d20 license

[badger3k]

Figured this would best go here,

Heard about this from browsing enWorld, then read the mutiple threads at wotc. I know some people play both games, while others don't, but I figured I'd see what some people think. The enWorld link is:

http://www.enworld.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=ENNews&file=index&newsdate=2003-09-12

Basically, they changed the license that lets a company produce something with the d20 logo on it. If you can get through the threads on hypocrits and nipples (lots of em), two interesting points were made:

1) The change was made to make sure products adhere to quality standards. It is pointed out that WotC will be the sole judge of whether a product complies with community standards of decency. The sole discretion part troubles some people - they could, for example, pick and choose what is decent and what is not (within limits obviously)

2) The new agreement specifically states that WotC can terminate the contract at any time, and the publisher would have to recall and destroy ALL material they have published with the d20 logo, at their own cost.

I was curious to see if anyone has any thoughts on that, mainly on how such a move could affect the gaming industry or companies like DOJ, who do not make d20 products. Good for them? Bad? I don't want to start a D&D=bad! thread, but I'm curious as to opinions of people who are not necessarily fans/buyers, as wll as players. Please keep the nipples down please:D (hey - it is an actual concern to lots of people - no more bare female nipples in d20 artwork!):rolleyes:

[feywulf]

Does this change in the license apply retroactively to already produced material?

Personally, these i think these changes are very bad for d20, which is probably good for everything else. Depending on the PR spin WotC can put on it, it might benefit them in a few cases.

[Celt]

How does this apply to Open Gaming License (OGL) material? d20 licensing was already very specific, in essence an WotC imprimatur. OGL is, or was, more open.

[Polaris]

Celt,

The changes do not apply in any way to the OGL license.

The d20 license is in its 5th version, the OGL is in its original form.

I believe that this will diminish the value of the d20 logo, but will not seriously impact the production of d20 products (calling them OGL).

Avalanche Press, for example, announced that they will be switching everything over to OGL. According to their website, they had been leaning toward doing so anyway so that they could include more character creation material in their books than the d20 license would allow. The changes to the d20 license rules just made their decision easier.

I suspect that other companies will tend to follow suit.

The key is going to be educating the market that OGL is the game they know. With many companies doing the switch at roughly the same time, I don't believe this is going to be a major problem.

Polaris

[badger3k]

That seems to be a common opinion. The OGL is still the same - apparently the way it is written prevents the new administration from changing it (at least thats what i heard - I'm sure a lawyer could argue things around eventually). The biggest issue for me is that they can also review already released products (sorry, missed this earlier - EnWorld has a pdf by someone at Necromancer Games (I believe) that goes into some detail, including legal concerns). The new license agreement states that Wizards can review works in progress AND already released material (it is either both or contradicts itself, the reviewer wasn't clear himself which it was). Thus they could retroactively change further releases of a published product (or simply terminate the contract - they don't need a cease-and-desist). That could ruin a company. Of course, the selective nature and the fact that major publishers aren't worried leads people to assume that they've already made deals with wotc.

Another point raised by some, lawyers among them, is that by assuming "quality control" they open themselves to legal action if someone wants to sue for some reason. Before they had a "buffer" of being able to say that they had no control over what someone put out. Now they can still publish under the OGL, so again, that may be a non-issue too.

Of course, then you have people who say they'll boycott wizards products or even switch to other games. That might help promote other publisher products and systems (like Hero) if people look for other games.

I don't think it'll have major consequences myself, but hopefully people will try out other long-lived game systems. :D

[trechriron]

This license change has been the catalyst for my company dropping not only the d20 STL but the whole d20 system all together. We are not sure where we are going, but we have decided to try our hand at a couple non-system generic campaign/adventures. Who knows, maybe ideas are more important then system write ups?

I have a couple players in my group who are big HERO fans so I picked up a copy and I am falling in love with the system. We are converting our Star Wars game from d20 to Hero 5th Edition this weekend.

I have explored many systems. Hero is what I’ve been looking for. I don’t imagine we could ever write for it, but as far as playing goes, I foresee this being my system of choice for some time to come.

So, in essence this d20 STL thing has recruited a whole group as I explored the system with a much more open mind and was instantly sold on it after reading through powers and combat.

I have plans to run a Fantasy Hero game on Fridays at my FLGS, so I plan on converting other heathens to the cause.
;-)

Ciao for now,

[badger3k]

Originally posted by trechriron
This license change has been the catalyst for my company dropping not only the d20 STL but the whole d20 system all together. We are not sure where we are going, but we have decided to try our hand at a couple non-system generic campaign/adventures. Who knows, maybe ideas are more important then system write ups?

I have a couple players in my group who are big HERO fans so I picked up a copy and I am falling in love with the system. We are converting our Star Wars game from d20 to Hero 5th Edition this weekend.

I have explored many systems. Hero is what I’ve been looking for. I don’t imagine we could ever write for it, but as far as playing goes, I foresee this being my system of choice for some time to come.

So, in essence this d20 STL thing has recruited a whole group as I explored the system with a much more open mind and was instantly sold on it after reading through powers and combat.

I have plans to run a Fantasy Hero game on Fridays at my FLGS, so I plan on converting other heathens to the cause.
;-)

Ciao for now,

Welcome aboard! If you have any problems or questions, feel free to post - everybody loves to answer posts here.:D

Hope things go well for you and your company.