leogolas?

[Michael Hopcroft]

Did anyone ever post a HERO writeup of the movie Legolas from the LOTR films? I'm curious to see two things.

1. How high a DEX you would give him, and....

2. How to write up some of the amazing things he can do with a bow and arrows (including using an arrow as a melee weapon).

[Old Man]

1. I wouldn't give Legolas a DEX much higher than 20. He's not that fast or agile so much as that he's really good with a bow and his swords. I'd be inclined to do that stuff with levels instead.

2. I'd just define a melee arrow as a knife with a breakage roll.

[Blue Jogger]

Anybody can use an arrow without a bow. I believe it's -3 OCV to use a weapon that you are untrained in (you might need to make a called shot to an unarmored area (more minuses) or take your chances). Something tells me, Legolas has WF: arrow as a melee weapon.

Assuming normal characteristic maximum, I would put most combat-trained elves at around 17 to 23 DEX. Elves have hundreds of years to become combat-trained, humans have about a decade. I would give him levels in Sweeping (2 shots per phase) and a 4 SPD. And assume that orcs are SPD 2 and have pretty lousy DCV (did anyone miss an orc if the orc didn't block?).

Remember that Legolas probably missed lots of shots, just not on camera.

EDIT: Still +10 OCV w/Bow is only 20 points. :D

[Lupus]

Originally posted by Blue Jogger
Anybody can use an arrow without a bow. I believe it's -3 OCV to use a weapon that you are untrained in (you might need to make a called shot to an unarmored area (more minuses) or take your chances). Something tells me, Legolas has WF: arrow as a melee weapon.
Sounds about right to me. I'd give an arrow pretty crap damage, though. :) Better take that -12 OCV to hit the eye! (I forget what book those extra hit locations were in... was it Eye for an Eye?) Helps if you use impairing/disabling and rule that any minor NPC who takes an impairing wound to the head or torso is out of combat/dead.


Assuming normal characteristic maximum, I would put most combat-trained elves at around 17 to 23 DEX. Elves have hundreds of years to become combat-trained, humans have about a decade. I would give him levels in Sweeping (2 shots per phase) and a 4 SPD. And assume that orcs are SPD 2 and have pretty lousy DCV (did anyone miss an orc if the orc didn't block?).

Remember that Legolas probably missed lots of shots, just not on camera.

Yeah, I'd put Leggy at over 20 DEX. 'Course, he has to pay double for that extra dex. He won't get it for free. As for orcs being defensive, almost all his shots were at pretty close range. He'd have good bonuses to hit, and range penalty skill levels (those big shots he did when going down the huge stairs).

He also handily uses two knives (fast-drawn, natch)... but remained perfectly defensive.That campaign was possibly using the easygoing rules for two-weapon fighting, though. Or perhaps he bought Deadly Blow, defining it as 'hitting multiple times with two weapons.' (cost reduced by taking the 'two-handed' limitation?) Oh! And possibly a variation on the cleave feat from FH... can kill two people with a single arrow, if the second one is directly behind the first. Doesn't take an enormous number of points to make a combat monster. It'd take a serious points-squeeze to get him in under 200, though.


EDIT: Still +10 OCV w/Bow is only 20 points. :D
And penalty skill levels (bow, targetting) and (bow, range) are damn cheap, too. ;)

Say, how would you do his snow-walking? Ground gliding?

[sbarron]

Here is the link from Surbrooks stuff that has HERO write-ups by Scott Nolan for all the LOTR charcters.

http://www.devermore.net/surbrook/adaptionsbook/bookchar.html

It is a little bit on the lower powered end, and appears to be based on the books rather than the movies. But they are excellent write-ups and seem to be pretty comprehensive.

Edit: When I say low powered, I mean in their characteristics. It is hard to be low powered at 300+ points. :)

[RadeFox]

Akin to that, it is good to bear in mind when doing LOTR stuff in Hero (or any other game sytem), that the Fellowship members were all paragons of thier race/culture. With the notable exception of the hobbits, who just learned damn quick in the forge of peril, :P So the Gimli's and Legolas's and Aragorns would be ver far removed from the Hero fantasy starting base of 75+75 or even 100+100. They were the best of the best, who else would wise Elrond have chosen to trust and burden with so important a task. IMO, there were only a handful of elven elders and few remaining istari who would have been more 'Points powerful", but these figures were far too heavily stalked by the Eye of Sauron.

In gaming terms then, the members of the fellowship were all those folks just on the brink of major herodom. Folks with mighty, if unsung or untested mettle, who were not yet under the scrutiny of Sauron. in AD&D, Id place them all around 9-10th level at the forming of the Fellowship, with the hobbits trailing in around 3-5th. For Hero, maybe place them around 75+75+150xp. So Nolans not far off. :)

[Old Man]

Originally posted by sbarron
Here is the link from Surbrooks stuff that has HERO write-ups by Scott Nolan for all the LOTR charcters.

http://www.devermore.net/surbrook/adaptionsbook/bookchar.html

It is a little bit on the lower powered end...


Actually too low powered. Even in the books Legolas is capable of doing amusing things like discerning the hair color on a horseman from thirty miles away.

[Thirdbase]

I saw yesterday the Discovery Channel show on the death of Ootsi(?), the 6000 year old iceman found in the Alps. He was killed by an arrow shot at 30m or so. A trained archer in similar terrain had a hard time making the shot with a modern stabilized compound bow. The shot was uphill on a windy mountain side.

The show was pretty good and had some interesting info on earlier archery.

[Old Man]

I reckon you'd get real good at archery if missing meant that you went hungry for the day.

[Delthrien]

Originally posted by Old Man
I reckon you'd get real good at archery if missing meant that you went hungry for the day.

Amen!

[Delthrien]

Originally posted by Blue Jogger
(snippage)

Remember that Legolas probably missed lots of shots, just not on camera.

(post snippage)

Hey, no fair using "non-displayed" (and perhaps nonexistent) footage for an argument... :)

However, if you just take the Moria footage as an example, Elf-boy was dropping orcs and goblins at well over 100 yards in lighting conditions that were, at best, dim. And with shots in the eyes/face, no less. Someone who's been kicking around for a millennia or two can be expected to be obscenely good with his chosen weapons.

But you're right, though. Those OCV levels are both cheap and useful. :D

[Bartman]

Originally posted by Thirdbase
I saw yesterday the Discovery Channel show on the death of Ootsi(?), the 6000 year old iceman found in the Alps. He was killed by an arrow shot at 30m or so. A trained archer in similar terrain had a hard time making the shot with a modern stabilized compound bow. The shot was uphill on a windy mountain side.

How did they figure out the range of the shot and the conditions at the time? Last I heard the only evidence was the arrow head they found inside the guy. This sounds more like some dramatic interpretation on The Discovery Channel's part.

[Markdoc]

>>>>Elf-boy was dropping orcs and goblins at well over 100 yards in lighting conditions that were, at best, dim. <<<<

Sure, but you have to figure he was dropping the DCV2 orcs in heavy armour (DCV0). Remember, he screws up the important shots on the running guy with the big magnesium flare (Ok, so he hits, but doesn't even stun him...) :D

cheers, Mark

[Vondy]

I'd build him with a 20 DX, WF: Arrow, and Elvish [Zen] Archery from the UMA - and a ton of skill levels.

[Thirdbase]

Originally posted by Bartman
How did they figure out the range of the shot and the conditions at the time? Last I heard the only evidence was the arrow head they found inside the guy. This sounds more like some dramatic interpretation on The Discovery Channel's part.

They made a bow and arrows similar to the one found with the body, took a half of a pig, covered it like the body was and fired arrows at the pig until they found the range at which the penetration was similar. The first shot at close range put the arrow about halfway through. I don't know how many shots they tried at the various ranges, but they did do some testing.

They have, since the initial finding of the arrow head, found quite a bit. 4 different DNA samples from blood, defense wounds on the hands and body, human blood on some of the arrow shafts he was carrying.

[Trencher]

[i]:) Better take that -12 OCV to hit the eye! (I forget what book those extra hit locations were in... was it Eye for an Eye?) [/B]

It was in dark champions and it is a - 10 penalty to ocv not 12