Sweep or Autofire for melee?

[Gumby]

Hi all, new player to Hero here. I've made a 350-point Battlesuit/Brick character, and planned on incorporating Sweep into my combat tactics on a regular basis.

My GM found this to be an odd tactic, since he is more familiar with Autofire being used for multiple HA attacks. To use Autofire, I'd have to buy it for my Str and my HA weapon (an energy sword). He also finds Sweep to be overpowered and more suited for a Heroic campaign, rather than Superheroic. I think that the shredding of my DCV and the fact that I can't move at all when I Sweep are suitable minuses to the Sweep way of doing things.

Also, while I realize that Autofire can be used for melee attacks, Sweep feels more natural. I'm fairly Bricky, and had hoped to be surrounded by mooks on a semi-regular basis. As it was, during our first session, a Speedster did enough knockback on a move-by to set me right next to him (I was hovering and he was running on the ceiling at the time), letting me whack the crap out of him three times my next phase). I think this was fairly fluky and will likely not be repeated. I suppose there might be balance issues in case another Brick approaches me (he hits me once because he moved, I hit him more often when my phase starts), but knockback tends to send everyone flying in this game anyway it seems.


So, what are the general feelings on this? Both character point conservation and general game balance are in consideration here, as well as character "feel."

[Certified]

Unless I'm missing something the way I understand it is Sweep is used to hit opponents adjacent to each other. Autofire is used to hit a single opponent multiple times.

However, if you buy a power like HA with autofire, you do not need to also buy it as a naked advantage for strength. Instead it increases the amount of active points needed to add a DC from strength. For Example: A HA with a +1 modifier now costs 10 active points per damage class. If it were a +3d6 HA the character would need to have 30 active points in strength (Strength 40) to use the full 6d6 attack. If they had only 20 Active points (Strength 30) the attack would cap at 5d6 instead. Hope that helps.

On a side note would you be Gumby of the of the Canadian Clan Gumby?

[Gumby]

Unless I'm missing something the way I understand it is Sweep is used to hit opponents adjacent to each other. Autofire is used to hit a single opponent multiple times.

However, if you buy a power like HA with autofire, you do not need to also buy it as a naked advantage for strength. Instead it increases the amount of active points needed to add a DC from strength. For Example: A HA with a +1 modifier now costs 10 active points per damage class. If it were a +3d6 HA the character would need to have 30 active points in strength (Strength 40) to use the full 6d6 attack. If they had only 20 Active points (Strength 30) the attack would cap at 5d6 instead. Hope that helps.

On a side note would you be Gumby of the of the Canadian Clan Gumby?Hm, ok. I think I understand that. And sorry, I'm from Alaska -- right next door, but not quite Canada.

[Netzilla]

Sweep can be used against multiple or single targets (5ER 397):

This Maneuver allows a character to use a HTH attack more than once in a Phase against a single target or multiple targets (provided they're all within HTH range).

Don't forget to point out to your GM that Sweep also takes a -2 OCV penalty for each additional attack and that it applies to all of the attacks made. If any attack misses, all remaining attacks miss.

So, let's say your character Sweeps to hit 3 opponents in HTH. Your character will be -4 OCV, 1/2 DCV and will have to use a Full Phase action. If you hit the first target, but miss the second, the 3rd will automatically be missed. You also spend END for all 3 attacks.

With Autofire (let's say AF 3), your character would spend a 1/2 phase action, be a full DCV and -2 OCV (for the extra 2 hexes assuming all the targets are adjacent). He would also spend END for 3 attacks. He'll make separate attack rolls for each target (5ER 376) and can continue even if he misses one of the targets. So, if he hits the first and misses the 2nd, he can still make an attack roll against the 3rd.

In general, Autofire is superior to Sweeping, but that's why you pay points for it.

As for your GM's feelings on the issue, my suggestion would be to ask him if you can try it for a session or two to see how it plays. Tell him up from that you'll agree to spend your EPs on Autofire if (after seeing how Sweep performs in one or two combats) he still feels its overpowered.

[Wyrm Ouroboros]

Our recommendation to make sure he doesn't feel it to be too overpowered, of course, is to make sure that you don't use it TOO often -- or several/many times on the same opponent. Don't bother Sweeping the poor little speedster running on the ceiling; reserve your Sweeps for the 6-story megamachine that everyone's trying to take apart.

[Gumby]

Ah! I hadn't read the example, it being on the next page of the book, and my GM wasn't familiar with the maneuver, so we'd thought that only the second attack would be at -2 then the third at -4, instead of all three attacks being at -4 to start. Thanks, that helps balance-wise a lot. I'll refer my GM to this thread and suggest Netzilla's advice. Thanks!

And the speedster first tried to Entangle me, then did a Move-By. He had thoroughly annoyed me by that point! I can see what you mean though.

[DrunkonDUty]

Speedsters annoy me too. There's just something so smug about them.