New Power/Advantage - Control

[Ice9]

Reading the Teleport Redirection thread, I think it would be useful to have a way to directly control an instance of someone else's power - directly, not via controlling/transforming the user.
I'm not sure whether this is better suited as a new adjustment power, or an advantage for Dispel, but the basic concept is this:

Control
Cost: 5 points/die?
As Dispel, except that it can be used on Instant powers by readying an action (or with the Trigger advantage). Instead of cancelling the power, it gives you control over how it is targetted/used. While you control the power's use, it still originates from the target, and normal target restrictions still apply (so you can't steal Regeneration by Controlling it, for instance).
Like Dispel, Control affects one specific activation of the power, so if you want to maintain control of a repeatedly-used power (hacking the targetting system on a foe's missiles, for instance), then you need the Continuous advantage.

Examples of Use:
Teleport Redirection
A Master Illusionist taking control of someone else's illusions
Storm King redirecting Lightning Rod's hurricane.
A cyberkinetic hacking a powersuit foe's systems.

So does this sound workable? And does 5 points/level seem like an appropriate price?

[IndianaJoe3]

Reading the Teleport Redirection thread, I think it would be useful to have a way to directly control an instance of someone else's power - directly, not via controlling/transforming the user.

I disagree. I think Mind Control (appropriately modified) would work just as well. For example:

Teleport Redirection: Mind Control 12d6 (Human class of minds), Telepathic (+1/4), Attack Versus Alternate Defense (Power Defense; +1/2), Trigger (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger requires a Half Phase Action to reset; +1/2) (135 Active Points); Set Effect (Teleport where I want you to) (-2)

I'm assuming that making the target teleport to the location of your choosing requires the EGO+20 level of effect, and that most casters will have bought a little extra EGO. I chose Power Defense as an alternate defense because this shouldn't be a Mental Power, and it seemed an appropriate way to model magical resistance. I also assumed it would be less common than Mental Defense.

[dmjalund]

But Mind control targets the persons EGO, Control would probably target the Active Points of the Power - In fact, it's closer to the concept of using Tranform, but targeting a specific activation/use of a power

I believe that the idea thet the character is controlling the effect of the power rather than the person using it.

[Ice9]

While Mind Control works in some cases, it has three major problems:
1) Even with AVAD, the difficulty is based on the foe's EGO, which doesn't make sense for many power controlling situations. Equally importantly, it isn't based on the strength of the power.
2) It doesn't work on pre-existing powers - for instance, encountering an illusion (Images) that another mage has created, and seizing control of it.
3) If the foe is unable to act (Presence attacked, for instance), then you can't control their powers.

[dmjalund]

How hard would it be just to modify Transform to do this (and similar) stuff

Like:
Changing the Special Effect of an attack
Reshaping the area of an Area Effect attack
Change the Class of Mind that someones Mind Scan affects

[Hugh Neilson]

How hard would it be just to modify Transform to do this (and similar) stuff

Like:
Changing the Special Effect of an attack
Reshaping the area of an Area Effect attack
Change the Class of Mind that someones Mind Scan affects

Rather than Transform, why not Change Enviironment? Either could be viable depending on the result envisioned. CE would redirect the power as long as the character redirecting focuses on it, while Transform would have a longer term effect, lasting until it heals or the reversal condition is met.

[Lucius]

Well, we have one Power than can turn off another Power:

DISPEL

I propose that from this it is possible to logically derive a Power to turn on another Power

IMPEL

or to control another Power

COMPEL

In fact, Compel might be the most general and expensive Power, with Impel and Dispel being limited special cases.

Lucius Alexander

The palindromedary claims they all derive from the same Latin root, but that's all Greek to me

[Derek Hiemforth]

I think Mind Control (appropriately modified) would work just as well.I agree that Mind Control is (to me) the logical Power to compare to when thinking about how we might approach this (instead of Dispel). However, I disagree that this would just be an instance of Mind Control.

I'd probably start by going the other direction... Could we build a more general "Control" Power, where if it was limited to controlling Minds, would work and cost as Mind Control currently does? So I think I'd start with a cost structure closer to Transform's (15 points per die for broad-based Control), with limited applications to model subsets of Control such as Mind Control...

[Ice9]

The main reason I started with Dispel as a base is that it works against the AP in the power, not any of the original power user's stats. Since you'd sometimes want to be Controlling lasting powers that were created by someone who's no longer around, this seems like a better basis.

Transform is an option, but that seems more like a lasting effect than temporary control - Mind Control : Mental Transform :: Control : Transform, basically. If using Transform this way, I'd probably set the "BODY" of the power to 1/3 its AP, such that it would take about as long to Major Transform a power as to Drain it (for the same AP in Transform as Drain), and a bit longer to Severe Transform it.