Superheroic and Heroic balance.

[Herolover]

Hello everyone.

I have an idea which is really a hodge podge of different things. In this "hodge-podge" characters can create just about any character that they can think of. This has lead to a problem in character creation, because I want all the characters to be based off the same amount of points. I want the players to be able to make up the gritty fantasy fighter, the swashbuckling space pirate, or the superhero. Of course, I realize they might not be able to do it exactly, but I want them at least to be able to get close.

So, here is my idea.
The campaign will be run without any of the optional rules there will be knockdown, but not knockback. Characters are created using 100+75 character points.

Now here is where it gets different and I wonder if this is balanced.
When you create a character you designate the character as either Supeheroic(SH) or Heroic (H).

(SH)
Superheroic characters may use power frameworks in character construction. However, they must pay character points for all equipment they have and any "normal" equipment they wish to have on a constant bases.

(H)
Heroic level characters may not use power frameworks in character contstruction (They do not have to have Normal character Maxima). The benefit they get is they never have to pay characte points for ANY equipment.

[Arthur]

I know exactly what you mean. I did crossover stuff with Fantasy Hero and Champions characters before. The Heroic 150 pointers were closer to the Superheroic 250-pointers than it seemed at first - because the Heroic PCs didn't have to pay points for items - usually. I wanted to balance them against each other.

I ran into a similar problem when I wanted to play a character in a Champions game who could use mundane items as though in a Heroic game. I wanted to be able to buy Weapon Familiarities and such and then use things like ordinary guns. I realize that could be done with a Gadget Pool or similar, but that seemed so kludgy.

Anyway, I solved this long ago by lifting the idea of Unusual Background from GURPS. In Hero, it's best represented by:


PERK: May use mundane weapons and items as though in a Heroic Campaign. 25 points.

In a Heroic game, that can be rephrased as "May buy Super Powers as though in a Superheroic campaign". Same cost.

As usual, the exact cost is subject to debate. I keep waffling between as low as 20 points and as high as 50.

[OddHat]

In my own campaigns, superheroic and mundane, I always allow "free" non-military grade real-tech. Abuse dosen't show up often or last long with good players and can be taken care of fairly easily, especially if you are very clear on what is real-tech and what isn't in a given setting (my rule is that if you can't legally order it out of a catalog, you pay points). In the setting you're thinking of, I wouldn't handle it your way; not criticizing, just a different approach.

Instead, I'd allow "Supers" to buy any powers they liked, allow them no more than -1 in limits on any power, set the tech level of their home world as late 20th century Earth, and charge them points for any "Super-equipment" by that standard. No tanks or planes either; they come through with what they normally go on patrol with unless they pay points for it. Set an active point limit around 75 points.

Fantasy world characters are built exactly as per Fantasy Hero rules. Set up the magic system to allow up to a -4 limit on spells, no active point limits at all, no frameworks, and divide the final real costs of all spells by 3. Also allow them to start off with "independant" magic items. They'll be just as tough as Supers built on the same points, maybe tougher.

Cyberpunk World characters can be built as Supers, but with a more limited list of available powers and a 45 active point limit. Set their "real tech" limit at your best guess for late 21st Century tech.

Just some ideas...

[zornwil]

Hey, Herolover, please be sure to let us know how it works out. I've wanted to find a way to convincingly run heroic along with super-heroic characters but never really tried it out.

My own thoughts: the "heroic" level not having any power frameworks while the "superheroic" do will still be a disadvantage unless you're allowing pretty high-tech equipment - if you are, I suppose it'll work okay.

One alternative you might not like as it's not very "flavorful" is to let the heroic levels have a points pool for regular gadgets but it's basically a "free" (no control cost) VPP.

You might want to make your super-heroic characters stay awy from skills other than a few for flavor, to help distinguish the heroic characters. Gives them a real opportunity to shine. I wouldn't recost skills for either class (although then again it might be nice to allow heroic characters to get skills cheaper), just enforce it in character conception.

At its core, I think you have basically a good idea, it just may take a lot of during=game/between-game "tuning" to keep the heroic characters on par.