The Worst character in comics

[Adventus]

This is a companion thread to the best Super in comics.

Who do you think is the worst Super in comics? In storyline, plot, back-story and ongoing story and character concept?

And I mean a regular ongoing character. Not someone who showed up for a few issues and was never seen again.

[MilkmanDan]

Cable is pretty awful. An extremely violent super-powerful telekinetic who can't really use his telekinesis because of a techno-organic virus that was engineered by his own clone and he carries around big guns and has a glowing eye for no real good reason and is the child of a major character and his dead former wife who was a clone of his first love who died then came back to life but wasn't really her and then died again and really was just in a pod under the water and came back and when the clone found out she became evil and the son was taken into the future to be raised by future selves of major character and real woman #1 and then came back to fight evil.

I think that pretty much captures it.

[Querysphinx]

I think the question ought to be, which is the worst major character in comics, other than Cable, because Cable is the obvious number one choice.

[Psybolt]

As a huge Spider-man fan, I have to say the Scarlet Spider. Still makes me want to murder something when I think about the Clone Saga garbage.

[Log-Man]

Cable is pretty awful. An extremely violent super-powerful telekinetic who can't really use his telekinesis because of a techno-organic virus that was engineered by his own clone and he carries around big guns and has a glowing eye for no real good reason and is the child of a major character and his dead former wife who was a clone of his first love who died then came back to life but wasn't really her and then died again and really was just in a pod under the water and came back and when the clone found out she became evil and the son was taken into the future to be raised by future selves of major character and real woman #1 and then came back to fight evil.

I think that pretty much captures it.
I was going to say Cable anyway, but I didn't realize just how bad it was. He's like the Platonic idea of awful.

[MilkmanDan]

I forgot to mention "and was created and 'drawn' by Rob Liefeld".

[Cygnia]

Does Joe Quesada count as a character? ;)

[DusterBoy]

Captain Britain. Bleuch!

Once more with the "British guy created by Yanks who have never been to Britain" and the only concept they can come up with is King Arthur - 'cos that's all they've ever heard of.

Captain America works because America (ie the US) is one country. Britain is four countries - England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. Britain is a "metanation".

A better concept would have been "John Bull" - the English version of Uncle Sam. Okay - he's meant to be British, but people in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland would see him as English. However, unlike Uncle sam, he is not a figure of authority (esp not the Authority).

[Cygnia]

Captain Britain. Bleuch!

Once more with the "British guy created by Yanks who have never been to Britain" and the only concept they can come up with is King Arthur - 'cos that's all they've ever heard of.

Captain America works because America (ie the US) is one country. Britain is four countries - England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. Britain is a "metanation".

A better concept would have been "John Bull" - the English version of Uncle Sam. Okay - he's meant to be British, but people in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland would see him as English. However, unlike Uncle sam, he is not a figure of authority (esp not the Authority).

Can a different writer save/fix the concept though? I've read that Paul Cornell will be working on a Captain Britain series and he IS English.

[Hermit]

I think Union Jack has the cooler costume myself ;)

And I've thought about it, and I still can't really top Cable for sheer suckiness.

[Doomed Prophet]

Good thing this isn't a poll... I think Cable would be running unopposed...

BTW: That's my pick too... Never cared for Cable, or what Liefield did to comics...

[Lawnmower Boy]

Call me crazy, but I like both the Scarlet Spider and Cable. The problem with both of them is that they got in the way of the story that comics cannot bring themselves to tell. (How Peter/Mary Jane and Scott/Jean grew up.) Don't blame the characters; blame the industry, which for some reason thinks that comics characters can't have life cycles because we wouldn't identify with them any more.
Some counter-intuitive choices:
i) Superman/Doctor Strange/Spectre: "You know who would make a great protagonist in a serial drama? Someone omnipotent!"
ii) Aquaman/The Submariner: Cool character or not, useful powers or not, they're underwater. There's no bank robberies underwater. Heck, there aren't even any refrigerators, although credit both series' writers for coming up with alternatives. (I just thank Heavens that no-one seems to notice that Susan Storm is Namor's mistress [and Reed and Ben's beard], because I like her and she's stayed out of the fridge for 40 years.)
iii) The Phantom. "Thank Heavens us nice Black people have a White hero to defend us forever!"

[godjam]

I also have to defend Cable and Scarlet Spider a little bit, after all SS is just Spider-Man without the back story weighing him down. How you can hate a character who is basically the SAME CHARACTER as Spidey puzzles me.
As for Cable, there are other X-Men who offend me even more:

BISHOP- What is this guy still doing here? Yey he saved the X-Men now kill him off already. I'm sick of him and his expert martial artist/ detective/ bounty hunter/ edgey X-Guy thing. District X tanked for a reason. And his power? 'Actually i can absorb massive amounts of raw energy- kinetic, electric or even psychic(?)'
and Havok for the simple reason that he's STILL got an inferiority complex about his big brother, oh and for treating Polaris, the woman he supposedly loves, like dirt.

Overall i'd agree that underwater people leave me kind of cold as character concepts, they're just too limited. Although hate Aquaman A LOT more than submariner. A lot more.
But for my money some of the Avengers are pretty dire- (Triathalon) and i know i might get some stick for this but here goes-Giant Man (Or Ant Man, or Yellow Jacket) the guy grows AND shrinks using something called Pym particles!! Come on, he's worth a mention.

GOJ

[Kirby]

My personal preferences, in order:

Wolverine (modern)
Iron Man (Civil War junk)
Hulk
Batman - Jetix cartoon version

[wcw43921]

Even though the character was the basis for the Dark Champions genre, with apologies to Mr. Long, I say The Punisher is the worst. Not only is he a gun-wielding vigilante killer in a genre where such characters would--should--suffer the same fate as villains, he's a blatant plaigarism of Don Pendleton's character The Executioner. All Marvel did to create him was take Mack Bolan and put him in tights with a big skullface emblem. There's nowhere near as much similarity between Superman and Captain Marvel, as between The Demon With A Glass Hand and The Terminator, as there is between The Punisher and The Executioner.

To this day it surprises me that there wasn't a lawsuit, either by Pendleton or Pinnacle Books. Because they would have won, and The Punisher would be nothing more than a distasteful, insignificant memory.

[Captain Obvious]

I was going to say that kid from JSA with the genie is pretty annoying, but yeah, Cable is just dumb. It's like he was created by a 12 year old to be the kewlest character ever. Cable's a freaking parody.

[MilkmanDan]

I was going to say that kid from JSA with the genie is pretty annoying, but yeah, Cable is just dumb. It's like he was created by a 12 year old to be the kewlest character ever. Cable's a freaking parody.

They should change his name to c4b13!!!!1!1!1!!11!!

[Bloodstone]

Captain Britain. Bleuch!

Once more with the "British guy created by Yanks who have never been to Britain" and the only concept they can come up with is King Arthur - 'cos that's all they've ever heard of.

:face palm:

Chris Claremont created Captain Britain.

Care to venture a guess where this alleged Yank is from?

[Bloodstone]

And I'd also like to defend some of the stuff Fabian Nicieza has done with Cable over the years, even if I really hated most of the crap they di wit him in the 90's.

Cable & Deadpool was a really fun series though :)

[Captain Obvious]

And I'd also like to defend some of the stuff Fabian Nicieza has done with Cable over the years, even if I really hated most of the crap they di wit him in the 90's.

Cable & Deadpool was a really fun series though :)

I haven't read any of it, but hey, maybe you can polish a turd.

[Checkmate]

Even though the character was the basis for the Dark Champions genre, with apologies to Mr. Long, I say The Punisher is the worst. Not only is he a gun-wielding vigilante killer in a genre where such characters would--should--suffer the same fate as villains, he's a blatant plaigarism of Don Pendleton's character The Executioner. All Marvel did to create him was take Mack Bolan and put him in tights with a big skullface emblem. There's nowhere near as much similarity between Superman and Captain Marvel, as between The Demon With A Glass Hand and The Terminator, as there is between The Punisher and The Executioner.

To this day it surprises me that there wasn't a lawsuit, either by Pendleton or Pinnacle Books. Because they would have won, and The Punisher would be nothing more than a distasteful, insignificant memory.
Besides both being in Viet Nam, and both carry guns, I see VERY little that makes these guys similar at all. Personality, motivation, tactics, teachers, everything is pretty much different...That is of course assuming things haven't changed since I read comics.

To answer the original question: Current Iron Man. Besides the whole Civil War fiasco, why does there even need to be any other superheroes on the planet? The armor makes him stronger than Thor, he can create a force field that can withstand a nuke, absorb any energy shot at him, I mean he has a 10,000pt VPP, pretty much makes everyone else useless.

[Log-Man]

To answer the original question: Current Iron Man. Besides the whole Civil War fiasco, why does there even need to be any other superheroes on the planet? ...
Iron Man needs someone to fight. Duh.

[gmurie]

My vote for ALL TIME WORST is Spawn. This month Spawn wakes up and has breakfast! I once heard a rumor that Todd McFarlane bragged that he could put the panels of Spawn together in any order he liked and the fans of the comic were so dumb they wouldn't notice.

I have two additional TYPES of characters that I don't like:

Witchblade, Fathom, Power Girl, Red Sonja, and a few others of that ilk. The comics that have covers that are blatantly aimed at 13 year old boys. Look! BOOBIES! BOOOOOBIES!

Spawn, Punisher, Cable, and any character that is shown carting around several guns the size of sign posts and kills people for no comprehensible reason other than to prove that he's tough.

As often as not I find myself loathing established characters that I'd normally like because writers shift them over to one of those two types. I hate almost everything Image has ever done with the exception of the early run of Savage Dragon, but Spawn has a special place of loathing in my heart.

[godjam]

Yeah!
Damn i forgot all about Spawn and Savage Dragon, Good One!
I never, ever understood why people went crazy about Spawn, the idea of his origin was okay but the best thing about the comic was the two cops- i forget there names.
Andthe best Savage Dragon title ever done was the mini-series done by Jason Pearson - it was the first thing that i read with SD in, it actually read like a super-cop story-i.e edgy, witty and intelligent. Then i went and read all the Eric Larson stuff and it wasn't half as good.

There does seem to be a genuine problem when artists get to make up their own characters and get to run with them, both examples above disappeared up their own a** after about...12-20 issues, I'm estimating.

[Checkmate]

...but Spawn has a special place of loathing in my heart.
My first introduction to Spawn was when Image first came out they had a comic called Shadowhawk. There was a limited series where you could write in and guess which character was actually Shadowhawk.

Shadowhawk (a Batman type character with armor that broke people's back, yeah, yeah typical Image) was tracking down an arsonist. Spawn appears on the building right behind Shadowhawk and says something to the effect of:

"If you are after the arsonist, find him. If you are the arsonist, we dance"

Shadowhawk says something like I'll find him and Spawn says "End it tonight" and jumps off a building. When he leaves Shadowhawk thinks about how spooky that guy was.

Now typing all that out, and looking back on how Image really was, it sounds pretty cheesy, but at the time, I thought it was the coolest thing. I thought it was cool that "Psycho-Batman" thought someone else was spooky.

I got a couple of Spawn comics and was promptly disappointed, but for two whole panels, I thought he was the coolest ever.

[dugfromthearth]

Captain Britain was fantastic in the British comics. The problem is that they took the hero with problems out of the British comic where everyone was flawed and put him in American comics where everyone else was perfect. And then they turned his sister in Psylock which is even worse.

I have to say the worst character is the Hulk, the stupid violent version. Unlimited strength, stupid. The comics had to dream up inane plots so that he appeared somewhat heroic.

[Theron]

As much as I hate Cable, Bishop, and everything that came from the X-Men after Storm got a Mohawk, I have to respectfully disagree.

The worst character in the entire history of comics was DC's first blaxploitation hero, The Black Bomber, a white racist by day, who turned into a superpowered black guy at night or in times of stress.

Thankfully, he was so awful, the powers that be at DC came to their senses and he never saw print.

[CrosshairCollie]

I'm torn between Iron Man and the Punisher. Since, once upon a time, before Civil War, I liked Iron Man, and never liked the punk, I'll throw my vote in with the Punisher.

[Rage]

Captain Britain. Bleuch!

Once more with the "British guy created by Yanks who have never been to Britain" and the only concept they can come up with is King Arthur - 'cos that's all they've ever heard of.

Captain America works because America (ie the US) is one country. Britain is four countries - England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. Britain is a "metanation".

A better concept would have been "John Bull" - the English version of Uncle Sam. Okay - he's meant to be British, but people in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland would see him as English. However, unlike Uncle sam, he is not a figure of authority (esp not the Authority).
Wasn't captain Britain created by Marvel UK? I know for a while he was written by alan moore...

[Kirby]

Thankfully, he was so awful, the powers that be at DC came to their senses and he never saw print.That sentence disqualifies him from what the original poster is looking for as he declared:

And I mean a regular ongoing character. Not someone who showed up for a few issues and was never seen again.There were lots of stupid characters that were not ongoing.

[Fedifensor]

To answer the original question: Current Iron Man. Besides the whole Civil War fiasco, why does there even need to be any other superheroes on the planet? The armor makes him stronger than Thor, he can create a force field that can withstand a nuke, absorb any energy shot at him, I mean he has a 10,000pt VPP, pretty much makes everyone else useless.
Old Thor, but not New Thor. Iron Man got schooled big time by Thor in Thor #3. Granted, Thor had the advantage because it was in his own comic...but it was a really cool encounter. Thor basically called Tony to the carpet on all the horrid Civil War stuff, fried his armor, and made him walk home. Thor even warned Tony that once he took care of other matters (bringing back the lost Asgardians), he would come back and discuss things further. I cheered after nearly every panel. :)

It's hard to make a decision on this, because most of the characters mentioned have had good stories when placed in the hands of a non-hack writer. I'd go with the Punisher simply because I don't like his attitude, his powers, his origin...nothing works for me. At least Cable occasionally showed a cool power or had a decent quote. I've never liked Punisher.

[lapsedgamer]

Gambit. What the hell? A Cajun mutant/assassin/thief with weird red eyes and a staff. In a D&D game you would balk at this combo. What a munchkin.

[Southern Cross]

Can I nominate the Sentry?

[Adventus]

He is a regular ongoing character. So yes the Sentry qualifies.

[mirage]

Nobody remembers Flash knockoff in the Squadron Supreme, the Whizzer?

Calling yourself the Whizzer is a bad idea.

Calling yourself the Whizzer and wearing a yellow costume? is just asking for it, and IIRC the character's personality actually deserved it.

[Checkmate]

Gambit. What the hell? A Cajun mutant/assassin/thief with weird red eyes and a staff. In a D&D game you would balk at this combo. What a munchkin.
You forget that he can hypnotize people by talking to them. Don't get too bent up about that though, the writers forgot he could do it too.

[Vondy]

Wolverine
Punisher
Cable
Fascist [Iron] Man
Batgod

I'm a big batman fan, but what they've done to him is agitating. He's become some Nieitzschesque caricature of a man. He's paranoid, has alienated and driven away almost everyone who has been close to him, is obsessesed and has no life, and has this weird inhuman vibe coming off of him. He used to be a cool character, and a man. You need to be able to relate to a character on some level. Batman has become a machine with very few human qualities. He was cool up through the dark knight series and year one, but after that - whoa! - what freak-job possessed bruce wayne and turned him into a madman?

[Killer Shrike]

Not a major character, but majorly stupid nonetheless: Random (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random_(comics)).

Not sure if he counts as major or not, but I never could stand Guido aka Strong Guy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_Guy). Everything about him was stoooopid.


However, both pale by comparison to Cable, of course. His "worstness" factor is epic.

[Narratio]

Cable is pretty awful. An extremely violent super-powerful telekinetic who can't really use his telekinesis because of a techno-organic virus that was engineered by his own clone and he carries around big guns and has a glowing eye for no real good reason and is the child of a major character and his dead former wife who was a clone of his first love who died then came back to life but wasn't really her and then died again and really was just in a pod under the water and came back and when the clone found out she became evil and the son was taken into the future to be raised by future selves of major character and real woman #1 and then came back to fight evil.

I think that pretty much captures it.
I've repped you. But I think I still owe you huge rep. Send this to Joe Q and his minions. Ask them exactly what combination of drugs and writers psychosis allowed this to happen over the years and why anybody thought it was a good idea.

I'm gonna be repping you forever on this one post Dan.

[MilkmanDan]

Nobody remembers Flash knockoff in the Squadron Supreme, the Whizzer?

Calling yourself the Whizzer is a bad idea.

Calling yourself the Whizzer and wearing a yellow costume? is just asking for it, and IIRC the character's personality actually deserved it.

Now, now, don't get pissy.

Um, yeah. Whizzer. Laughed at that one a lot when I was younger. Wait, I still do now.

[godjam]

Posted on behalf of SkeletonMan who doesn't have his own login yet:

"The Authority- used to really like them, in some ways still do but they suffer from convoluted powers that act as a crutch for writers and their poor story lines. I was originally upset that they killed off Jenny Sparks, the best character but I'm glad she left before the new writer (Grant Morrison i think) took over and suddenly the characters are trying way too hard to be cool/edgy (a common theme with GM) and able to do wonderful things with over the top new uses for their powers.
e.g- Hawksmore and Swift, both started off in Stormwatch and went from being sort-of powerful to JLA level seemingly overnight."


(Having not read most recent stories, can't past judgment on them).

Really surprised that nobody mentioned Captain America (waits for chorus of boo/hiss, how can you hate the Cap!). Maybe it's because I'm not American but i find his character uninteresting, having stock responses to any given situation and having gone more-or-less unchanged since he started out. Look how other characters have evolved over time.
Other Boy Scout types like Cyclops/ Superman at least seem to change a little even if, in Supes case they usually get undone.
I'm not against American patriotic characters, i really like the Patriot (from Brave New World RPG- great character.)

Bishop- Where to start! Just like with Authority but worse, at one point this character had defined powers and a definite goal. He even used to have a deep respect for his fellow X-Men, legendary (emphasis on legendary) heroes from his time.
Now he seems to be able to do almost anything, suddenly he has complete knowledge of the powers and weaknesses of most of the X-Men, how he gained these insights isn't made clear since he didn't seem to have any of this information when hunting for the traitor in the X-Men's midst.
Other characters such as Longshot who have a clearly defined storyline leave when that storyline is resolved.




Separate point- Hate it when writers develop characters "off screen" in other plot lines in other comics, which is great if you follow all of them but stupid if you say, like Nightwing but don't follow every Bat comic or every DC title.
The only reason Nightwing isn't included here is because the character is still interesting even though every so often he changes city, motivation, love interest- almost always in another publication. (The destruction of Bludhaven- if you just followed Nightwing you completely lose track of whats going on.)

A lot of people seem to dislike the new Spidey plot during Civil War, but i could follow his comics without having to buy all the Civil War titles- (Iron Mar, Thunderbolts, X-Men, HFH, etc).

[Log-Man]

Not sure if he counts as major or not, but I never could stand Guido aka Strong Guy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_Guy). Everything about him was stoooopid.
Objection, OBJECTION!

Strong guy is awesome! :tonguewav

[DusterBoy]

Let's hope that Paul Cornell can re-invigorate Capt Britain.

However, one of my points is that King Arthur wouldn't have been English. If he existed, he would have been a Romano-Celtic warlord and would have fought the people who became the English - ie: the Saxons.

It was the Romans who called these islands Britannia and, as it was at the ends of the Empire, it was considerd something of a hardship posting.

Remember, English is the language which follows other languages down darks alleys, mugs them and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary.

[Doc Shocker]

Let's hope that Paul Cornell can re-invigorate Capt Britain.

However, one of my points is that King Arthur wouldn't have been English. If he existed, he would have been a Romano-Celtic warlord and would have fought the people who became the English - ie: the Saxons.

It was the Romans who called these islands Britannia and, as it was at the ends of the Empire, it was considerd something of a hardship posting.

Remember, English is the language which follows other languages down darks alleys, mugs them and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary.


Repped for historical accuracy and making me laugh.

[CGlied]

I'll split my vote between Guy Gardner and the Punisher.

[Checkmate]

Let's hope that Paul Cornell can re-invigorate Capt Britain.

However, one of my points is that King Arthur wouldn't have been English. If he existed, he would have been a Romano-Celtic warlord and would have fought the people who became the English - ie: the Saxons.

It was the Romans who called these islands Britannia and, as it was at the ends of the Empire, it was considerd something of a hardship posting.

Remember, English is the language which follows other languages down darks alleys, mugs them and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary.So you're okay with him flying around, and throwing tanks. A mystical trial to give him his power sits all right. King Arthur not being British is what kills the realism for you? :nonp:

[Ragdoll]

Paste Pot Pete! :D Pee-yew! :D http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trapster

[Kirby]

Remember, English is the language which follows other languages down darks alleys, mugs them and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary.Touche'




:D

[Narratio]

Remember, English is the language which follows other languages down darks alleys, mugs them and goes through their pockets for loose vocabulary.

Can't give rep... sorry, I'll have to owe you for that one. But come on, Cable is still the man to beat here.

The likes of Paste Pot Pete, Bouncing boy and even the various talking animals / pets are just dire because the names are weak and the stories or the powers are wierd. But Cable has it all. A name that doesn't really tie into anything he does or is about, a history that's so convoluted that it makes the history of Henry 'Hank' Pym / Ant man / Giant Man / Goliath / Yellow Jacket / The Doctor seem stable and an appearence, no matter who draws him, of high tech bondage. Gotta' go with Cable guys. You know it makes sense.

[Doc Shocker]

What say we just throw all of Liefield's characters into a pile with Cable on top and then set the pile on fire?

[Narratio]

Works for me, I'll bring marshmallows.

[Kirby]

What say we just throw all of Liefield's characters into a pile with Cable on top and then set the pile on fire?

Works for me, I'll bring marshmallows.
:jawdrop: Are you crazy? :nonp: That stuff would be toxic! I'll bring my hazmat suit, thankyouverymuch.

[CrosshairCollie]

Not a major character, but majorly stupid nonetheless: Random (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random_(comics)).

Not sure if he counts as major or not, but I never could stand Guido aka Strong Guy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_Guy). Everything about him was stoooopid.


However, both pale by comparison to Cable, of course. His "worstness" factor is epic.

Hey, Strong Guy was awesome. :)

[gmurie]

:jawdrop: Are you crazy? :nonp: That stuff would be toxic! I'll bring my hazmat suit, thankyouverymuch.

Crossover special! Cable vs. Spawn!

Free vomit bag with every issue!

[Pariah]

Northstar and Aurora. One's a spoiled, arrogant former professional athlete who thinks he's God's gift to women (or is it men?), and the other's a schizophrenic slut. No wonder the rest of Canada hates Quebec.

What I dislike about them most, though, is that I thought the two of them had great potential that was never really even explored.

[SilentMan]

Superman: can do anything, defeated by nothing.If there is something he can´t do, writers just give him yet another power. New example of lameness is ability to grant powers to normals.It works only under blue sun...for now.


In Action Comics #857 (Part three of the "Escape From Bizarro World" storyline), it is revealed that the light of a blue sun can give Superman the power of "Superman Vision", which can imbue any person it hits with Kryptonian-like abilities for a short time.
Here is a post written by metalwarrior1975 which shows problems with Superman.


http://www.kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=63390&page=4&highlight=unbeatable

[Maelstrom]

No mention of the Disco Dazzler? Who fought Galactus with her awesome sound-to-light powers? For shame!

[The Weapon]

What say we just throw all of Liefield's characters into a pile with Cable on top and then set the pile on fire?

On the bottom that way there's less chance he can escape.

[Alric]

It's not the characters, it's the writers and editors. A good writer can make *any* character interesting and entertaining while a bad writer can take the greatest character around and completely ruin them.

[DusterBoy]

It's not the characters, it's the writers and editors. A good writer can make *any* character interesting and entertaining while a bad writer can take the greatest character around and completely ruin them.

And the prize for hitting the nail on the head goes to Alric. Rep.

[Lord Mhoram]

I actually like Gambit, and while I'm not fond of Cable, I actually am finding him in the Ultimate universe interesting, so that disqualifies him....

For me, it has to be

The Punisher, hands down. Worse than anything Liefeld ever came up with.

[Dr Archeville]

Negasonic Teenage Warhead. Because she's a telepath/precog who calls herself "Negasonic Teenage Warhead."

And, yes, Alric hit it right on the head: it's not so much the character, it's the writer. Look what Kurt Busiek (and Fabian Nicieza) did to a bunch of C-list villains during his run on Thunderbolts.

[Plex]

Pretty much anything created by Rob Liefeld but the milkman already mentioned him. (Saw after the fact.)

But you know what, every character that think of that I can't stand, to the point of burning said comics, Rob Liefeld is involved in some way so the point stands.

I do agree with the poster below, though, about Lobo. Now Ambush Bug was funny....

I would also put on the block TMNT and similar. (Except Usagi Yojimbo and Cerebus)

[brionl]

Ugh. I can't believe nobody has mentioned Lobo. He was practically single-handedly responsible for making me stop buying superhero comics when he came out. He was like an infection that just kept spreading into other titles.
:idjit:

[FenrisUlf]

Cable is pretty awful. An extremely violent super-powerful telekinetic who can't really use his telekinesis because of a techno-organic virus that was engineered by his own clone and he carries around big guns and has a glowing eye for no real good reason and is the child of a major character and his dead former wife who was a clone of his first love who died then came back to life but wasn't really her and then died again and really was just in a pod under the water and came back and when the clone found out she became evil and the son was taken into the future to be raised by future selves of major character and real woman #1 and then came back to fight evil.

I think that pretty much captures it.

:angst:

Is that captures it, you can keep it.

Myself, I'd have to go with Venom as a superhero. Who the heck thought that was a good idea???

[FenrisUlf]

Even though the character was the basis for the Dark Champions genre, with apologies to Mr. Long, I say The Punisher is the worst. Not only is he a gun-wielding vigilante killer in a genre where such characters would--should--suffer the same fate as villains, he's a blatant plaigarism of Don Pendleton's character The Executioner. All Marvel did to create him was take Mack Bolan and put him in tights with a big skullface emblem. There's nowhere near as much similarity between Superman and Captain Marvel, as between The Demon With A Glass Hand and The Terminator, as there is between The Punisher and The Executioner.

To this day it surprises me that there wasn't a lawsuit, either by Pendleton or Pinnacle Books. Because they would have won, and The Punisher would be nothing more than a distasteful, insignificant memory.

Why get rid of free publicity?

[FenrisUlf]

The worst character in the entire history of comics was DC's first blaxploitation hero, The Black Bomber, a white racist by day, who turned into a superpowered black guy at night or in times of stress.

Thankfully, he was so awful, the powers that be at DC came to their senses and he never saw print.

No offense, but I'd like some verification of this. This sounds like an urban legend.

[FenrisUlf]

Batgod

I'm a big batman fan, but what they've done to him is agitating. He's become some Nieitzschesque caricature of a man. He's paranoid, has alienated and driven away almost everyone who has been close to him, is obsessesed and has no life, and has this weird inhuman vibe coming off of him.

So, basically you're saying that DC made Batman into a fanboy? :D

That said, I agree with your assessment. And I thought that events in 52 were supposed to bring 'good Bruce' back.

[Lord Mhoram]

To this day it surprises me that there wasn't a lawsuit, either by Pendleton or Pinnacle Books. Because they would have won, and The Punisher would be nothing more than a distasteful, insignificant memory.

We can only dream of an alternate reality, improved from our own by this having happened there. :)

[The Main Man]

Negasonic Teenage Warhead. Because she's a telepath/precog who calls herself "Negasonic Teenage Warhead."

And, yes, Alric hit it right on the head: it's not so much the character, it's the writer. Look what Kurt Busiek (and Fabian Nicieza) did to a bunch of C-list villains during his run on Thunderbolts.

Y'know, that's the title of a Monster Magnet song, as well as "Ego the Living Planet," both of which were on the same album (Dopes to Infinity).

I wonder...:think:



On another note, I hate the "Superman always wins" argument; it's bullcrap.

How many Justice League stories have these people read?

Do they mean to imply that their favorite characters lose quite a bit or something?

Either way, there is a distortion of facts.

[ParagonAlpha]

Captain Britain. Bleuch!

Once more with the "British guy created by Yanks who have never been to Britain" and the only concept they can come up with is King Arthur - 'cos that's all they've ever heard of.

Captain America works because America (ie the US) is one country. Britain is four countries - England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. Britain is a "metanation".

A better concept would have been "John Bull" - the English version of Uncle Sam. Okay - he's meant to be British, but people in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland would see him as English. However, unlike Uncle sam, he is not a figure of authority (esp not the Authority).

Captain Britain was create by Chris Claremont and Herb Trimpe and really was just a "British" Captain America. But Alan Moore redeemed the character and made him decidedly English.

And an incredible character. So he can't count. :drink:

[ParagonAlpha]

Even though the character was the basis for the Dark Champions genre, with apologies to Mr. Long, I say The Punisher is the worst. Not only is he a gun-wielding vigilante killer in a genre where such characters would--should--suffer the same fate as villains, he's a blatant plaigarism of Don Pendleton's character The Executioner. All Marvel did to create him was take Mack Bolan and put him in tights with a big skullface emblem. There's nowhere near as much similarity between Superman and Captain Marvel, as between The Demon With A Glass Hand and The Terminator, as there is between The Punisher and The Executioner.

To this day it surprises me that there wasn't a lawsuit, either by Pendleton or Pinnacle Books. Because they would have won, and The Punisher would be nothing more than a distasteful, insignificant memory.

Don Pendleton filed a lawsuit against Marvel Comics back in the 70's about this whole thing and actually won a settlement.

Sgt. Mack Bolan (aka Col. John Phoenix) is a far superior character. I mean he was a Vietnam vet, who returned home to find out that his father had killed his whole family when he had found out his daughter was working as a prostitute to pay of his Mob gambling debt. Enraged, Mack Bolan went after the Mob, leaving dead bodies in his wake. He began to be hunted by Hal Brognola, an FBI agent with a sense of justice but bound by the law.

A five year long road destroying the Mob in dozens of cities, finally led to Mack Bolan's capture and conviction of over a hundred murders. But Mack had one more chance, the US Government offered him a chance to work for them, handling problems that they couldn't officially touch, both national and international. Leading to the birth of Able Team and Phoenix Force.

Operating from the Stoneridge Mountains and codenamed Stony Man, Mack Bolan underwent reconstructive surgery, was given the name John Phoenix and began a war against terrorism, drug dealers and anyone else trying to make America a bad place.

(Okay so I've read alot of The Executioner books, #1-278.)

[The Main Man]

Don Pendleton filed a lawsuit against Marvel Comics back in the 70's about this whole thing and actually won a settlement.

Sgt. Mack Bolan (aka Col. John Phoenix) is a far superior character. I mean he was a Vietnam vet, who returned home to find out that his father had killed his whole family when he had found out his daughter was working as a prostitute to pay of his Mob gambling debt. Enraged, Mack Bolan went after the Mob, leaving dead bodies in his wake. He began to be hunted by Hal Brognola, an FBI agent with a sense of justice but bound by the law.

A five year long road destroying the Mob in dozens of cities, finally led to Mack Bolan's capture and conviction of over a hundred murders. But Mack had one more chance, the US Government offered him a chance to work for them, handling problems that they couldn't officially touch, both national and international. Leading to the birth of Able Team and Phoenix Force.

Operating from the Stoneridge Mountains and codenamed Stony Man, Mack Bolan underwent reconstructive surgery, was given the name John Phoenix and began a war against terrorism, drug dealers and anyone else trying to make America a bad place.

(Okay so I've read alot of The Executioner books, #1-278.)

That reminds me of the first story arc of Punisher MAX (which is good probably because Garth Ennis is writing it), where he is offered to go after bin Laden, but he turns it down; I wonder if that was something of a nod to Mack Bolan or not?

That being said, have you checked these audio books (http://www.graphicaudio.net/c-13-executioner-the.aspx) out?

I've always been curious about Mack Bolan, but I never really knew anything about the quality of the books.

[ParagonAlpha]

I've always been curious about Mack Bolan, but I never really knew anything about the quality of the books.

I discovered Mack Bolan when I was 13. So I was very much into the limited dialog, one man killing machine with small asides involving some very PG-13 sex-capades.

The prose was very simple and the plots pretty much the same, but they were entertaining. At the time I was reading about 2 books a week (school, homework, gaming, comics and other books aside). Books were around 200 pages tops.

Sometime around book 60 the stories actually started getting better. Don Pendleton was no longer writing the books and several "ghost" writers had taken over, taking turns. Books came out about once every 2 months and steadily got better yet still were very simple.

Every now and then they'd publish a bigger story in a 400+ page book that would include crossovers with the two other books in the same world, Phoenix Force and Able Team. Both of them were fun series as well.

I also read another series around this time call Track. About a Private Eye/Special Ops guy who used a .357 Magnum and a SPAS-12 Shotgun.

(Funny, everyone had a "special weapon" they used. Mack Bolan used a .44 Automag. Dan Track used a .357 Magnum.)

I also read Brett Wallace, Ninja Master, a very trite but entertaining series about an American trained in the art of Ninjitsu. He killed people with his hands, swords, ice cubes, toothpicks, pretty much anything sharp or pointy. Anytime the plot lagged they'd throw in some R-rated sex scenes and all the deaths were graphically detailed.

[Captain Obvious]

Ugh. I can't believe nobody has mentioned Lobo. He was practically single-handedly responsible for making me stop buying superhero comics when he came out. He was like an infection that just kept spreading into other titles.
:idjit:

I've never seen Lobo in anything serious, except that episode of Justice League, I guess. He's great as parody, although I can imagine any attempt at a serious Lobo story would end up as unintentional parody.

[mayapuppies]

I would also put on the block TMNT and similar. (Except Usagi Yojimbo and Cerebus)

The original B&W TMNT was quite cool if I remember correctly. :D

It was the 80's color coded bandana versions that really blew chunks. :idjit:

[CrosshairCollie]

The original B&W TMNT was quite cool if I remember correctly. :D

It was the 80's color coded bandana versions that really blew chunks. :idjit:

Do keep in mind, the 80s cartoon version was targetted at, well, kids, and the young end of the demographic at that.

The 2003 (I believe) TMNT cartoon was targetted at a demographic more for late-teens rather than pre-teens, and was a lot more serious and a lot less slapstick. The color-coded bandanas are a necessity because, otherwise, the characters are all identical if you can't see their weapons (as in, any close-up).

[assault]

I've never seen Lobo in anything serious, except that episode of Justice League, I guess.

He first appeared in the Omega Men. He was actually quite scary.

They cranked up the absurdity level later.

[Kenn]

Yeah. He was scary in his goofy orange and purple tights. When he went absurd he was wearing the biker leathers.

No. I'm not kidding, even though this seems backwards.

[Clonus]

It's not the characters, it's the writers and editors. A good writer can make *any* character interesting and entertaining while a bad writer can take the greatest character around and completely ruin them.

There is no character separate from his writers and artists of course. But, I disagree anyway. A good writer can't make any character interesting and entertaining at least not for me. If he changes a character like Cable, or Brother Power, or Venom enough to do that, he'll have changed their basic premise enough to make effectively a new character.

[casualplayer]

We've seen Neil Gaiman make Brother Power, Glob, Brute and the 70's Sandman cool. We've seen James Robinson make the 70's Starman cool. We've seen Grant Morrison make Animal Man and Klarion the Witch Boy cool. We've seen Alan Moore, Kurt Busiek and Warren Ellis deconstruct and reconstruct heroes by the score, distilling them to their essense. A good writer can make any character work.

Except for Cable. The only way Kirkman made him palatable was to change his entire origin in Ultimate X-Men.

[Spidey88]

The original B&W TMNT was quite cool if I remember correctly. :D

Agreed. The current B&W run (vol. 4) is also very good, and a fun read. The most recent cartoon (save for its final devolution into "Fast Forward") is also quite good, and follows the comics surprisingly closely - though it's rather less bloody for the sake of the kiddies, the stories are still quite well-done with interesting character developments.

The color versions (Archie comics) and the 90's cartoons are considerably less inspiring. I've seen far worse (eg. Chuck Norris' Karate Kommandos), but I'd hesitate to call them "good".

[Enforcer84]

He first appeared in the Omega Men. He was actually quite scary.

They cranked up the absurdity level later.


Yeah. He was scary in his goofy orange and purple tights. When he went absurd he was wearing the biker leathers.

No. I'm not kidding, even though this seems backwards.

I was thinking the same thing. I like his "new" look better than his original, but hate the character.

correction, hate that he's used as a protagonist. I also hate his self contained spin offs.

[Enforcer84]

Like Vondy, I like Batman, hate the guy who replaced him (Bat-God).
I like Superman.
I'm not a fan of Cable, or X-Man for that matter. I HATE just about every character Leifield has stolen-er, Created...when written by Leifield. Other people can make them palletable.

I have little more than disdain for minor villains who become anti-heroes and get on superhero teams or worse yet, their own titles. (Lobo, Venom, Sabertooth, Punisher, etc)

Oh, and to the guy who said Captain America, I respectfully disagree. I read Cap for a long while, and the Avengers as well, I always felt that he (unlike, say Bat-Psycho) exhibits the best characteristics of the costumed mortal; he's abandoned his costume to keep his ideals, he's faced the realities of being an anachronism, wrestled with his conscience over killing a terrorist, trained more than a few heroes...given up his super soldier serum, etc. I'll admit he's something of a one note player, but I've never found him lacking.

[Narratio]

If we were sticking with the 60's, I'd be forced to mention that icon of supervillain silliness, 'The Top'. How a guy like the Flash could ever have been threatened by a guy who used spinning tops as weapons still escapes me.

Meanwhile, back at nailing Cable to a tree and having him pecked to death by Spotted Owl's...

[csyphrett]

We've seen Neil Gaiman make Brother Power, Glob, Brute and the 70's Sandman cool. We've seen James Robinson make the 70's Starman cool. We've seen Grant Morrison make Animal Man and Klarion the Witch Boy cool. We've seen Alan Moore, Kurt Busiek and Warren Ellis deconstruct and reconstruct heroes by the score, distilling them to their essense. A good writer can make any character work.

Except for Cable. The only way Kirkman made him palatable was to change his entire origin in Ultimate X-Men.

Actually Neil Gaiman killed off the 70's Sandman, and turned Brute and Glob into villains.

Robinson started the trend of rewriting characters to fit what he wanted so they might as well be new characters. I liked Firearm and Leave it to Chance, but thought Starman would have been better if Robinson had not rewrote every starman story to make them fit some kind of theme.

Grant Morrison might have done well with Animal Man but he screwed the Doom Patrol.

Moore and Busiek are the best writers on this list, and as far as superheroes go, I would take Busiek as the better writer.

CES

[transmetahuman]

I guess I have to jump on the "hate the writer, not the character" bandwagon here. I despise the whole let's-make-everyone-edgy-and-badass trend (is it still a "trend" after this long?), so I should hate Wolverine and Cable... but I rarely dislike Wolvy while I'm actually reading the stories he's in, and I did like what I read of the Cable & Deadpool stuff.

The let's-completely-alter-this-established-character's-personality-to-fit-my-story-arc trend infuriates me, too - why in the world wasn't every super trying to figure out which villain/alien possessed/mind controlled/impersonated Iron Man & Reed during Civil War? The ridiculously convoluted backstory stuff can be bad or okay, depending.

So I guess I'll have to put another vote for Dazzler - the disco version for being that lame, and the punk rock version for trying to do the same damn thing with a music genre I love.

No, wait - I absolutely, completely loathe everything about Mojo. Everything. But especially his omnipotence in the context of his goals - he can do pretty much anything he wants if a writer needs him to, including mass mind control, so how exactly can he lose ratings?

[FenrisUlf]

I've never seen Lobo in anything serious, except that episode of Justice League, I guess. He's great as parody, although I can imagine any attempt at a serious Lobo story would end up as unintentional parody.

I saw him in several Superman stories where he was presented as a serious threat to Supes, with Superman himself being scared of him.

[Plex]

Grant Morrison might have done well with Animal Man but he screwed the Doom Patrol.CES

Morrison's Doom patrol is what got me back into reading comics. I never liked the earlier version of DP, but loved this. But each to their own taste. My favorite era for the comics industry was when all the writers were rewriting the old silly characters. (The English invasion: Gaimen, Moore, Morrison, Ellis, Robinson, Milligan- okay he's Irish but you get the point, etc...)

I don't like 75% of comics involving super powered animals, hence my dislike of anything TMNT and of similar style. Though I was smart enough to buy the original series and then sell it later for a wack of cash...:)

I know when DC put out a collection of Lobo trades they put in a special book called the Wisdom of Lobo, which was blank inside. I know a lot of the customers were very angry at this. Personally I thought it was funny and expected as much, plus I didn't shell out the cash for the slip case special edition to get said book.

So I agree that a good writer can turn anything into something worth reading, usually, if the subject interests you, except for Lobo and Cable. (My choices)

[Clonus]

We've seen Neil Gaiman make Brother Power, Glob, Brute and the 70's Sandman cool. We've seen James Robinson make the 70's Starman cool. We've seen Grant Morrison make Animal Man and Klarion the Witch Boy cool. .

Klarion the Witch Boy was always cool. Animal Man? Let's say I wasn't much more impressed by leather jacket over his tights Animal Man than I was by his predecessor.

[Magmarock]

My vote for worst character concept was The Blob. Even though he is a reoccuring villain instead of a hero, being fat and immovable seems, well, stupid superpowers. :thumbdown


Mags

[Magmarock]

Oh, and I forgot to say.. Strong Guy RULES!

And I thought it was especially touching when he had a heart attack... :cry:


Mags

[Legatus]

My vote for worst character concept was The Blob. Even though he is a reoccuring villain instead of a hero, being fat and immovable seems, well, stupid superpowers. :thumbdown


Mags

I think his superpowers are great!:thumbup::D

[FenrisUlf]

My vote for worst character concept was The Blob. Even though he is a reoccuring villain instead of a hero, being fat and immovable seems, well, stupid superpowers. :thumbdown


Mags

Doesn't old Blobby also have super strength (considering his weight, he needs it!) and gravity control powers? I remember reading something about him now having the equivalent of a Double Knockback punch, anyway.

[Legatus]

Doesn't old Blobby also have super strength (considering his weight, he needs it!) and gravity control powers? I remember reading something about him now having the equivalent of a Double Knockback punch, anyway.

Now I like him even more! :D:D:D

In his secret identity he is an actor and plays a comic shop owner in a popular ongoing comedy show centered around a certain yellow family.;)

[brionl]

Now I like him even more! :D:D:D

In his secret identity he is an actor and plays a comic shop owner in a popular ongoing comedy show centered around a certain yellow family.;)

Worst. Retcon. Ever.
:thumbup:

[Twilight]

Doesn't old Blobby also have super strength (considering his weight, he needs it!) and gravity control powers? I remember reading something about him now having the equivalent of a Double Knockback punch, anyway.

He did have superstrength, though not on the level of the Hulk (though I could be wrong, it's been awhile since I've read those comics.) The gravity control thing, I belive, was an explantion for how Blob could knock people flying so far when he wasn't really strong enough to do so via brute strength (that is to say, he could knock them flying but not as far as he does without the gravity thingy.)

[Corven_Ren]

Well besides Cable....probably this guy


Sleepwalker :idjit:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleepwalker_%28comics%29

[fiducia]

Well besides Cable....probably this guy


Sleepwalker :idjit:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleepwalker_%28comics%29

Yeah that is pretty weak.

[Log-Man]

Blob had strength and a good degree of imperviousness, especially around his midsection in addition to his immobility. Being rooted to the spot doesn't mean much if you're just going to get beat to a pulp!

I've always liked Blob, but that was probably my pro fat-guy leanings :D

[Fedifensor]

Doesn't old Blobby also have super strength (considering his weight, he needs it!) and gravity control powers? I remember reading something about him now having the equivalent of a Double Knockback punch, anyway.

The Blob has always had superstrength. I just picked up the Essential Ms. Marvel #1, and he's shown slapping Wonder Man through a guard tower...that's back in 1981.

Specifically, Vision's quote on seeing that is: "That guard tower only marginally impeded Wonder Man's progress. His trajectory indicates that he will land somewhere in the West Bronx. It will be some time before he rejoins us."

Sounds like Double Knockback to me...

[casualplayer]

The Blob has always had superstrength. I just picked up the Essential Ms. Marvel #1, and he's shown slapping Wonder Man through a guard tower...that's back in 1981.

Specifically, Vision's quote on seeing that is: "That guard tower only marginally impeded Wonder Man's progress. His trajectory indicates taht he will land somewhere in the West Bronx. It will be some time before he rejoins us."

Sounds like Double Knockback to me...

That would be Avengers Annual #10, a good thing to include in an Essential Ms. Marvel collection because that's where she gets Rogue-raped.

[Narratio]

How's about DC's the Phantom Stranger? When he first appeared, dressed in the peak of late 60's cool, he didn't appear to do anything to anybody except be the writing staffs sock puppet. A way of laying down plot threads for the readers. Ah yes, from that same era, Deadman. I mean really... a gymnast, killed by a rifle shot while in mid air, who now haunts the world as an untouchable ghost (apart from the old body possession trick)searching for his killer. Huh?

Yep, DC writers of that era had access to great recreational drugs.

[Checkmate]

Matter-Eater Lad anyone?

[Narratio]

Yep, that's a wierd one, but hardly the worst. There was a whole slew from the LSH's readers suggestions, including Colour Kid or that girl with the ring of eyes around her head?

Let's get back to Cable. How about nailed to a dead cow and then floated over a Great White Shark feading frenzy...

[Shaft]

I'll be frank with you. I'm a little tired of the Red Skull's yearly infiltration and takeover of the American government.

[Shaft]

Oh, and add my vote to the Lobo haters, though I admit I never read him in Omega Men.

And I really hate Longshot, Mojo and Warlock. I'm not a Gambit fan either.

[casualplayer]

How's about DC's the Phantom Stranger? When he first appeared, dressed in the peak of late 60's cool, he didn't appear to do anything to anybody except be the writing staffs sock puppet. A way of laying down plot threads for the readers. Ah yes, from that same era, Deadman. I mean really... a gymnast, killed by a rifle shot while in mid air, who now haunts the world as an untouchable ghost (apart from the old body possession trick)searching for his killer. Huh?

Yep, DC writers of that era had access to great recreational drugs.

If you can remember the 60's, you weren't there.

[Fedifensor]

Matter-Eater Lad anyone?
They actually made Matter-Eater Lad cool (if a little edgy) in the new Legion books. Granted, he never actually goes by that moniker in the new books, but it's the same character.

[Lawnmower Boy]

How's about DC's the Phantom Stranger? When he first appeared, dressed in the peak of late 60's cool, he didn't appear to do anything to anybody except be the writing staffs sock puppet. A way of laying down plot threads for the readers.

Hey, lay off the Phantom Stranger. He was cosmic, man.

[Narratio]

If you can remember the 60's, you weren't there. Yep, I was there, reading comics, too young for the rest of it though. That had to wait for the 70's... wherein I made up for it.


Hey, lay off the Phantom Stranger. He was cosmic, man. Yes he was. Just wandering around, issuing dire warnings then, when the hero finished all the criminal catching, problem solving, cosmic event thwarting etc,he'd just smile say "my job is done" and bugger off to wherever it was he came from.

Excuse, I've got to get back to sticking pins in my 'Cable' action figure.

[Twilight]

They actually made Matter-Eater Lad cool (if a little edgy) in the new Legion books. Granted, he never actually goes by that moniker in the new books, but it's the same character.

I don't think Matter-Eater Lad is the worst character in comics. He does however have the worst codename in comics.

[Badger]

Cable and Wolverine if nothing else for the "popularity" compared to the general crappiness of them. Well, Wolverine wouldnt be so bad except for being a total @$$hole and being able to superheal from anything. If the frickin' universe blew up, he'd probably regenerate from that. :rolleyes:

[wrestlinggeek]

I've been debating this in my head, and have reached a decision. Even though he used to be cool, I have to give it to Wolverine. Why? A few reasons. He started the whole trend of "loner on a team" and, of course, "berserker with claws and a healing-factor." Plus, he has become the single most over-used, over-exposed, over-rated, and over-estimated comic-book character I can think of. And, I think many of the current problems with Marvel Comics come from them going "Wolverine is our most popular character. So, let's make all our characters more like Wolverine!"

[CrosshairCollie]

Doesn't old Blobby also have super strength (considering his weight, he needs it!) and gravity control powers? I remember reading something about him now having the equivalent of a Double Knockback punch, anyway.

Well, he was de-powered by the Great Scarlet Witch FUBAR, but yes, he did. He was strong enough to contain the grey Hulk (until he ticked Hulk off, of course), and learned to reverse his gravitational 'immobility' into a pretty impressive gravity smash. On top of being pretty darn invulnerable.

[The Weapon]

Well besides Cable....probably this guy


Sleepwalker :idjit:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleepwalker_%28comics%29

You know that character seems kinda cool to me. Did they just really stuff up the writing?

[Vondy]

Cable and Wolverine if nothing else for the "popularity" compared to the general crappiness of them. Well, Wolverine wouldnt be so bad except for being a total @$$hole and being able to superheal from anything. If the frickin' universe blew up, he'd probably regenerate from that. :rolleyes:


The hulk actually has better regeneration than wolverine....

[The Weapon]

We can only dream of an alternate reality, improved from our own by this having happened there. :)

And in that reality Bruce Lee stopped playing Kwai Chang Caine in the TV series 'Kung Fu' after the fifth season because he had other projects.
:D

[lapsedgamer]

Hey, I just read my copy of Wizard #201, and they list Wolverine as #1 in a list of the top 200 comic book characters of all time. Yes, ahead of Superman and Batman. Batman was #2.

Wolverine was an interesting character before he took over every title at Marvel. One day I fully expect to see a story arc where he takes out Galactus.

[Log-Man]

Wolverine was an interesting character before he took over every title at Marvel. One day I fully expect to see a story arc where he takes out Galactus.
Galactus calls for someone on a whole 'nother level than Wolverine.

Galactus calls for Squirrel Girl.

[DrunkonDUty]

Oh choices, choices.

I'd have to throw Cable in there first up. For all the reasons stated up at the start of the thread. But let's not feed him to the Great Whites, that's an endangered species you know.

And Wolverweenie for what he's turned into. He has been cool in the past but that was the past.

HAven't been reading comics for a while so I can't talk about Iron Man. ALthough from what I've read on these forums it sounds like he's been turned into a joke. Does anyone think it was all just preliminary marketing for the movie?

Bishop & Gambit come in for some hate too. Bishop just cos who the hell needed another refugee from the dystopian future. Gambit cos he's a twink. And if he was a DnD character you just know he'd be an elf.

[MilkmanDan]

As long as we're piling on regrettable X-Men, I have to give a partial vote to Maggott. Guy whose mutant power is his digestive system is actually two intelligent super-slugs named Eany and Meany who crawl out through his stomach and can eat anything, like a slug version of Matter-Eating Lad. Then they transmit the power to him, and he turns blue, gets really strong, and does other stupid things. Plus, his dumb accent. Conceptually, he's about as dumb as you can get. Who comes up with the idea for "guy with slugs in his stomach", anyways?

[Lord Mhoram]

I don't think Matter-Eater Lad is the worst character in comics. He does however have the worst codename in comics.

The legion is my favorite comic of all time, but I do have to admit that they had their fair share of bad names.

[Lord Mhoram]

Galactus calls for someone on a whole 'nother level than Wolverine.

Galactus calls for Squirrel Girl.

:) Too funny.


Speaking of one of her teammates, I always thought that Mr Immortal should get tired of the superhero biz, and go evil (by whatever plot reasons - or maybe he is just undercover) and ends up a major crime boss in new york.
Then the punisher kills him.
And a week later the punisher comes in for the new crime boss, and it's the same guy. So he kills him again.
and again
and again.

So we have Mr Immortal really frustrating the Punisher, and the readers actually have a recurring villain with a lethal hero. :)

[Plex]

I don't think Matter-Eater Lad is the worst character in comics. He does however have the worst codename in comics.

Well, if we are going to do bad code names, and LSH has many, I think Infectious Lass might top the chart...;)

[CrosshairCollie]

You know that character seems kinda cool to me. Did they just really stuff up the writing?

Bob Budiansky did most of the writing. That, to a lot of people, answers your question. :)

[DusterBoy]

Not the worst character by far, but I've never been keen on the Vision, but that's just a matter of his beetroot red face, costume and the fact that his "secret identity" (at least in Avengers: Clear & Present Dangers) looked like a '30 matinee idol. I've got nothing against the actual character as such.

However, Lobo has got to make the list of my Top 10 least favourite characters. I see he's also encountered Judge Dredd on his travels - shame Dredd didn't slam him into a cube. Seems the best place for him.

Superman afraid of this chump? Never gonna happen.

[godjam]

LOBO, it's gotta be. I'd pick him over Wolverine because he thinks he's SO DAMN COOL when he's not. And they keep on changing how powerful he is. And he's basically a 'hard biker in space' type- what an original concept! Like 'Rocket Racer' and his jet powered skateboard.
And this guy supposedly fights Superman

The Biker Mice From Mars are cooler than LOBO.

Also enough of the Cable bashing- we now have your opinion, so you can move on now. Find a new joke.

[Log-Man]

I just can't include Lobo on the list because he was never intended to be taken seriously. As a parody, he's brilliant. Unfortunately there are a lot of writers and editors who didn't get the joke and decided to mainstream him. Not the character's fault at all.

And there's never enough Cable bashing. I had forgotten how much I thoroughly despised Bishop. He probably comes in a very close second for me.

[BNakagawa]

Well, if we are going to do bad code names, and LSH has many, I think Infectious Lass might top the chart...;)

nowhere near as bad as Double Header IMO. For my money, one of the worst combinations of dumb powers, dumb name ever published.

If you add in the dumb plotline angle, I always go with the Red Nine.

[FenrisUlf]

That would be Avengers Annual #10, a good thing to include in an Essential Ms. Marvel collection because that's where she gets Rogue-raped.

Not to mention, she tells the Avengers that they abandoned her to get raped by the guy who impregnated her just so he could transfer his mind into her unborn child. :angst: :shock:

I'm stuck between gaping in horror and feeling just plain disgusted.

[FenrisUlf]

I'll be frank with you. I'm a little tired of the Red Skull's yearly infiltration and takeover of the American government.

Doesn't that only happen when the Republicans have won the national election in the Real World?

Though I suppose they could always have Titanium Man or Radioactive Man or some other old Commie villain take over when the Democrats win, just to keep everything even.


Wolverine was an interesting character before he took over every title at Marvel. One day I fully expect to see a story arc where he takes out Galactus.

How hard can beating Galactus be? Dazzler kicked his butt once!

[ParagonAlpha]

What's wrong with Bishop?

I've always been disappointed with most African or African-American characters. They are horrible stereotypes and pretty much reduced to gimmicks designed to play on their heritage or as sidekicks.

And you really can't bring up the Milestone line as defense because it failed to do what it said it would.

[FenrisUlf]

I've always been disappointed with most African or African-American characters. They are horrible stereotypes and pretty much reduced to gimmicks designed to play on their heritage or as sidekicks.

And you really can't bring up the Milestone line as defense because it failed to do what it said it would.

Okay, what was the Milestone line, and what did it try to do?

[Log-Man]

What's wrong with Bishop?
You mean the incredible badass from the apocalyptic future where mutants are persecuted with the big gun and a mutant power that he almost never uses because the big gun is much kewler?

Nothing, I guess. I just hate black characters.

[Log-Man]

Ummm, that was a joke.

[lapsedgamer]

What's wrong with Bishop?

I've always been disappointed with most African or African-American characters. They are horrible stereotypes and pretty much reduced to gimmicks designed to play on their heritage or as sidekicks.

And you really can't bring up the Milestone line as defense because it failed to do what it said it would.

I've always thought that it was because ther were so few African-Americans working in comics, especially when most of these characters were created.

Milestone had some decent books, but they didn't last too long. I liked the fact that they tried to portray every character as an individual, and not as a stereotype. There were noble Black characters, and there were less-than-noble Black characters, as with all the groups depicted. Some of the writing was a little clunky, but I admired what they were going for.

I'm not saying tha it takes a Black guy to write Blacks, but it does take an ability to think outside the box a little. For example, one of my favorite African-American characters is Jack-in-the-Box from Astro City. Busiek is just a good writer.

[Enforcer84]

AFAIK from being a Marvel Zombie in my youth and a "Much Smarter than Everyone" in my aged creaky nearly bodiless head,

The Blob started out with the powers of: Immovability, and a HIGH degree of invulnerability. In his first (IIRC) appearance he caught bullets in his fat and expelled them.

He was originally very strong but still considered human, but as time has gone one he's exhibited super strength. It has increased over the years.

His Gravity abilities have been up and down, from a high of smashing people great distances and being unaffected by the Vision's Phasing attack to simply explaining his immovability.

I think his strength is now somewhere near Doc Samson's level. Stronger than (say) the Wrecking Crew and Mr. Hyde but weaker than Colossus and the Thing.

I think he makes a great villain, and has even been given more depth at times.

[Enforcer84]

The Blob has always had superstrength. I just picked up the Essential Ms. Marvel #1, and he's shown slapping Wonder Man through a guard tower...that's back in 1981.

Specifically, Vision's quote on seeing that is: "That guard tower only marginally impeded Wonder Man's progress. His trajectory indicates that he will land somewhere in the West Bronx. It will be some time before he rejoins us."

Sounds like Double Knockback to me...
of course the Blob first appeared in the 60's/70's...

[Fedifensor]

of course the Blob first appeared in the 60's/70's...

True, but I consider the 80's to contain some of his best appearances. Besides, even 1981 is 27 years ago. Man, I feel old...

[ParagonAlpha]

Ummm, that was a joke.

I figured it was a joke. One of the greatest things I discovered about the gaming community is the lack of racism. I'm not saying it is out there but I've never stumbled on it.

As a black gamer/writer/comic-book fan, I find it a refreshing fortune.

Besides you have a picture of The Doctor, so you have to have some sense of humor.

[lemming]

As long as we're piling on regrettable X-Men, I have to give a partial vote to Maggott. Guy whose mutant power is his digestive system is actually two intelligent super-slugs named Eany and Meany who crawl out through his stomach and can eat anything, like a slug version of Matter-Eating Lad. Then they transmit the power to him, and he turns blue, gets really strong, and does other stupid things. Plus, his dumb accent. Conceptually, he's about as dumb as you can get. Who comes up with the idea for "guy with slugs in his stomach", anyways?
I'm guessing a random table some where.

"I rolled a 66! Special Chart!"

"Um, No powers, but I have a slug in my stomach that gives me powers? Roll on power generation again for it's powers?"

[CrosshairCollie]

You mean the incredible badass from the apocalyptic future where mutants are persecuted with the big gun and a mutant power that he almost never uses because the big gun is much kewler?

Nothing, I guess. I just hate black characters.

The problem with Bishop's mutant power is that it's entirely reactive. If nobody's there to hit him some sort of energy that he can redirect, his power doesn't do squat. Bishop is one of the few super-types who I can actually see having a good reason to pack a gun; his power is too situational to rely on.

[teh bunneh]

I never really read much of Bishop, but in the recent X-treme X-Men series, Claremont gives him a grab-bag of weird powers. Apparently now, he's got nanites that do stuff. "What sort of stuff," you ask? Pretty much whatever sort of stuff Claremont needs him to do, which work perfectly until Claremont needs them not to work. Just like everyone else in the book.

Pretty typical "He's a mutant, he's got powers!" Claremont writing, actually. :thumbdown

[MilkmanDan]

I'm guessing a random table some where.

"I rolled a 66! Special Chart!"

"Um, No powers, but I have a slug in my stomach that gives me powers? Roll on power generation again for it's powers?"

I'm trying to imagine a gaming system insane enough that something as weird as "power-giving slugs in my stomach" would appear on a random chart.

I'm guessing the word "Hybrid" is involved in said system.

[Doc Shocker]

I'm trying to imagine a gaming system insane enough that something as weird as "power-giving slugs in my stomach" would appear on a random chart.

I'm guessing the word "Hybrid" is involved in said system.

I'm thinking either the old Central Casting Character Background Generator books or the roll actually said "GM's Choice" and the GM was 12, didn't like the player, or was Rob Liefield.

[Balabanto]

Brother Power, The Geek!

If no one has mentioned it yet, someone should have!

Peace and Love! Take it to the MAN, Brother Power!

[DocSamson]

I am not a big fan of comic reliefs. I may get a few boos but I usually won't even buy comics where one of the following appears on the cover.

Impossible Man (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impossible_Man) - just too silly to live
Mister Mxyzlptlk (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mister_Mxyzptlk) - actually makes my @$$ hurt
Madcap (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madcap_%28comics%29) - based entirely on a bad episode of Star Trek?
Bizzaro (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bizarro) - just come one now! WTF!?!?
I must admit I have liked some incarnations of the character but not many.
Batroc (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batroc) - seriously? (just kidding bunny :) )

[teh bunneh]

Batroc (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batroc) - seriously? (just kidding bunny :) )

Georgette would be the first to admit her père was a clown. ;)

[gmurie]

@DocSamson: And yet in the X-Men movie they were able to reinvent the Toad into something quite cool. Though of course not having him be a fat guy in a jester's suit helped a lot. So maybe Batroc can reinvent himself into the big screen just as bad ass in the Captain America movie.

@ Lemming: It wouldn't surprise me if you could get slug stomach powers from Palladium's Heroes Unlimited or the old Marvel RPG expanded powers book. I got some damn weird characters off that second one.

[lapsedgamer]

AFAIK from being a Marvel Zombie in my youth and a "Much Smarter than Everyone" in my aged creaky nearly bodiless head,

The Blob started out with the powers of: Immovability, and a HIGH degree of invulnerability. In his first (IIRC) appearance he caught bullets in his fat and expelled them.

He was originally very strong but still considered human, but as time has gone one he's exhibited super strength. It has increased over the years.

His Gravity abilities have been up and down, from a high of smashing people great distances and being unaffected by the Vision's Phasing attack to simply explaining his immovability.

I think his strength is now somewhere near Doc Samson's level. Stronger than (say) the Wrecking Crew and Mr. Hyde but weaker than Colossus and the Thing.

I think he makes a great villain, and has even been given more depth at times.

There is a great Marvel Fanfare story with the Blob and Unus the Untouchable against the Hulk. Unus' powers are out of control and the Blob is taking care of him. The Hulk shows up and they all go at it. It shows a human side to all three characters in a way you wouldn't expect. I just read it again after about twenty years in a trade paperback reissue. It really stood the test of time. The trade is worth the money because there is also a great X-Men Savage Land story in there, along with the coolest Doctor Strange story I've ever seen. The Doctor Strange story has Charles Vess art!! Some of the rest of the stories are weak, but those three stories rock.

[ParagonAlpha]

I'm trying to imagine a gaming system insane enough that something as weird as "power-giving slugs in my stomach" would appear on a random chart.

I'm guessing the word "Hybrid" is involved in said system.

Try a game called HOL: Human Occupied Landfill. You can generate almost anything with that twisted character creation system.

Mutant, Cybernetic Oranges is all I have to say.