Supervillains and Philosophy

[Zane_Marlowe]

Hi Friends,

It's time I come clean: I'm editing the forthcoming volume in the Pop Culture and Philosophy series, Supervillains and Philosophy (http://www.opencourtbooks.com/books_n/supervillains.htm). I'm really excited about the stuff in the book, and I can't wait to see what you guys--my fellow Herophiles--think of it. I can tell you at present that it's going to include stuff on several of our favorite bad guys, and, like Tom Morris's 2005 volume on Superheroes, we're going to have a pair of industry contributors involved as well.

So, not that it'll impact what goes into the book in any way, but who are your favorite supervillains, without which no book of this kind would be complete?

[Vox]

Supervillains and Philosophy: Because Good Is Dumb


~Gabriel

[Split Decision]

Supervillains and Philosophy: Why You Just Don't Get Us

[Legatus]

Supervillains and Philosophy: The categorical imperative of power

Must haves:
Darkseid (DC)
Galactus (Marvel) - is he really evil? or is he more like a force of nature?

[Manic Typist]

And how many heroes seem a lot like villains if you consider certain things...

[Zane_Marlowe]

Okay, now I've got to come clean on the thread title. I'm still working on the subtitle for the book, but my wife wisely pointed out that if I open a thread for suggestions, I might similarly open myself or the publisher to legal risk in case we used one of the suggestions. So I edited the text, but I don't think I can change the thread title or "Question" label.

That said, I'm still happy to let you know the book is forthcoming, and I'm still interested to know who you think the paradigm cases are.

[Log-Man]

This is awesome! I'm reading "Batman & Philosophy" right now and I'm really enjoying it. It's a great mix of casual writing style and actual philosophical treatise. :thumbup:

I'm sure you're going to be hitting most of the 'must-haves' that immediately come to mind (the Joker, The Riddler, Two Face, Lex Luthor, Dr. Doom, Thanos, The Red Skull, etc.) but a less obvious contender I would like to see is Bizarro.

(BTW, I can edit the thread title if you need, just lemme know)

[Legatus]

Misinterpreted, hey?

Now what about Trigon? Kingpin? The Punisher? The Hulk? Loki? Monarch? Parallax?

[CoreBrute]

Something you have to put into your philosophy is some of the characters from Wanted, if just mentioning the whole thing nonchalantly.

Also Dr Doom. Con Wants to rule the world. Pro He would actually be good at it.

[Cancer]

So, not that it'll impact what goes into the book in any way, but who are your favorite supervillains, without which no book of this kind would be complete?

My regular comic-reading days are decades past, back in the Silver Age. That said, prototypical supervillains from that era include Dr. Doom, Lex Luthor, Galactus, Dormammu, and the suite of classical Batman foes (Penguin, Joker, Riddler, Catwoman), though Batman's enemies seemed to be less megalomaniacal than those others.

[Hermit]

Okay, now I've got to come clean on the thread title. I'm still working on the subtitle for the book, but my wife wisely pointed out that if I open a thread for suggestions, I might similarly open myself or the publisher to legal risk in case we used one of the suggestions. So I edited the text, but I don't think I can change the thread title or "Question" label.

That said, I'm still happy to let you know the book is forthcoming, and I'm still interested to know who you think the paradigm cases are.

Using my amazing moderator powers *cape flutters* I've taken the question header off this for you. I hope that's what you wanted.

And I agree with others, some of the classics are musts. Lex Luthor's raw envy of Superman has been well explored in the past, and the rationalizations he's used to defend his evil are fascinating. I see strong similarities between some takes on him and Syndrome of the Incredibles movie.

[Manic Typist]

See, I´m not sure if I buy Lex as Evil.

I almost root for the guy.

[Cygnia]

See, I´m not sure if I buy Lex as Evil.

I almost root for the guy.

Hell, my husband DOES root for the guy. Common self-made man worried about allowing too much power in the hands of a near-god equivalent (who we only have his word that he'll acquiesce to the proper legal and government authorities). Like it or not, that speaks to a LOT of real life people...

[Cancer]

Well, that's part of what makes him interesting, and why he should be in the book. Whether he's evil is an interesting question. There's no question, however, that he is the villain in the Superman stories. Villains do not have to be evil. The most interesting stories -- the tragedies -- are good against good. Good versus evil often just breaks down into shallow melodrama.

[Heckus]

Look to the classic archetypes:

-the greedy b*st*rd (90% of your garden variety bank robbing villains just want money)
-The complete lunatic (Joker)
-the thrill seeker (Riddler; He sets up eloborate puzzles to match wits with an opponent...and make a little cash on the side)
-the nihilist (Darksied; "Once I secure the secrets of the anti-life equation I will destroy the universe"...and yet he has loyal followers)
-the revenge obsessed (Baron Zemo; "[society/hero/whatever] is gonna pay for what they did to me.")
-the deluded savior (Magneto; "when I'm in control, everything will be as it should be")
-the inhuman monster (Chemo; usually powered by a mix of rage, hunger and confusion.)
-the mercenary (Only does it if he's getting paid).
-the bored rich guy (Kraven the Hunter)
-the megalomaniac (Dr. Doom, Red Skull, Lex Luthor; "when I'm in control, everything will run MY way")
-the under-appreciated genius (Dr. Octopus)
-the reluctant villain (Sandman [movie version]; he doesn't want to do bad things but for some reason he thinks he has no choice. If life had gone differently he might have been a hero)

[Zane_Marlowe]

Hermit, thanks for amending the header, this is perfect.

Yes, we've got something on Luthor and the Red Skull, and a lot more on Doom and Magneto relatively speaking. Joker, Watchmen, and some industry contributors: John Ostrander on the Suicide Squad and Denny O'Neil on Two-Face. I'm currently trying to pull off something amazing on the cover with a legendary artist, but I can't say more about that yet.

My gamer streak actually arranged a section of the book addressed to the readers themselves: "So You Want to be a Supervillain." Those essays are largely written in second-person, and they offer advice on the dos and don'ts.

Galactus, not so much. Two reasons. First, there's a whole essay on him in the 2005 book on Superheroes and Philosophy, and second, the point of that essay applies here perhaps as well, he's not a supervillain so much as a force of nature. He's no more a villain than a landslide, even if he's as inexorable and as cataclysmic. Oh yeah, and nobody submitted an essay on him either. :rolleyes:

As far as Wanted is concerned, I'm writing that essay now. :eg:

[The Main Man]

Man, I haven't read one of these books in a while.

[Vox]

I'd like to see something on Dr. Sivana. First, he's the prototype for Lex Luthor (most people aren't aware that Lex Luthor's character changed to mimic Sivana's during the years in which Captain Marvel was outselling Superman), and second the fight between Sivana and Captain Marvel is the original comic-book struggle between science and magic. :thumbup:

~Gabriel

[Tom]

.oO(Hmmmm) wonders if the old BA in Philosophy is too rusty to read these sorts of essays again...

[Sidume]

If you are looking at villians that have had an impact I think Black Manta deserves a mention. While Aquaman might not be as much of a pop culture icon as he was when he had his own show, what happen with Manta is a good example of how a villian makes an impact on a hero, or even on a genre. Black Manta's murder of Aquman's infant son redefined the entire Aquaman character, and was one of the first nails in the coffin of the Silver Age of comics.

[Enforcer84]

Hell, my husband DOES root for the guy. Common self-made man worried about allowing too much power in the hands of a near-god equivalent (who we only have his word that he'll acquiesce to the proper legal and government authorities). Like it or not, that speaks to a LOT of real life people...
So when Lex has all the power does he act benevolently with it?

[Badger]

So is Iron Man in the book?


*cough cough Civil War cough*

[Zane_Marlowe]

So is Iron Man in the book?


*cough cough Civil War cough*

One of my favorite essays is on "Marvel's Recent Unpleasantness," though I worry that that euphamism may be lost on most of us Yankees. You know, most everyone thinks about Stark, and yeah, he was the mover and shaker, but Reed gave the whole thing a heck of a push too.

[Cygnia]

So when Lex has all the power does he act benevolently with it?

Well, my husband IS a member of the Vast Hardcore Right Wing Conspiracy, so he's got that mindset to view things through. :p:rolleyes:

[Log-Man]

Hermit, thanks for amending the header, this is perfect.
Hey I edited the title!

No respect. No respect I tell you.

:(

[Zane_Marlowe]

Hey I edited the title!

No respect. No respect I tell you.

:(

Doh! Sorry, I was distracted by Hermit's fluttering cape. Have rep. :eek:

[Log-Man]

Doh! Sorry, I was distracted by Hermit's fluttering cape. Have rep. :eek:
Aww, thanks :D

Seriously, though, I've been looking forward to this title ever since I saw Superheroes & Philosophy on the shelf. I can't wait! :rockon:





No pressure ;)

[Narratio]

See, everybody puts the focus smack on the villains. What about the sycophants? Those Fritz's, Renfrews and Ygors who actually do the mucky stuff? Let's hear it for the Toad and all those other scum suckers whose existence is solely defined by thier masters. They're unappreciated and they know it.

[Zane_Marlowe]

See, everybody puts the focus smack on the villains. What about the sycophants? Those Fritz's, Renfrews and Ygors who actually do the mucky stuff? Let's hear it for the Toad and all those other scum suckers whose existence is solely defined by thier masters. They're unappreciated and they know it.

For that reason, we have an essay on why good help is hard to find. It's a kind of "Henchmen 101" for the aspiring criminal mastermind.

[Manic Typist]

Well, that's part of what makes him interesting, and why he should be in the book. Whether he's evil is an interesting question. There's no question, however, that he is the villain in the Superman stories. Villains do not have to be evil. The most interesting stories -- the tragedies -- are good against good. Good versus evil often just breaks down into shallow melodrama.


I agree that he´s definitely the villain (I´d call him Superman´s archnemisis even. In so many ways they are opposites, but without it becoming a gross simplification of what it means to not be a¨goody two shoes¨).

I see Lex as largely tragic. If his methods were just a LITTLE different... if he didn´t go QUITE so far... I´d back hm 100%. He has such great potential to help.... and a lot of the time he DOES help. He just does so differently, and at times I find his moral framework more persuasive than Superman´s.

And I don´t think Lex is necessarily right wing...

[Zane_Marlowe]

How would you compare Lex to the Red Skull then? Both are ordinary men with extraordinary ideals and visions of what humanity could be.

[Manic Typist]

How would you compare Lex to the Red Skull then? Both are ordinary men with extraordinary ideals and visions of what humanity could be.

Unkindly, although they are similar. Lex is someone who I can (ostensibly) empathize with and even admire, and agree with large portions of his beliefs.

Red Skull- not so much (all I know about Red Skull is he´s Captain America´s nemisis and a Nazi....right?). I´m sure a fascinating character if you delve into it, but I´d put Lex and Skull at opposite ends of the same spectrum.

[Legatus]

I am wondering what has happened to comics since I last read them. I never was much of a DC fanboy, but I always thought that Lex Luthor was a bad man.

[SKJAM!]

One character I'd like to see looked at is the one who actually named himself after his philosophy: Anarky (the first one, not the new replacement who thinks "anarchy" means "random violence.") Admittedly, he's a trifle obscure, but again, has an actual philosophy.

Lex: Yes, he's still a bad guy, but Post-Crisis, he's been made a little more complex, and some stories do in fact look at his viewpoint. It's made clear though that his ego gets in the way of him actually doing good for good's sake. He'll only do charity if he gets credit for it, do good for people only if it gives him power over them.

[Zane_Marlowe]

I'll warn that because the publisher wants to reach the largest possible audience, we're probably not going to have any of the more obscure villains. That said, we do have some interesting coverage of some of the more general concepts not attached to a particular character. For instance, there's an essay on what makes mad science mad, and a whole section on taking over the world.

[Zane_Marlowe]

Greetings would-be Supervillains! A bump and a quick update. The final cover art (http://www.opencourtbooks.com/books_n/supervillains.htm) is now appearing in the publisher's listings, and the book's street date is September 1st. I hope my friends here especially enjoy this, and I can report that everyone you'll read in the book turned out some really entertaining and insightful work. I'll be fascinated to see how people respond!

[BobGreenwade]

My "short list" of the Greatest Supervillains (in no particular order):

Lex Luthor
The Joker
Superman-Prime
Sinestro
Darkseid
Apocalypse
Magneto
Green Goblin
The Ultra-Humanite
Proteus
Foxbat

No, I'm not kidding about that last one. Foxbat is arguably the most original villain of the Champions Universe, without counterpart or parallel in any other superhero world (at least, that I'm aware of -- Ambush Bug is probably the closest).

[Naanomi]

I'd like to see something on the long-term perspective 'age spanning' villains... Vandal Savage, Kang the Conqueror and the like

[Zane_Marlowe]

I'd like to see something on the long-term perspective 'age spanning' villains... Vandal Savage, Kang the Conqueror and the like

That's a neat idea actually! There's a whole literature in bioethics about the implications of medical immortality (what happens when we get the technology to halt or reverse aging) that would be very interesting to apply to those characters. If you're interested, check out Leon Kass's article called "The Wisdom of Repugnance," where he challenges the idea that we'd want to be quite as long-lived as these characters.

I actually wanted an article on Kang and Time Travel, but didn't have time to slot it in. <scribbles notes for vol. 2!>

[Yansuf]

See, I´m not sure if I buy Lex as Evil.

I almost root for the guy.

Depends on which version of Lex you are thinking of.

[wcw43921]

I was wondering--are supervillains from outside of comics in this book? It goes without saying (yet I say it anyway) there are dozens, if not hundreds of ficticious characters that could certainly qualify. Professor Moriarity is one--Count Dracula is another, especially since many comic-book heroes have fought Dracula or someone like him at one point or another in their careers. Then there are all the James Bond villains, who are with very few exceptions powerful and amoral masterminds with designs on world domination.

There's Hannibal Lecter, quite possibly the smartest serial killer in literature and film. There's also Tyler Durden, creator of Project Mayhem, which threatened to destroy society as we know it. (Darned impressive for a figment of someone's imagination.)

Also, will there be anything about real-life "supervillains?" After all, if you're going to talk about the Red Skull, you have to talk about his boss--Der Fureher. There's Jack The Ripper, who's short but bloody career immediately made its mark onto the popular imagination--perhaps for all time. Heck, serial killers are the real-life equivalent of vampires--except I doubt they form underground communities like they do in books, TV shows, movies and RPGs.

Then there's Osama Bin Laden--Public Enemy No. 1. Give him and his followers fancy uniforms and fanciful technology, and they could be Cobra Commander and Cobra. Or THRUSH, HYDRA, or VIPER--take your pick.

Anyway, Good Luck with the book. May it be a best seller. :thumbup:

[Manic Typist]

Greetings would-be Supervillains! A bump and a quick update. The final cover art (http://www.opencourtbooks.com/books_n/supervillains.htm) is now appearing in the publisher's listings, and the book's street date is September 1st. I hope my friends here especially enjoy this, and I can report that everyone you'll read in the book turned out some really entertaining and insightful work. I'll be fascinated to see how people respond!


...this looks interesting, and I'll keep my eyes out for it.


When I looked at the page, however, what REALLY caught my eye was the description of your doctoral thesis that you're working on! I'd love to hear more about if, if you want to shoot me an e-mail or somesuch.

[SimComm]

I personally really liked Ozymadeus from Watchmen.
And Magneto from X-Men.

-SC

[Balabanto]

Here's my list of the top ten greatest supervillains of all time.

10. Amazo. Nothing beats a vengeful robot who has all the powers of the Justice League. I love a villain who the best way to defeat is to quit and then punch him in the head.

9. Lex Luthor. Sorry, Superman's Archenemy has slipped in the rankings since they made him so ridiculous and inconsistent that I can barely tell who he is anymore. Plus, people talk about him so much that he's been beaten to death.

8. The Green Goblin: The first nemesis to truly know a hero's secret identity and use it against him every chance he got, Spider-Man's so-called greatest foe only ranks in at #8. While the Goblin is a multiple personality disorder that makes him complicated for Spider-Man to deal with, that also makes him much less interesting as a character.

7. The Lord High Papal: (WHO?) The Lord High Papal was the villain of Dreadstar, a despicable bastard who ruled a galactic church and made ideological slaves out of an entire galaxy. This is probably Jim Starlin's finest work, and it really showed in the love for the characters. The Papal was a despicable foe, who was ridiculously powerful and still cheated at every turn. Even when he died, he managed to find a way back, and unlike a lot of other villains, he remained interesting even AFTER that. I really loved to hate this guy. I was so sorry the series eventually ended.

6. R'as Al'Ghul: When Neal Adams created R'as, he had really had no idea what he had tapped into. This guy was one of the first villains to really do bad things because not only did he hate the world, but because he thought he was RIGHT. In the end, R'as believed that his victory was inevitable, and of all the characters that were "added" to the Batman mythos after the sixties, he's had the most staying power.

5. Ultron: Ultron was the first Robot built by heroes that decided that they needed to die and have a world replaced with cold, mechanical robots. Without Ultron, we wouldn't have a lot of the stuff that came after him. Technically, you could say Hank is the real villain for being stupid enough to build Ultron, but technically, Ultron's legacy extends beyond his design.

4. Doctor Octopus: What's not to love about Doc Ock? Doctor Octopus is the villain who is Spider-Man's REAL greatest foe, no matter how much they try and talk up Norman Osborn. (See #8) Doctor Octopus has brains, and has always been one of the few people who's been able to consistently outsmart and out-fight Spider Man. The Goblin can be mentally manipulated, but when Doctor Octopus is on top of his game, Spidey is in for the fight of his life. Those tentacles are one of the most frightening things in the Marvel Universe, especially since he can be a hundred miles away and still control them. (Greatest Moment, when Spidey fought Octopus and his spare tentacles at the same time)

3. The Red Skull: Red Skull is just as funny looking as Despero, only meaner. Plus, If there wasn't a Nazi somewhere in the top ten, there would be a problem. Plus, this guy makes Baron Blitzkrieg look like a piker. Baron Blitzkrieg wears a funny suit of armor and is ugly. Red Skull knows how to use a Cosmic Cube! No matter how much you might think his reply is hazy, and you should ask later, this guy is evil incarnate. He has no mercy for anyone, even his own minions, and he's just a guy in a suit who disdains personal combat. I love the Red Skull. He makes other villains look shamefully inadequate. I keep thinking...what if some other villain was as cunning and nasty as the Red Skull? And then I think "Thank god they're not. There wouldn't be any comic books left to read."

2. Darkseid: What else can you say about a guy who wants to annhilate the universe and replace it with himself? This is so over the top that somehow, he still has followers despite it makes him kind of corny, but nonetheless, I love the big grey bastard.

1. Doctor Doom: There is no villain that is as eloquent, as poetic, as clever and as articulate as Doom. Doom wins because he does science better than anyone, and magic better than anyone except the most powerful sorcerer in the world. Doctor Doom has always captured the imagination, and most importantly, he has enough backup plans to keep his backup plans in backup plans. Plus, he was the first villain to really have his own country, where his word was law and the heroes couldn't touch him. "Want to arrest me? Don't be ridiculous! I rule here!"

[Zane_Marlowe]

@Balabanto: there is more interesting work on Dr. Doom in this book than you can shake a stick at, so you should find that rewarding.

@SimComm: There's an essay on the Watchmen in the book, and specifically on the ethical perspectives of the Watchmen, and whether or not these really would permit or imply as permissible Ozy's actions. Also, there are two essays dealing with Magneto in one way or another.

@WCW: Yes and no. All the villains featured in the book are comic book supervillains. However, there's a whole section entitled, "So You Want to Be a Supervillain" that takes on popular villain tropes, such as the paradox of being good at being bad, the problems with finding good Henchmen (and why that's so), and what I hope will be the most entertaining and insightful discussion of mad science you'll have ever encountered. My essay is in that section as well, and discusses Mark Millar's book, Wanted, in the context of a real life historical supervillain whom I'll not name because that reveal is part of the fun of the essay. I thought Wanted was an especially appropriate subject for the book because it's the one in which the bad guys win.

In all, there are 19 essays in the book (the same as Tom Morris's prior Superheroes and Philosophy book, interestingly) about a range of supervillains and supervillain tropes, not including the brief introduction that frames the examination of supervillains in the book. In this book we were fortunate to have industry contributions from John Ostrander and Dennis O'Neil, and if I hadn't mentioned it already, those two guys are each a real class act and very nice to work with.

For you guys who keep track of such things, we were fortunate to get the same cover artist that did Morris's prior Superheroes book, so there's a really neat visual continuity that connects the two. Of course, I have to say that I like the Supervillains cover better! I still wonder what that hooded guy's name is, and what nefarious plan he's contemplating? I'm sure I wouldn't find out until he'd captured me and was about to feed me to the sharks with the lasers on their heads, because at that point it would be appropriate to explain the master stroke of his plan. Of course, I'd also like to think that the superhero leaping into the sky on the cover of the first book would avert disaster before things went too far awry.

[Log-Man]

Greetings would-be Supervillains! A bump and a quick update. The final cover art (http://www.opencourtbooks.com/books_n/supervillains.htm) is now appearing in the publisher's listings, and the book's street date is September 1st. ...
Excellent! :rockon:



Once I have this book, nothing can stop me... :eg:

[teh bunneh]

I just put the book on my Amazon wish list. :thumbup:

[Zane_Marlowe]

Hey everyone, just a quick update for those who don't know. One of our contributors is industry veteran John Ostrander. I can tell you first hand the guy's a gem to work with, a real gentleman, and someone who's got a great publication history and is still knocking out great work. John has, however, been battling glaucoma, and as the late great epic poet John Milton will confirm, blindness does put a crimp in one's writing career. John's been undergoing expensive surgeries to correct this, but they're expensive, and to help offset that cost, a number of industry people have setup a charity called Comix4Sight.com.

At the site you can learn more about John's situation and how you might help out. At the very least, there is a bunch of original art donated for auction by some of today's hottest industry names, and you could come away with a cool print and help a good cause as well. Give it a look and trust me when I say that it couldn't be for a nicer guy.

Bonus tease: for you who want to know more about John's contribution to the Supervillains and Philosophy volume, I'll say that it's the only contribution I've seen in any volume I'm aware of that deals directly with Just War theory!

[Zane_Marlowe]

Hey Friends, a quick bump just to let you know the book's out now (as of a week ago I think). If anyone's had a chance to look at it, I'd love to hear what you guys think!

[Grimble]

The different incarnations of Lex Luthor. Powersuited Mad Scientist and Incarnation of Corporate Evil/President.

[Ranxerox]

@Balabanto: there is more interesting work on Dr. Doom in this book than you can shake a stick at, so you should find that rewarding.


Well, the guy is the fictional embodiment of man's attempts to use science and rationality to supplant God. It your can't rub a few philosophical sticks together about a guy like that, you aren't trying.

[Grimble]

I can't wait for this book. It will go right next to the other 5 books I have in this series.

[Steve]

I can't wait for this book. It will go right next to the other 5 books I have in this series.

Which ones do you have? Any that are really good?

[AnotherSkip]

There's Jack The Ripper, who's short but bloody career immediately made its mark onto the popular imagination--perhaps for all time. Heck, serial killers are the real-life equivalent of vampires--except I doubt they form underground communities like they do in books, TV shows, movies and RPGs.


err there may be the beggnnings of that according to some very scary police reports.

Jack is an overpublicised killer. Honestly his kill/time ratio isn't impressive.

[wcw43921]

err there may be the beggnnings of that according to some very scary police reports.

This is new to me. Elaborate, please?


Jack is an overpublicised killer. Honestly his kill/time ratio isn't impressive.

Perhaps not, compared to human monsters like Dahmer, Rifkin, Gacy and Gein. But as I said, at the time he captured the imagination like nothing else before--if for no other reason than he was never caught. Most of the time the public is unaware of a serial killer until his identity is uncovered--then they realize all those missing persons (assuming they were even aware of them) were actually his victims. But everyone knew about Jack's crimes as they happened, and no one was made to answer for them--which meant for a lot of people he was out there somewhere, waiting to strike again.

Or turn up in an episode of Star Trek.

[Yansuf]

This is new to me. Elaborate, please?

Perhaps not, compared to human monsters like Dahmer, Rifkin, Gacy and Gein. But as I said, at the time he captured the imagination like nothing else before--if for no other reason than he was never caught. Most of the time the public is unaware of a serial killer until his identity is uncovered--then they realize all those missing persons (assuming they were even aware of them) were actually his victims. But everyone knew about Jack's crimes as they happened, and no one was made to answer for them--which meant for a lot of people he was out there somewhere, waiting to strike again.

Or turn up in an episode of Star Trek.

Actually, it was Babylon 5.

[wcw43921]

Actually, it was Babylon 5.

I was thinking of the OS episode Wolf In The Fold. (http://www.startrek.com/startrek/view/series/TOS/episode/68732.html) Which Babylon 5 episode are you thinking of?

[Yansuf]

I was thinking of the OS episode Wolf In The Fold. (http://www.startrek.com/startrek/view/series/TOS/episode/68732.html) Which Babylon 5 episode are you thinking of?

Season 2, episode 21, "Comes the Inquisitor".

[gmurie]

I think one of the best examples of comic villain philosophy is the Order of the Stick's Xykon. Particularly at the close of prequel comic Start of Darkness, though some of the recent online comics about what makes a person powerful were also excellent.

[BoloOfEarth]

I can't wait for this book. It will go right next to the other 5 books I have in this series.

What, you're not even going to read it first? ;)

Which five do you have, BTW?

[Zane_Marlowe]

You know, I'll confess that I don't think we had a really great essay on Lex Luthor, or on the Kingpin, or on any of the other "supernormal" type villains. I kind of think that might have something to do with the fact that for someone like the Kingpin, there are already books out there that study the mafia, or the ethical bounds of science and industry if it's Lex Luthor. I think those characters as specific characters deserve better, but as an editor, I'll tell you, much of the shape of the book depends on what submissions you get.

So has anyone read it yet? I actually geeked out a few days ago when I discovered the book on the shelves of a Borders recently. Seriously, this must be what Steve Long feels like every day of his life!

[Yansuf]

So has anyone read it yet? I actually geeked out a few days ago when I discovered the book on the shelves of a Borders recently. Seriously, this must be what Steve Long feels like every day of his life!

I'm currently reading the Superheroes one; will get to yours after I finish it.

[The Rose]

...this looks interesting, and I'll keep my eyes out for it.

Same! It's a shame I didn't notice this thread originally.



When I looked at the page, however, what REALLY caught my eye was the description of your doctoral thesis that you're working on! I'd love to hear more about if, if you want to shoot me an e-mail or somesuch.

Same once again. This book and that thesis are definitely on my list of things to read.

--
So, anyone get a chance to read it yet? What did you think of it?

La Rose.

[Zane_Marlowe]

Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Supervillains-Philosophy-Popular-Culture/dp/0812696697/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1260377876&sr=8-1) and Barnes and Noble (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Supervillains-and-Philosophy/Ben-Dyer/e/9780812696691/?itm=1&USRI=supervillains+and+philosophy) now have reviews for the book, and I also found a little discussion in a blog called "Superhero Babylon (http://superherobabylon.blogspot.com/2009/11/supervillains-and-philosophy.html)." The Midwestern Book Review (http://www.midwestbookreview.com/lbw/nov_09.htm) mentioned it briefly as well, though their review (just noticed) is one of those in the Amazon list. From what I can discern, people seem to be receiving it well, though not all topics interest everyone equally.

EDIT: Links added for teh bunneh

[teh bunneh]

Linkies? :)

[Zane_Marlowe]

Added!

[Zane_Marlowe]

Another review of the book appeared at Pop Matters (http://www.popmatters.com/pm/review/118541-supervillains-and-philosophy-by-ben-dyer-ed/) if anyone's interested. I just want to go on record as saying I endorse the idea of Leonard Cohen recording it as an audio book. Of course, if we get to just pick any names we like, I suppose I'd have to pick out either James Earl Jones or Hugo Weaving ahead of Cohen.