Team Base... Who pays?

[Super Squirrel]

This may be covered in Champions and if it is, please tell me so. I have long wondered how to handle this.

Team bases are fun, but not if you are the character paying for the whole thing. That is the case in the case of my character in a campaign. I'm dishing out 20 points from my character to cover the team base. Should I be expected to pay for improvements or should the team cough it up?

What do you guys do for team bases?

[MisterVimes]

Originally posted by Super Squirrel
This may be covered in Champions and if it is, please tell me so. I have long wondered how to handle this.

Team bases are fun, but not if you are the character paying for the whole thing. That is the case in the case of my character in a campaign. I'm dishing out 20 points from my character to cover the team base. Should I be expected to pay for improvements or should the team cough it up?

What do you guys do for team bases?

I usually have each member of the team kick in some points and themn total the points to determine how much they have for the base.

EX: Right now I have 6 players with 11 points in the Base (each) that's 66x5=330 points in the base.

[JmOz]

My way of handling it is somewhat odd

I make everyone pay three points for a perk called member of Team, as a member it gives them access to a base and a vehicle (or fleet of) of my design, the whole thing is if they get a aircraft it might be supersonic or have stealth capabilities but it will not be a combat vehicle, the base might have some defences but again it is not a fortress.

This way if you have a Batman type character who wants to be using vehicles etc...he has to pay for the whole thing instead of using the x2 rule, but still makes the character chip in some

[Lord Liaden]

Don't have the new Champions handy so I can't check if there were any changes, but in the old BBB the last incarnation of the Champions paid for their base and team vehicle just as Mr. Vimes describes. I've always followed that pattern in my own games; since everyone on the team shares in the benefit of these things together, it seems fair.

[Monolith]

Most teams divide the cost of the Base, Vehicle, and Computer between them. This is how it is recommended in Champions.

My team's base, vehicle, and computer system were paid for by the base's DNPC. No one had to pay any points for the basic equipment, but if they want to do any upgrades they will have to shell out the character points for them.

[Talon]

Somewhere in some version, they suggest giving the character's a base "on credit", then taking some of their XP as the campaign goes on.

[MisterVimes]

Originally posted by Geoff Speare
Somewhere in some version, they suggest giving the character's a base "on credit", then taking some of their XP as the campaign goes on.

I think that's in the discussion on HOMESTEAD in the Champions book.

[Super Squirrel]

Okay, so having dished out what I think is 20 points to the base, I'll basically sit back and let them take care of improvements. Considering they don't have a decent way into the base, they can make that their concern. (Megascale Teleport would be nice). ;)

[nblade]

Originally posted by Geoff Speare
Somewhere in some version, they suggest giving the character's a base "on credit", then taking some of their XP as the campaign goes on.

While this might be in the Champions book, I know it was in The old Strike Force book.(which I still reread every once in a while).

In my current campaign, I'm going to be following the suggestion of giving the players a base/vehicle for free, but have them pay for any impovements. Since both are fairly barebones, most players will want to spend pts to improve the place.

[JohnOSpencer]

I just gave my characters thier base, they are sponsored by a local businessman. Of course they have no control on who gets hired, what gets done to it, and I can take it away without them whining "I spent points on that!"

John Spencer

[Blue]

In my case, I designed the base and assigned it to an NPC. The heroes have been given full run of the place. This means it has all the features I want it to have and that I feel are appropriate to the campaign. And the players can concentrate on their characters with their points instead.

[misterdeath]

Originally posted by JmOz
My way of handling it is somewhat odd

I make everyone pay three points for a perk called member of Team, as a member it gives them access to a base and a vehicle (or fleet of) of my design, the whole thing is if they get a aircraft it might be supersonic or have stealth capabilities but it will not be a combat vehicle, the base might have some defences but again it is not a fortress.

This way if you have a Batman type character who wants to be using vehicles etc...he has to pay for the whole thing instead of using the x2 rule, but still makes the character chip in some

FWIW, this is the system I use too.

The points for the Member of a Team perk range from 1 to 20, depending on the resources the team has available, ranging from a meeting place in an old warehouse, and a used icecream truck as a vehicle for a point a piece, to an organization with large land, underwater, and satellite bases, with high speed supersonic underwater spaceworthy transports, and one warp capable ship for just such an emergency for 20 points.

Of cource, the vehicles are more plot devices, than combat things (if Steelhawk wants a fighter plane, he'd best pony up the points--otherwise, well, "damn, there goes another plane.")

D

[MCMaenza]

This has varied from game to game I've run. A lot depends upon the players involved. Some will have characters who will benefit more from a base - and thus they put more points in. Other times, its an equal split of the cost - to be paid either up front or on installments from their earned XP. Other times, I've had players that didn't want to pay for a base. That team then got something provided to them by the sponsored city - in this case, it was Rough Justice setting up as Baltimore's premier super-team. Of course, they got what they paid for - which wasn't much. Laser and a trio of villains called the Enforcers ended up bringing the place down on top of the heroes in the final run of the game. ;)

[Chimpira]

Wow, MCMaenza. You really went digging around the backyard tonight. Most of this stuff was posted in 2003. Good stuff though.

I make the characters pay for it unless they are willing to be sponsored or become a government run organization. this is the way it works.

1. If you want no affiliation: The team must pay the points themselves. It is more expensive but for the most part it is their own. They might not have the latest toys but they owe no one.

2. Find a Sponsor: The players chip in points and for every point they put in, the sponsor will match them. The sponsor would have some say in what goes on but can be ignored for important matters. The nature of their secret identities might come up for debate. (the sponsor wouldn't mind knowing them and the players would) Different sponsors work different ways but the players can find the sponsor that matches their temperment much easier.

3. Government backed: The players do not have to put in a dime. It is bought for them lock, stock and barrel. Of course they will have more trouble refusing requests and things start to get more political with disallowing certain heroes from speaking in public (you looked intelligent until you opened your mouth), barring the heroes from going to certain countries (we are in the middle of a delicate negotiation right now. I'm certain we can handle everything through diplomatic channels). The players would have to tell their secret identities to the government and undergo an intense background check. On the upswing the will have some of the best PR people in the business and be granted certain federal powers.

[MCMaenza]

Chipira, everything old is new again to someone. ;) I'm kind of cherrypicking the old threads to read based on the titles and interest. There's a ton of past stuff for someone new to the boards to review (even though I joined back in 2004, I've just recently got back into Champions stuff - like putting my campaign world online via my website - for example). I'll be prudent on which old threads I comment on. ;)

[levi]

My way of handling it is somewhat odd

I make everyone pay three points for a perk called member of Team, as a member it gives them access to a base and a vehicle (or fleet of) of my design, the whole thing is if they get a aircraft it might be supersonic or have stealth capabilities but it will not be a combat vehicle, the base might have some defences but again it is not a fortress.

This way if you have a Batman type character who wants to be using vehicles etc...he has to pay for the whole thing instead of using the x2 rule, but still makes the character chip in some


Doesn't sound odd to me at all, in fact I do the same thing. My teams also get a free contact with the Police Lt. in charge of the Superhuman Crimes Task Force (or whatever I decide to call it for that campaign) I guess mediocre minds do think alike.

[Chuckg]

In my 'Aegis' campaign, I gave the characters a free base, with these caveats:

* Since the DM is paying for it, the DM reserves the right to design the base. Any design features above and beyond the minimum I provide must be paid for by the characters.

* Since the DM is paying for it, the DM reserves the right to take the base away during the course of the campaign, if doing so would service the plot. (i.e. -- the team loses their official sponsorship, Dr. Overkill blows the place up, it gets eaten by a giant mutant star goat, etc.)

[Kirby]

The games I've been in (where there have been bases) the PCs have the base on credit and pay back with an XP or two each time they receive XP. This is generally how I do it when I run a game. However, I have had a campaign where the PCs were in a city with another team (Freedom Squad) and when that team was slowly eliminated, the PCs ended up taking that base. (Basics from VOICE of Doom.)

[Enforcer84]

Well, I just started a new campaign. The characters are going to get a warehouse style base and upgrades will be paid by them.

[GoldenAge]

Well, I just started a new campaign. The characters are going to get a warehouse style base and upgrades will be paid by them.

Similarly, I give my players a place to stay for free. There are usually several added bonuses to living there as well.

Then, I make them spend the points for upgrades and anything else they feel is necessary. Players join forces for general upgrades but pay seperately for lab abd private room additions.

Here's the thread about the base I made for my current players:

http://www.herogames.com/forums/showthread.php?p=743818#post743818

[austenandrews]

When I run a game, the campaign setup generally includes a base.

The last Champs game I played in, I bought a base entirely with my own character's points, just because I wanted one. Everyone got to use it, of course.

[Cancer]

Our current, albeit idling, Champions campaign, has us being a fledgling hero group. We're paying our own experience points to build a base, though one of the GMs has said they will do some sort of matching of contributions. We are talking among ourselves (sort of; like I said, the campaign is idling) about what the base will have, so we can design it before we start pouring concrete.

The other GM, though, has made comments about not wanting the characters to have a fortress where they can hide out, with the implication that he intends to destroy (or at least render inoperable to at least a considerable degree for much of the time) whatever the players set up. That dampens my enthusiasm for a base considerably. Whether he realizes it or not, it also is a pretty firm statement against characters with big investments in skills, especially analytical and science skills, who need a lab to do their shtick.

[Matt Frisbee]

Usually, if the campaign concept calls for a tightly knit team, then the characters split the cost of the base and any vehicles, which are bought at the time of character creation. I've only run one campaign where a character decided he wanted a base and bought it with experience points.

One other campaign had the same player suggest purchasing a base and the characters pooled their points for a session and bought an ugly little hole in the ground with a kick *** mobile command post. The campaign fell apart two sessions after that. In fact, it has been my experience that the purchase of a base signals the impending end of a campaign in Champions. *sigh*

I'm of the the opinion that if the characters really want one, they should shell out the points and design it themselves.

Matt "Old-school-GM" Frisbee

[TheQuestionMan]

The GM shaves points awarded from each session for Team Bases, Team Vehicles, Base Computers, and Base Automatons.


Cheers

QM

[Kevin Schultz]

I consider bases to fall under the same rules as foci: you don't have to spend points on it, but if you don't, they can be easily damaged, stolen, or otherwise taken away from you.

For this same reason, I allow all my superheroic PC's to wear body armor and carry firearms; it's just that most of my villians have Indirect (only through real armor) and Insubstantial (Real Damage only) or DCV +10 (real attacks only). The PC's are allowed to take such powers as well, even if it violated campaign caps.

In doing so, it allows me to design "bulletproof" villians, while at the same time having Weaponmaster PC's who don't feel sidelined; as long as they paid points for thier guns and armor (and as long as they didn't take the "Real Weapon" limitation), the rules for "real equipment" don't affect them. It also implies that you can determine, in game, if something is a foci or not. To those who are aware of it, it's considered to be a boarderline meta power, on par with samurai "becoming one with their swords".

Back to bases - with those rules in mind, I let PC's purchase things with wealth with no limitation; with the implied understanding that if you purchase it with ONLY wealth, it's going to be trashed by metahuman activity on a regular basis, and you really won't get a lot of heavy use out of it. If they're fine with that, then I have no problems giving it to them.

[Plex]

When I was a player we all chipped in XP to pay for the base. What we couldn't cover was done so through disads, government influence, and other interesting side effects that the GM would come with. (Like an AI with a wicked sense of humor/practical jokes.)

For the campaign I will be starting up shortly, I'll be giving the base to the PCs. Since only 1 of my 8 players has actually played the Hero System before, I thought it would be interesting to give them a base to use. This base doesn't come without some interesting side effects, though. The base was built originally by a Tony Stark type of person. He and his group disappeared about 10 years ago in an alternate dimension. The AI running the base did not know where they went, and has spent the time since then keeping up the base and appearances at the office. (They're stuck in a magical dimension and the AI cannot see magic.) The AI will recruit the players in the guise of the Tony Stark character- albeit "damaged" from some experiment gone awry. (Actually a construct that the AI works through.) He's recruiting them for the purpose of finding out what happened to the team and of course to protect him- as in the AI- from Mechannon, who in my universe was accidentally created by the AI. There is also a magic lab in the base that the AI doesn't know is there and it is locked. The players will need to get in there to find out what happened to the team that is stuck in the alternate dimension. Eventually they will get the team back to this world- I hope. Then the real fun will begin since the original owners will want their base back....

Ooops, I think I got a little off topic there.

Well, that's what I plan on doing in a nut shell. There's more to it than that.

[clsage]

This may be covered in Champions and if it is, please tell me so. I have long wondered how to handle this.

Team bases are fun, but not if you are the character paying for the whole thing. That is the case in the case of my character in a campaign. I'm dishing out 20 points from my character to cover the team base. Should I be expected to pay for improvements or should the team cough it up?

What do you guys do for team bases?

A lot of others have already mentioned most of what I'd be saying,
so I won't repeat them....I will mention tho' that (and I believe it
was back in the BBB, not sure if it's in 5th) that bases are eligable
to get disads. So if your base was bought and paid for by the Feds,
then the base gets a Monitored disad, depending on how much the
Feds want back from the heroes (do they assign a "minder" on staff,
do the heroes have to take any and all assignments from the
government, etc). And of course, if the base is under some stately
manor somewhere in the suburbs there is the Distance disad....and
so on.

Just my $.02US. If I'm already telling you stuff you know please pardon....:)

-Carl-

[jkwleisemann]

My general take on it? It depends on the campaign.

Generally, as a GM, I make it clear that the players will (if the campaign setup warrants it) have a base of their own. They'll even have communicators. Heck, I'll even give them free contacts to all manner of organizations if it makes sense.

But if they haven't paid for it or earned it, they can't *rely* on any of it.

Communicator batteries can be down at any time. The villains want to jam communications? No problem. Sure, they don't have a jammer that they paid for, but unless somebody paid *points* for HRRP or something, it's not like the heroes have comms that *they* paid for, is it?

Bases can be blown sky-high. They can be taken over by the baddies. You can miss a rent payment and get evicted.

Vehicles? Same thing.

Contacts? They can get offed whenever I want, be busy, be hostile - the NPC "leader" of the team can get himself killed, and all of his precious governmental contacts suddenly clam up because, frankly, They're Only Clear to Talk to Him.

If they *do* decide to pay for them though, it's theirs. They can pay for it however they want. Does the team Medic want to pay for a large lab to work in, and nobody else wants to shell out the points? No problem. The lab is the *only* thing that'll survive if the rest of the base gets shredded.

From a *player* perspective... I honestly don't mind paying for the base very much... at least not as long as the other players are willing to do one thing.

Recognize that it's *my* base.

They can't rely on it any more than they can rely on me loaning them my Blaster Pistol. Maybe a bit more - after all, it doesn't cost me anything to loan it out. Y'wanna room there? Fine. You want to use the Healing Pods before I put in the injured Bad Guy I have to interrogate? Hmm.... well, really, it *is* my base. You don't like it? Well, we could use some defenses here, I'd be *more* than willing to let you guys chip in, and then we can talk about you having dibs on the other powers the Base has.

Maybe it's petty, but see the comparison to loaning out a Focus. If my Power Armor character doesn't let the team's martial artist borrow his armor while he's on patrol and I'm not, is that being petty? Heck, the GM would probably *scream* if I *tried* to do that!

Maybe a Base is different - meant to be used by more than one person - but if *I* put the points into it... well, to me, I don't see that big a difference in the end. Especially if *I'm* expected to pick up the defenses you guys are all benefitting from, rather than just the powerful Healing that I built into it mostly for convenience's sake.

[Kirby]

In the current campaign I run, a group of NPCs has paid for the base and its upgrades, the PCs just happen to be in (relative) control of the base.

In a game I'm a player in, the base was donated by the city/GM, so anything goes (and it's an eyesore to a master villain in the game/city, so there'll be conflict).

The other game has just started, but when the GM ran it before, our "base" was an abandoned hotel we decided to live in.

[incrdbil]

Seeing as a base is usually a plot hook quite often, and just somethign expected..and terribly expensive just to get genre staples, as GM I often match, or greatly exceed player contributiosn with freebies. Unless the players want to build the wonder-widget of doom, then they can pay for all of it. But I'll usually find a way to make the basic walls, size living essenetials, and power inexpensive or free. There's far more interesting things for PC's to be using XP on than a base.

As a rule of thumb, I've been kicking in 25 points of base stuff per player--just to represent the resources any superhero can contribute to building a base through skills, effort, or brute strength. And for really big scale games, I'll translate 1 xp to 10 or 15 active points, no problem.

It's not likes bases save the world.


If mobility is a problem, and I need them to be mobile a basic non-armed vehicle might be donated. The players can add fancy widgets.

I remember playing in early champions, with the usual snails pace of XP per session, paying for bases just sucked, and a lot of us wanted to avoid having a base, because it just seemed to keep us from developing our PC's. For the techno-based characters who loved tinkering in labs, that sucked. I dont want my PC's to feel that way.

However, when campaigns get long in the tooth, and copius experience points can't find a home, a base can be a fine place to absorb that excess.

[Tech]

We have a rather random way of handling it: a base is created how we, the players, want it. The players are then asked to pay for it. Points are needed of course, but usually the players have a large amount of points already set aside for the creation of the base. Various players pay various points but I've yet to hear anyone complain. We're a fun group. :thumbup:

[Kenn]

Effectively, I hand wave it. I make every team member pay a portion of the cost for the team vehicles and bases... and then increase the Base Points the characters are built at to take care of the points I made them spend.

[BoloOfEarth]

As a GM, I would prefer the players paid for the base. I'd also prefer that they write up the stats and draw up the map. Heck, one campaign I even offered 5 free XP each for anyone who did any of the following (if they did more than one, they got 5 for each they did):
(1) Character picture
(2) Semi-detailed character background
(3) Write up stats for base or vehicle
(4) Draw map of base

An industrious person could come out 20-25 XP ahead (and incidentally get really into the character and game). I got two backgrounds (we have five players) and, about a year or two into the game, a map of the base.

My current campaign, the city is donating a base and local companies and wealthy individuals are donating equipment / money for it. Since the players aren't putting any points into it, like others have said here, it's fair game. The location is a former VIPER base (with a factory above), so you can guess who is going to come calling eventually. Their prime benefactor, a local millionaire, has already been kidnapped once and used as bait to draw in the heroes. (I'm making him a DNPC for the base, so IMO it's fully justified.) Since the bulk of the excavation and structure was built already, a sizable portion of the base is actually paid for by an unwilling donation from VIPER. Throw in that Hunted, and they've got a decent number of points to start with. I have various plans for how the donated equipment / money will affect things.

So, even though the players aren't paying for it, I'm good. Most GMs love free plot hooks, the more the better. :sneaky:

[Kirby]

Heh, nice, Bolo.