Must use villains

[Dead guy on tab]

If you are running a Champions campaign in a Champions universe, which villains (from any edition) "must" you use to give your players the feel of the Champions universe. For example, I think the players should encounter:

Dr. Destroyer
Mechanon
Foxbat

i.e. which villains are "core" to the Champions Universe

[Supreme Serpent]

VIPER
Pulsar
Anklyosaur
Grond

[BoloOfEarth]

May not see direct use against the PC heroes, but will at least be known of in the universe:

Dr. Destroyer
Mechanon
Foxbat
VIPER

Edit: On the heroic side:
PRIMUS
UNTIL

[Log-Man]

Eurostar

[Kenn]

CLOWN!!!

The Geodesics.










What????

[Alibear]

All good ones and I'd add Firewing and Zodiac.

[Lonewalker]

My faves (some already mentioned):

Grond for the traditional rampage.
Foxbat to keep folks from taking things too seriously.
Lady Blue to show not all supervillains are bad.
VIPER for the quintessential villain organization (and GI JOE / COBRA jokes).
DEMON for the supernatural bent.
The Ultimates for a supervillain team. (Eurostar works too - for higher powered teams.)
Pulsar, Oculon, Ankylosaur, Vibron, Freon, Ripper, Green Dragon (and probably a couple others) as individual brawls and short threats.
GRAB for a supervillain team that you have to out-think.
Doctor Destroyer makes a great big bad.
Seeker for a superhero guest star (maybe the PCs can rescue him).

My two shillings.

Lonewalker

[CrosshairCollie]

I've been converting the 4e Dark Champions Card Shark guys into regular supervillains ... I dunno why, I just love those guys.

GRAB is a favorite, just because it usually means that the world isn't on the line this time.

[Sketchpad]

Must Haves?
Foxbat, Deathstroke (the full group), Eurostar, Grond, Doc D, 4th ed COIL, Firewing, PSI and Green Dragon :)

Mind you ... I've heavily modified these for my Champions campaigns ;)

[Mike W]

VIPER is a big one for me.
Grond is as well.
Firewing is good.
Zodiac.
Cheshire Cat.

[tkdguy]

CLOWN!!!

The Geodesics.










What????
I actually turned the Geodesics into a force to be reckoned with. :cool:

[Kirby]

If you are running a Champions campaign in a Champions universe, which villains (from any edition) "must" you use to give your players the feel of the Champions universe. For example, I think the players should encounter:

Dr. Destroyer
Mechanon
Foxbat

i.e. which villains are "core" to the Champions UniverseThe "core" villains will obviously range by personal opinion. For example, I've only used Dr. Destroyer in two campaigns. In one (4E) he was only a background figure and it was his son (the lower power version from Classic Enemies) that had more impact on the PCs' world. In the other, Destroyer was killed by an Extermination Squad during a V'han invasion.

I've never used Mechanon.

Villains I tend to use for the right feel are:

Bulldozer
Ogre
Anklyosaur
VIPER
Armadillo
Black Paladin
Rainbow Archer
Eurostar (usually mentioned in the background)
GRAB
Thunder & Lightning
PSI
Ripper
Grond


Others I prefer are VOICE, Seven Horsemen and many other groups and individuals that didn't make it to 5th Ed.

[Silbeg]

Ogre. Got to have Ogre.

He is the epitome of bricks in the genre, and has always been a good rube to have in the game.

Foxbat, of course.

Dr. Destroyer... well, he should be in the world, but not necessarily a force that the PCs will ever want to deal with.

VIPER is pretty much a must, as the arch-typical villainous organization. Great for background stories of both heroes and villains, and always a popular source of plots!

There are many that I have used over the last 20 years, but these definitely come to the forefront. Personally, I like GRAB (Cheshire Cat, Hummingbird, Black Diamond, Bluejay), as villains who are not all about combat and damage causing.

[Hermit]

Foxbat, of course, as others have pointed out.
I find I can not help but use Captain Chronos, he brings the time travel to your PCs if they won't go to it. :)
Mechanon is a must because you need at least one evil robot out to exterminate organics.
Teleios has become very important in working behind back scenes, as a possible hook for origins, and so much more. In some ways I find him far more useful than Dr. Destroyer.
Dr. Destroyer is the best 'classic comic book Big Bad', and if you are in the 5th CU just the fact he is out and loose shapes so much. I try to have his influence felt more than direct conflict until the heroes buff up.
Bulldozer is a great villain for letting the PCs have a good time wiping the floor with a punk that really, really deserves it.
Grond is good for the 'force of nature in raw strength' area, where as Ogre is a bit more sympathetic.
VIPER is the go to evil organization.
Oh, and Firewing for the Alien fix. An outsider whose culture is very different from the heroes
I'm sure this list will expand if I think about it

[death tribble]

For me I go way back to Enemies 1 and then from there.

So we have to have the good Dr Destroyer
Menton
Eurostar
Bulldozer
Grond
Ogre
Ripper
The Viper villains from the 4th Edition book including Brick
Rainbow Archer
GRAB
Genocide
Mechanon
Foxbat
Black Paladin
Ankylosaur
Card Shark
Cobra (but not the full Coil)
The Ultimates
The Monster

These are the ones I can recall offhand

[Silbeg]

Mechanon is a must because you need at least one evil robot out to exterminate organics.

Forgot about him... how could I forget about Mechanon? The world may never know.


Bulldozer is a great villain for letting the PCs have a good time wiping the floor with a punk that really, really deserves it.
Grond is good for the 'force of nature in raw strength' area, where as Ogre is a bit more sympathetic.

Yeah, I use both of these often... but I still see Ogre as being more iconic.

[Kenn]

Frizbee!!!

[Vann the Red]

I always end up tweaking and using the Geodesics. Love them for some reason. Rainbow Archer is fun, too. And how can you not use Viper?

VtR

[Alibear]

I always rather liked Mechassassin.

[SSgt Baloo]

I've always preferred to "repackage" the CU villains to fit my campaigns. F'rinstance Foxbat got modified from a crazy villain to a crazy would-be hero named Flying Squirrel who needed rescuing from his own heroic overconfidence. Eurostar became Eurostern, a Nazi-backed team of supervillains. Grond lost his extra pair of arms but gained a tail and scales as Dinoman, the reptilian beast-creature.

I also created many of my own villains, such as Übermann, a "what if two rockets left Krypton and one landed in Germany?" character. His powers were similar to Superman (250 point homage, in that game) but with really skewed values. One of my favorites was Anaconda, a villain who could transform into a 40-foot-long anaconda with supernatural strength.

I've always viewed the "as-written" Champions villains as a good starting point, but usually not appropriate to my campaign without at least some tweaking.

[pinecone]

Viper and Foxbat, those are "must haves"...

[Dr. MID-Nite]

VIPER, Anklosaur, Foxbat, and The Ultimates for me.

Rob

[bubba smith]

i wonder who the must have HEROES are?

[Alibear]

Seeker. :hush:

[SSgt Baloo]

i wonder who the must have HEROES are?

Why, the PCs of course! Anything else is just self service.

[CrosshairCollie]

I'm going to add Holocaust (5e) to my list. He's reasonably beefy, pretty powerful, though admittedly a somewhat stereotypical megalomaniac, but he's so versatile he can do almost anything.

[Enforcer84]

I tend to use the classics first; Howler, Green Dragon, Brick, Ogre, Shrinker, Pulsar, Mechanon, Armadillo, Bulldozer, Foxbat, Dr Destroyer, Apololypse (Holocaust), Eurostar, the Ultimates....

just how I role :)

[bubba smith]

Seeker. :hush:
whats wrong with him?

[Vondy]

PAID in Full.

[Legatus]

CLOWN!:hush:

No wait... There is none in 5E. Bah, what the ... I use them anyway!

[Sketchpad]

i wonder who the must have HEROES are?
The 4th Ed Champions and Crusader ;)

[Vondy]

The 4th Ed Champions and Crusader ;)

The Dark Champions version of Crusader who appeared in one of the 4E Dark Champions villian books is a must have. :straight:

The BBB version - not so much.

[lapsedgamer]

The Dark Champions version of Crusader who appeared in one of the 4E Dark Champions villian books is a must have. :straight:

The BBB version - not so much.

That was 4e Dark Champions? I thought that was some other book. Didn't he become Crusade and have a major meltdown?

[Vondy]

That was 4e Dark Champions? I thought that was some other book. Didn't he become Crusade and have a major meltdown?

It was one of the villian books for 4E DC. I don't remember the title of the top of my head. The book was presented as Crusader's rogues gallery through the lens of his lover who didn't discover he was Crusader until he stumbled into her apartment and [seemingly] died. The end of the book contained an optional scenario surrounding Crusade, who was his drug-enhanced but now psychotic disciple who [seemingly] killed him. I keep saying "seemingly" because, as I remember it, its not super-clear that he died. That's the tone-implication, but my impression was you could interperet it so that he could be permenantly out of action, comatose, or believed dead. The last chapter of the book was a scenario surrounding Crusade after the event mentioned in the opening chapter (where the new write up for Crusader is presented). There was also a psionic armor in the book that was motivated by revenge, and one plot seed the book included was that Crusader's lover might don the suit and go after Crusade herself, which would be a cool scenario if you had her as an NPC and Crusader came back and got into the middle of it. The crusader write-up in that book changed the way I perceive character design and how I tend to set power levels in my games. It also presented information with more of a narrative bent and inspired me to change the way I organized and ran games. Its not astounding from a state-of-the-art perspective, but for its time and place it was an innovative book. I wish I still had a copy - or at least had a scan of the crusader write-up from it.

In fact, if someone wants to make Vondy really happy they will scan that write up and mail me!

Will Rep for out of print villian scans that don't hurt DOJ's profit margins....

[Sketchpad]

The Dark Champions version of Crusader who appeared in one of the 4E Dark Champions villian books is a must have. :straight:

The BBB version - not so much.

I liked both ... but then, I had modified my version to become an analog to Daredevil in my 4th ed CU :) When I was done, he didn't quite look the same :D

[Shoutybloke]

It was one of the villian books for 4E DC. I don't remember the title of the top of my head.



Underworld Enemies by Chris Avalone is the one your thinking of. Fantastic book. Still use updated versions of the Siettas, Hanged man and Gunmetal silk. Sadly I don't have the book anymore.

There's a 2nd hand copy on EBAY at the moment, fairly cheap, if you're interested Von D man. Postage to your location might be a bit excessive though.

[Plex]

Genocide/IHA

Updated version of Deathstroke

Panda and Racoon (updated)

VIPER

Mechanon

Dr Destroyer

Menton

the Ultimates

Grond

[Mojo_Bones]

I go very old school:
Bulldozer as a throwaway fight
Grond rampaging through the city
Prof. Muerte and his group as they are a more reasonably powered group that a PC group can actually fight.
Genocide A good hate group that can cause the PCs some angst when they go after super villains as well.
Viper who doesn't love Viper, except GIJoe
Eurostar If I have a European adventure of any sort

Sorry, I never have nor will I ever use Dr Destroyer. Just too much like using Deities and Demigods in D&D for "monsters" to fight your 10th level party. Lame!

I would also say Primus and Until on the good guys side.

[Vondy]

. Postage to your location might be a bit excessive though.

Yep, prohibitive.

[Vann the Red]

Ooh, good catch with Panda and Raccoon, Plex. I usually squeeze in Thunder & Lightning as well.

VtR

[Sketchpad]

You know ... this makes me wonder ... I know there are some on the boards who don't want to see updates on the old stuff ... but how many would actually be interested in a book with the old characters?

[Vondy]

You know ... this makes me wonder ... I know there are some on the boards who don't want to see updates on the old stuff ... but how many would actually be interested in a book with the old characters?

It depends which characters.

I would like to see a "Best of Dark Champions 4E" book.

And some of the characters from The Mutant File and High Tech Enemies were interesting.

And a Mind Titan update would be cool.

European Enemies, not so much... :D

[Shoutybloke]

I'd jump at the chance for a 5th or 6th ed Underworld enemies book, but apparently the author is too busy.
Freak and the Cainite are very similar coceptually though...

[Watchdog]

No love for Utility?

[Kirby]

No love for Utility?I just can't utilize him. :D

[Diamond_J]

Viper
Mechanon
Dr. Destroyer
Demon
Ultimates
Bulldozer

The Dozer is just fun to role play. Every game needs comic relief, right?
It's a must to have a good villainous organization or 2. Destroyer is the premiere villain I like to use him sparsely, to keep his appearance more epic.

[CrosshairCollie]

No love for Utility?

I like to use him as more of a 'mastermind' or behind-the-scenes planner than an in-your-face villain; kind of like what DC's done with The Calculator. I do like him, though I wish his name wasn't so easy to make fun of as 'Futility'.


The Dozer is just fun to role play. Every game needs comic relief, right?

Dozer is another good one to recieve a massive power boost of some sort after he's been slapped around a few times, so the PCs take him for granted then he unloads with some crazy 20d6 Double Knockback punch and the PCs suddenly realize they have a REAL fight on their hands ... or, say, if Bulldozer were to be given the Hammer of Thor, that'd be another fun bit. :)

[Vondy]

No love for Utility?

I never saw the appeal.

I had a player, however, who used the deisgn as the basis for a short-lived PC.

[Vann the Red]

No love for Utility?


He was part of the backstory for one of my favorite characters (both had been trained by the same, now dead, hero).

VtR

[Plex]

You know ... this makes me wonder ... I know there are some on the boards who don't want to see updates on the old stuff ... but how many would actually be interested in a book with the old characters?

I'd love to see a book that had the best of all the old villains. Especially since I lost most of my old villain books from various moves. Updated versions wouldn't bother me either.

[Kirby]

You know ... this makes me wonder ... I know there are some on the boards who don't want to see updates on the old stuff ... but how many would actually be interested in a book with the old characters?I'm interested, but the ones I like (Seven Horsemen, VOICE, etc.) are ones that HERO no longer has the rights to.

[Legatus]

... or, say, if Bulldozer were to be given the Hammer of Thor, that'd be another fun bit. :)

Only a worthy person can lift the hammer...Bulldozer? No!:mad:

Still, if he could get his hands on some other weapon...? Yeah, might work.:thumbup:

[CrosshairCollie]

Only a worthy person can lift the hammer...Bulldozer? No!:mad:

"Well, okay, we just kinda made that up ... it sounded cool." :)

Actually, ignoring the Marvel comics take and using more of the actual mythology ... Bulldozer is a misogynistic braggart, a bully, possessing a nearly sociopathic desire to fight, drinks more than anybody in their right mind should ...

isn't that pretty much a 'classic' Viking? He's a perfect fit. :)

[SSgt Baloo]

Only a worthy person can lift the hammer...Bulldozer? No!:mad:

Still, if he could get his hands on some other weapon...? Yeah, might work.:thumbup:

Okay, maybe not Thor's hammer. How about Thor's pliers? :slap:

[Legatus]

"Well, okay, we just kinda made that up ... it sounded cool." :)

Actually, ignoring the Marvel comics take and using more of the actual mythology ... Bulldozer is a misogynistic braggart, a bully, possessing a nearly sociopathic desire to fight, drinks more than anybody in their right mind should ...

isn't that pretty much a 'classic' Viking? He's a perfect fit. :)

You're right!

[Pental]

*snort* In our campaign, Bulldozer just became the heir to the throne of Sealand...and all that that (diplomatic immunity) entails.