terms. I'm only guessing based on impressions, but I gather than TAA will be freely mixing the tropes of those two genres, so discussing such things, even as "default assumptions," will have some importance.

[The Main Man]

Sharna freaking Gorak the mother-*beep*ing Destroyer.

Although to be honest, I kind of picture him being Dr. Destroyer with a fantasy twist.


I would be interested to see it feel like a true Fantasy Champions where it walks the line between genres in many important ways.

[ParagonAlpha]

According to Champions Universe, orichalcum also makes an "incredibly strong" alloy with steel, so there's potential for nearly indestructible weapons and armor, with or without magic qualities.


Is Orichalum anything like Unobtianium?

[Lord Liaden]

Is Orichalum anything like Unobtianium?

Well, only to the degree that it's like Kendrium, Destreum, Questionite, Kelvarite, Neutronium, and every other weird-@$$ fictional supermaterial in the Hero Universe. Carrying on the fine tradition of adamantium, prometheum, vibranium, kryptonite, uru, inertron, and their ilk. ;)

OTOH orichalcum has had a long tradition of association with the myths of Atlantis before Hero Games picked up on it. I'd have to research the exact origins of it, but I know it's been bruited about since the early twentieth-century Atlantis crackpot theorists.

[Lord Liaden]

Ah, here we go: Orichalcum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orichalcum). A much longer history than I realized, although the exceptional qualities of the metal are obviously a modern invention.

[Steve Long]

How do you combine Western Magic with martial arts I wonder?

Take:
2 parts Hermetic Theurgy
1 part Kabbalism
1 part misc. weird mystic stuff
3 parts Kung Fu
Dash of Aikijutsu
Dash worcestershire sauce
1 cup mixed nuts, chopped fine
1 teaspoon port

Mix liberally, serve with garnish

[Comic]

So.. mostly nuts then? ;)

Which leads one to wonder about Atlantean recipes, common life of average Atlanteans, what about their common roots might drive an Atlantean to the pursuit of high magic?

Was it because their grandmother raised them to believe in ancestral spirits protecting the family in wait for the descendent who would achieve ultimate mastery of the ancient family magical tradition?

Was it despite this grandmother, plunging into the antithesis of such primitive fables by studying 'true' practical sorcery?

Was it because their plush stuffed seahorse was stolen when they were a toddler?

Were they traumatized by almost being run over by the neighborhood bully's aristocratic older sister's riding tiger?

[BobGreenwade]

I would be interested to see it feel like a true Fantasy Champions where it walks the line between genres in many important ways.This part, I think, is key to the book. This is just an educated guess, but I think part of the reason for the dearth of suggestions and stuff here is that we're all having a hard time thinking in these terms.

What I want most of all is that the setting isn't just Champions in a fantasy setting, nor Fantasy Hero at superheroic levels, but something that neatly blends the two genres, easily blending the tropes of each into a cohesive whole that simply couldn't be expressed in any other way. So certainly we have high-powered wizards and sorcerers, high-tech (and/or pseudo-high-tech) devices powered by orichalcum, massively powerful super-threats like Sharna-Gorak, vampires, dragons, powerful demons, evil cults, eldritch horrors, and anything else that might suggest the two genres combined.

I made mention earlier of the JLA storyline "The Obsidian Age," and I think that would be a good starting point for ideas.

[Spence]

This part, I think, is key to the book. This is just an educated guess, but I think part of the reason for the dearth of suggestions and stuff here is that we're all having a hard time thinking in these terms.

What I want most of all is that the setting isn't just Champions in a fantasy setting, nor Fantasy Hero at superheroic levels, but something that neatly blends the two genres, easily blending the tropes of each into a cohesive whole that simply couldn't be expressed in any other way. So certainly we have high-powered wizards and sorcerers, high-tech (and/or pseudo-high-tech) devices powered by orichalcum, massively powerful super-threats like Sharna-Gorak, vampires, dragons, powerful demons, evil cults, eldritch horrors, and anything else that might suggest the two genres combined.

I made mention earlier of the JLA storyline "The Obsidian Age," and I think that would be a good starting point for ideas.

I think you have hit the nail on the head (except for the JLA part which I can't say either way since I have not read it).

I don't think I really have enough information to make any suggestions. For myself I am hoping for somethig that is not just super-powered fantasy types or just another bunch of high powered magi. I am hoping for a belnding of high powered magic and high technology. Something that I can not only use to run in the AA itself, but can port into Champs.

[Captain Obvious]

Wicked awesome ornithopters. Dolphin shaped Sea-Doos. High power energy wands concealed in writing quills. Magnificent steeds imbued with strength and speed by orichalcum enhanced grains. Flubber. Uplifted ape goons. Massive clanking war machines. Dinosaurs. A copy in my mailbox this time next week.

[Lord Liaden]

I'm in the same camp with Bob and Spence. I'm looking for something that straddles the fence between high fantasy and superheroics, and with minor adjustments could go either way and serve either type of campaign. I looked at Tuala Morn in hope that it might be that kind of sourcebook, but it didn't quite hit that note.

[TheQuestionMan]

Many many many characters and Package Deals as it is almost a new Genre compared to previously published books.


Cheers


QM

[Captain Obvious]

That wand in the quill thing was kind of done in humor, but thinking more about it, some high fantasy espionage would be pretty cool, especially given that Atlantis, Lemuria, and Empyrea (or whatever they call themselves as a nation) are superpowers in their own time. There could be nations that aren't part of any one of these, but are allied with one group or another, or trying to stay neutral, or playing one side off against another to try to come out ahead.

And there should be a package deal or two to come out of that, as well as a whole buncha James Bond toys.

[BobGreenwade]

That wand in the quill thing was kind of done in humor, but thinking more about it, some high fantasy espionage would be pretty cool, especially given that Atlantis, Lemuria, and Empyrea (or whatever they call themselves as a nation) are superpowers in their own time. There could be nations that aren't part of any one of these, but are allied with one group or another, or trying to stay neutral, or playing one side off against another to try to come out ahead.

And there should be a package deal or two to come out of that, as well as a whole buncha James Bond toys.Now, this sounds like fun! Given the intended scope of the book, I don't think we'd want to have too much space devoted to the idea, but certainly it'd be great to have enough infomration to run this kind of campaign straight out of the box.

[JmOz]

Imagine the He-Man or She-Ra show, but designed for a more mature audience, that is the style that I want...

[starblaze]

I was wondering when someone was going to mention He-Man.

[FenrisUlf]

A brief bit covering the usual "How does it end?" and "What happens next?" will do me just fine. Oh, and of course, I want some info on Sharna-Gorak and his buddies.

That aside I imagine that this book will contain everything I could ever want to see.

[Spence]

Imagine the He-Man or She-Ra show, but designed for a more mature audience, that is the style that I want...

I'm sorry...but my mind just cannot bend around a concept that uses He-Man. She-Ra and mature audience in the same sentence.......
:ugly:

My head hurts :(







;)

[Steve Long]

Clearly we're not gonna use He-Man.




We're gonna use BlackStar. :eek: :D

[Captain Obvious]

"How does it end?"

Atlantis sinks

[Captain Obvious]

The Masters of the Universe is a pretty good model for technology, I suppose, but whiny secret identities and silly names (not to mention silly characters) should go straight to the trash heap.

I was also thinking that science, magic, and religion should be all intertwined, like a sci-fi looking communications panel that requires a small sacrifice or prayer to use. Also the magic, IMO, should stray away from mystical sounding spell names like "Eyes of the Eagle", and instead use pseudo-Greek or Latinesque names like "Aetosoptikon" or something, maybe with the "eyes of the eagle" as a subtitle so those of us who think Greek rocks but don't understand more than a handful of words can keep them all straight.

I was also thinking that magic should be commonplace enough that there aren't anything like serfs or peasants in the more sophisticated nations. Gentleman farmers, sure, maybe convict slaves or war prisoner slaves, but to get a good feel of a magical civilization at its height, things should be all shiny and poverty-free.

[The Main Man]

I agree with the Masters of the Universe comparison; I knew there was something about it that sounded similar.

[Spence]

.

I was also thinking that science, magic, and religion should be all intertwined, like a sci-fi looking communications panel that requires a small sacrifice or prayer to use. Also the magic, IMO, should stray away from mystical sounding spell names like "Eyes of the Eagle", and instead use pseudo-Greek or Latinesque names like "Aetosoptikon" or something, maybe with the "eyes of the eagle" as a subtitle so those of us who think Greek rocks but don't understand more than a handful of words can keep them all straight.



Good idea. But instead of requiring a small sacrifice or prayer. Have them make things easier but they can be bypassed at need for a price.

Controlling the Ornithopter is easy and requires little inner strength when you have time and can offer the proper chants. A well chosen request will be heeded by the Ornithopter. But in Battle, time is of the essence and it becomes a test of personal power as the true Warrior bends the Ornithopters will to his own needs. :D

[Mirgos]

Maybe some ideas from Moorcock's Melnibone - a highly sophisticated & cultured society sinking into decadence

[Lord Liaden]

Maybe some ideas from Moorcock's Melnibone - a highly sophisticated & cultured society sinking into decadence

For the end of the Atlantean era, that could be a useful parallel, and it certainly lines up with Plato's vision of the fall of Atlantis. OTOH considering that Champions' Atlantis goes out with a bang rather than a whimper, it would add to the tragedy if they were cut down while their civilization was still in its vital prime.

[Spence]

Maybe some ideas from Moorcock's Melnibone - a highly sophisticated & cultured society sinking into decadence


For the end of the Atlantean era, that could be a useful parallel, and it certainly lines up with Plato's vision of the fall of Atlantis. OTOH considering that Champions' Atlantis goes out with a bang rather than a whimper, it would add to the tragedy if they were cut down while their civilization was still in its vital prime.

Mirgos

Excellent suggestion :thumbup:

Lord Liaden

The Elric world may have dwelled on the decline, but the blending of science and magic can fall into any stage of a civilization. Plus the liberal use of Demons in the MM style universe would definitly help explain "What went wrong".

[Old Man]

Atlantis sinks

Iceberg, right ahead!

[JmOz]

Clearly we're not gonna use He-Man.




We're gonna use BlackStar. :eek: :D

Thundar the Barbarian is better than both...

But I was actualy going for the style, that of a mix of weird technology, an almost reversal of Clark's law in reality, bigger than life heroes and villains & the idea of mysticaly powered heroes that copy to somewhat like super heroes...

[Markdoc]

Maybe some ideas from Moorcock's Melnibone - a highly sophisticated & cultured society sinking into decadence

Yep, Moorcock was what I was thinking too (though Hawkmoon, and Corum fit at least as well as Elric). Most of his games have "arcane technology" which fits the bill. that's what I want - world-spanning adventures. Flying cities. Castle-destroying sorceries. Extraplanar gates. Cults and religions of massive power wherein the very gods (or something that looks a lot like them) play an active role.

I'd also point at sources like "Black Moon chronicles (if you can get it in English: not sure about that) Lord of Light, even the first Amber series: there's useable material in all those books, even if it's not the sort of setting intended.

The trick I think to making it "not-champions" is in character design and making the lords (and ladies) of the world standouts. The heroes and villains are the focus - huge armies and fleets are merely backdrop and hired help. I would actively avoid the "superhero team clones". Not because it's a bad idea, per se, but because in-jokes actively work against the feel you want.

cheers, Mark

[FenrisUlf]

I remember that back when the whole "Atlantean Age" was first mentioned (in the Hero-verse FAQ), it was described as being something like a Burroughs planetary romance. That would work for me too.

[Labrat]

I really like the concept of the recent cartoon StormHawks where they subtly ignore all forms of electronics in place of power crystals (much like you're suggeting with the mystical properties of the o-material).

Although electronic devices are curiously absent, they still have advanced mechanics, anti-grav, motorized vehicles and power-gem-enhanced weapons. There's monsters to battle, bad guys to thwart and a dark empress bent on destroying the status quo.

I would like to see an 'advanced mechanics-without electronics' concept built in, or at least a side note as to the potential. Maybe you're going in a different direction but I can also see application to this in the other Fantasy Hero realms, like as a specialty for gnomes for example.

[BobGreenwade]

Oh, and if ever there was a fantasy setting for which space research might be appropriate, this is it. :)

If nothing else, perhaps there could be a research project with a goal of landing on the moon.

[Lord Liaden]

Oh, and if ever there was a fantasy setting for which space research might be appropriate, this is it. :)

If nothing else, perhaps there could be a research project with a goal of landing on the moon.

Wouldn't it be interesting if the Selenites on the modern Moon aren't alien in origin, but Atlantean? :dyn

[TheQuestionMan]

I really like the concept of the recent cartoon StormHawks where they subtly ignore all forms of electronics in place of power crystals (much like you're suggeting with the mystical properties of the element you're suggesting.

Although electronic devices are blatently absent, they still have advanced mechanics, anti-grav, motorized vehicles and power-gem-enhanced weapons. There's monsters to battle, bad guys to thwart and a dark empress bent on destroying the status quo.

I would like to see an 'advanced mechanics-without electronics' concept built in, or at least a side note as to the potential. Maybe you're going in a different direction but I can also see application to this in the other Fantasy Hero realms, like as a specialty for gnomes for example.
This theoretical technology exists in the Stargate TV Series

Stargate Wiki
http://www.stargate-sg1-solutions.com/wiki/Special:Search?search=Crystals&go=Go

Cheers

QM

[FenrisUlf]

OT, but: You know, for some reason I get the idea that the works of "maverick archaeologist" David Hatcher Childress would be just perfect to use with this book when it comes out.

[BobGreenwade]

Wouldn't it be interesting if the Selenites on the modern Moon aren't alien in origin, but Atlantean? :dynActually, I'd classify that under the heading of "Mind Blowingly Awesome." :king:

[SuperPheemy]

Give me Gods and Monsters, and keep 'em coming.

Specifically I'd like to see these Titans (for lack of a better term) have tangible threads that connect with the Mythology of the Ancients. Not so much of a "Zeus with the serial number filed off", but an extensive "proto-pantheon" which could connect nicely with Mythic Greece, or Egypt, or Babylon.

And I want characters to be able to challenge and overcome them. Storm the Gates of Heaven, bodily throw Titans into the Maw of Sheol. I'd like to be able to create campaigns that at the end my players can say "wow, I think the actions of our characters would be retold in Phoenecia! Or Assyria!

Real Myth-making stuff.

[Peregrine]

Give me Gods and Monsters, and keep 'em coming.

Specifically I'd like to see these Titans (for lack of a better term) have tangible threads that connect with the Mythology of the Ancients. Not so much of a "Zeus with the serial number filed off", but an extensive "proto-pantheon" which could connect nicely with Mythic Greece, or Egypt, or Babylon.

And I want characters to be able to challenge and overcome them. Storm the Gates of Heaven, bodily throw Titans into the Maw of Sheol. I'd like to be able to create campaigns that at the end my players can say "wow, I think the actions of our characters would be retold in Phoenecia! Or Assyria!

Real Myth-making stuff.

I think this is key. There absolutely has to be room for the PCs to be the preeminent heroes of this Age. (I'd say this for any setting, actually; far too many other game companies forget this "little detail".)

[Markdoc]

Wouldn't it be interesting if the Selenites on the modern Moon aren't alien in origin, but Atlantean? :dyn

Actually, in my FH game ..... they are.

cheers, Mark

[FenrisUlf]

Give me Gods and Monsters, and keep 'em coming.

Specifically I'd like to see these Titans (for lack of a better term) have tangible threads that connect with the Mythology of the Ancients. Not so much of a "Zeus with the serial number filed off", but an extensive "proto-pantheon" which could connect nicely with Mythic Greece, or Egypt, or Babylon.

And I want characters to be able to challenge and overcome them. Storm the Gates of Heaven, bodily throw Titans into the Maw of Sheol. I'd like to be able to create campaigns that at the end my players can say "wow, I think the actions of our characters would be retold in Phoenecia! Or Assyria!

Real Myth-making stuff.


I think this is key. There absolutely has to be room for the PCs to be the preeminent heroes of this Age. (I'd say this for any setting, actually; far too many other game companies forget this "little detail".)

I agree, but with all the flying ships and cities get wiped off the face of the Earth, this setting sounds more like something from Vedic India than Classical Greece.

[Lord Liaden]

You absolutely cannot do Atlantis without pyramids. The antediluvian civilization proponents pretty much agree that all the pyramids found in the world - Egyptian, Mesopotamian, Meso-American, and others - were inspired by Atlantis.

I don't just want pyramidal public buildings, though. Let's play up the supposed mystic significance of pyramids, with huge magic-collecting pyramids generating power for whole cities, and small crystal pyramids used like batteries. How about pyramid-shaped flying battleships?

Plato made a big deal about the Atlanteans plating the outer surfaces of their buildings in various metals, with orichalcum covering the most important structures. The city of Atlantis shining in the sun would make a grand image. :cool:

[Steve Long]

You absolutely cannot do Atlantis without pyramids.

I absolutely guarantee that you can. ;)

[BobGreenwade]

I think this is key. There absolutely has to be room for the PCs to be the preeminent heroes of this Age. (I'd say this for any setting, actually; far too many other game companies forget this "little detail".)While I agree with this entirely, I'd like to ask that the reverse also be allowed for. Sometimes I just want to be (or GM for) the second string group -- the heroes who deal with things that the big guns can't because they're tied up doing other stuff. I know that's not a very popular approach, so I'd minimize any text devoted to it, but it should still be fairly easy to slide such a group into the setting.

[Lord Fyre]

Okay.

I am going to go the other direction and ask for some ideas on using "The Atlantian Age" beyond the scope of the suppliment

(Oh, and smoking hot chicks - but I always ask for that. :yes: )

[Peregrine]

While I agree with this entirely, I'd like to ask that the reverse also be allowed for. Sometimes I just want to be (or GM for) the second string group -- the heroes who deal with things that the big guns can't because they're tied up doing other stuff. I know that's not a very popular approach, so I'd minimize any text devoted to it, but it should still be fairly easy to slide such a group into the setting.

That's easier to do, actually. There's always room for Jell-O, er, supporting cast.:D