Does this look right to you? *newbie* [Archive]

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pointyman2000

Feb 26th, '03, 10:30 PM

Hello, Just got to borrow a friend's copy of HERO 5th and I'm still trying to get a hang of the chargen. My main problem lies in powers.

The character I was trying to make was supposed to be a guy with several devices that enable him to manipulate electricity (pretty standard stuff). No armor, probably just boots, gloves and a battery back.

Looking at the Packages, I decided to go for Elemental Control: Electricity

Anyway, this is how it looked like:

20 = EC: Electricity (OIF -1/2) (originally 30AP)
under that...
20 = Endurance Reserve (300 END 20 Rec)
20 = flight 15"
50 = Energy Blast, 6d6, Armor Piercing
20 = Force Field 30:PD 30:ED
50 = 6d6 Flash vs Sight, Hearing and Radio Groups; selective; area effect (radius); does knockback; 2 charges per day; uses END

for a total cost of 180... I've gone over the computations several times, , but I don't trust myself. Can anyone verify if this is right, or am I making a mistake?

Thanks! :)

Jhamin

Feb 26th, '03, 11:18 PM

Not bad for a first attempt. Alot better than mine was. Just a couple points:

The End Reserve isn't supposed to go into a power Framework. Among other things they violate the rule that only powers that cost End can be in an Elemental Control.

Your flight isn't expensive enough to fit. All powers in an elemental control have to have at least twice as many active points as the reserve. (Active points are the cost of the power with all its advantages but without any limits). If anything you might want to make your flight better, so it's active points go up & you can fit it in.

It also looks like you aren't actually taking advantage of the Framework. With elemental controls you add up all the advantages on a power, then subtract the reserve cost, then you appy the limits. It saves you points but ties the powers together. If some bad guy tries to shut down a power, they can all stop working. For this reason you often want a power or two outside a framework if you can afford it.

How about this:

20 Electricity Gear: Elemental Control, 60-point Powers, all slots: (30 Active Points); OIF (-1/2)
20 1) Lightning Blaster: Energy Blast 8d6 (vs. ED), Armor Piercing x1 (+1/2) (60 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 6
20 2) Barrier Field Generator: Force Field (30 PD / 30 ED) (60 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) 6
10 3) Electrc Arc Gun: Flash 6d6 (Sight Group; Additional Sense Group: Hearing Group, Additional Sense Group: Radio Group), Does Knockback (+1/4), Area Of Effect (4" Radius; +1) (63 Active Points); 2 Charges (-1 1/2), Costs Endurance (Only Costs END to Activate; -1/4) (uses END Reserve) 6

20 Flight Belt: Flight 15" (30 Active Points); OIF (-1/2) (uses END Reserve) 3
40 Battery Pack: Endurance Reserve (300 END, 20 REC) Reserve: (50 Active Points); OIF (-1/2)

Total: 130 Points

By upping the damage of the Energy Blast it's active points climb high enough to fit into the Elem Control. I haven't touched the flight, but you may want to find a way to fit that in as well, or just have it remain a seperate power. That might imply that you could still have your electric flight belt even if you lose your other gadgets.

You may want to check with your GM though, As origionally written you had a 6d6 Armor Piercing EB and a 30/30 force field. That is a moderatly low attack and a moderatly high amount of defense. Nothing wrong with that in and of itself but you really want to make sure you are in line with the rest of the game. If everyone was bought this way then attacks would almost never do any real damage vs. defenses and combat would take forever until somebody would drop.
Most Hero games encourage attacks that have about twice the active points of most defenses. This allows combat to end in a reasonable amount of time.

One last thing: It is good form to name the source of each power. That encourages you to think of your character in terms of what their power are rather than what game mechanics you have access to. (Electric Blaster: 6d 6EB AP as opposed to just: 6d6 EB AP)
It also comes in handy when you forget exacty what a power was supposed to represent six months later.

schir1964

Feb 26th, '03, 11:21 PM

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<TD align=right vAlign=top>Value</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>Characteristic</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>Points</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>10</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>STR</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>10</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>DEX</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>10</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>CON</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
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<TD align=right vAlign=top>10</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>BODY</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
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<TD align=right vAlign=top>10</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>INT</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
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<TD vAlign=top>EGO</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
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<TD align=right vAlign=top>2</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>PD</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
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<TD align=right vAlign=top>2</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>ED</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>2</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>SPD</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>4</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>REC</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>20</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>END</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>20</TD>
<TD vAlign=top>STUN</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top> </TD>
<TD vAlign=top>Total</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>0</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> 
<TABLE border=1 cellPadding=2 cellSpacing=1 width=500>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>Points</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">Powers</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>END</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>13</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">Electricity Control (20-pt reserve); SFX:
Elemental Control; OIF: -½ </TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top> </TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>a-20</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">Endurance Reserve (300 END, 20 END/1 Turn);
Slow Recovery (1 Turn): +0; SFX: Elemental Control; OIF: -½ </TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top> </TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>b-13</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">20" Flight (40" Noncombat); SFX: Elemental
Control; OIF: -½ </TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>4</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>c-17</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">6d6 Energy Blast; Range (225"); Armor Piercing
(×1): +½; SFX: Elemental Control; OIF: -½ </TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>4</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>d-27</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">Force Field (30 PD, 30 ED); SFX: Elemental
Control; OIF: -½ </TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>6</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>e-68</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">6d6 Flash; Range (700"); Targeting Sense Group
(Sight Group): +5; Extra Nontargeting Sense Group (Hearing Group): +5;
Extra Nontargeting Sense Group (Radio Group): +5; Area Of Effect (Radius):
10" Radius, +1; Area Of Effect - Selective Target (Radius): 9" Radius,
+1¼; Does Knockback: +¼; Costs Endurance (Only To Activate): -¼; SFX:
Elemental Control; OIF: -½ </TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>14</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=right vAlign=top>158</TD>
<TD vAlign=top width="100%">Total Powers</TD>
<TD align=right vAlign=top> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> 
<TABLE border=0 cellPadding=0 cellSpacing=0 width=500>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD align=left vAlign=top>COSTS:</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Char.</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top> </TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Powers</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top> </TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Total</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Total</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top> </TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Disadv.</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top> </TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Base</TD></TR>
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<TD align=middle vAlign=top> </TD>
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<TD align=middle vAlign=top>=</TD>
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<TD align=middle vAlign=top>=</TD>
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<TD align=middle vAlign=top>OCV</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>DCV</TD>
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<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Mental Def.</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>PD/rPD</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>ED/rED</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>Phases</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>3</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>3</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>3</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>0</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>32/30</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>32/30</TD>
<TD align=middle vAlign=top>6, 12</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
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Southern Cross

Feb 27th, '03, 12:03 AM

First off,Special Powers (such as Endurance Reserve) normally require GM's permission to be purchased in Power Frameworks,so the character would have to pay the full Real Cost of the Power (33 points if bought through an OIF).
Next we come to the characters Elemental Control.Assuming the entire EC is bought with an OIF,we have an Electrical Powers EC with a base of 15 Active Points 9The base points Real Cost is reduced to 10 because of the OIF Limitation.I 'd buy these Powers as follows:
Batteries: Endurance Reserve (300 END, 20 REC) (OIF -1/2) (50 AP/33 Real Cost)
Elemental Control : Electrical Powers: (OIF -1/2) (15 point base,Real Cost 10)
Jet Boots: 15"Flight (15/10)
Electro-gloves: 6d6 AP EB (30/20) Electrical Field: Force Field (30 PD/30 ED) (45/30)
Lightning Flash: 6d6 Flash vs. Sight,Hearing and Radio Sense Groups,Area Effect(Radius),Selective,
(90 Active),2 Charges that Cost END(-1 3/4) (75/23)

pointyman2000

Feb 27th, '03, 12:14 AM

Hey, thanks!

I'll try fiddling with this a bit more, I should be a little more cost effective this time. :D

I'll try posting a modified version once I'm done for more critiques.

MisterVimes

Feb 27th, '03, 05:22 AM

Originally posted by pointyman2000
Hey, thanks!

I'll try fiddling with this a bit more, I should be a little more cost effective this time. :D

I'll try posting a modified version once I'm done for more critiques.

Let me recommend something. When I am working on an EC and I notice that I have a lot of attacks in it, I consider moving the attacks to a Multipower. Like this:

<table border="0" cellpadding="0"><tr><td align="right">Cost  </td><td>Power</td><td align="right">END</td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">10  </td><td>Electircal Control: Elemental Control, 30-point Powers, all slots: (15 Active Points); OIF (-1/2) </td><td valign="top" align="right"></td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">10  </td><td>1) Flight 15" (30 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) </td><td valign="top" align="right">3</td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">10  </td><td>2) Force Field (15 PD / 15 ED) (30 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) (added to Secondary Value) </td><td valign="top" align="right">3</td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">11  </td><td>3) Force Wall (5 PD / 5 ED; 4" long and 1" tall) (31 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) </td><td valign="top" align="right">3</td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">  </td><td> </td><td valign="top" align="right"></td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">35  </td><td>Electrical Control: Multipower, 52-point reserve, all slots: (52 Active Points); OIF (-1/2) </td><td valign="top" align="right"></td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">3u  </td><td>1) Energy Blast 7d6 (vs. ED), Armor Piercing x1 (+1/2) (52 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) </td><td valign="top" align="right">5</td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">3u  </td><td>2) Flash 4d6 (Sight Group; Additional Sense Group: Radio Group), Area Of Effect (3" Radius; +1) (50 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) </td><td valign="top" align="right">5</td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">3u  </td><td>3) Killing Attack - Ranged 2d6 +1 (vs. ED), Armor Piercing x1 (+1/2) (52 Active Points) (uses END Reserve) </td><td valign="top" align="right">5</td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">  </td><td> </td><td valign="top" align="right"></td></tr><tr><td align="right" valign="top">40  </td><td>Endurance Reserve (300 END, 20 REC) Reserve: (50 Active Points); OIF (-1/2) </td><td valign="top" align="right"></td></tr></table>Powers Cost: 125

In the above example, you are getting off with two more powers (FW & RKA), you are 5 points cheaper and further offensive powers cost just 3 xp per slot. The logic here is that if you can only use one attack power a phase, why not put them under an MP?

pointyman2000

Feb 27th, '03, 11:20 PM

Been fiddling with the suggestions you guys have made, but I'm still not sure if I got it right... what do you guys think?

50 - Multipower: Electricity Control (OIF) [75 Active Points]
m1- 5 - Blaster = 10d6 Energy Blast (vs. ED); Armor Piercing; OIF
m2- 4 - Stasis Field = 4d6 Entangle; Backlash; Both Target and Entagle take Damage; Cannot make Barriers; OIF
m3- 2 - Energy Sword = 5d6 HKA (vs. ED); OIF; no STR damage; gestures with both hands

20 - Elemental Control: Electricity (OIF) [30 Active Points]
ec1- 21 - Flight; usable underwater, 25"; OIF
ec2- 22 - Force Field (25 PD/ 25 ED); half END cost; OIF

35 - Power Source = END Reserve (200 END, 15 Rec), OIF
4 - Visor = 6pt. Flash Defense (sight group); OIF

Total Powers/ Equipment Cost: 159

Does this look balanced already? :)
Thanks for all the help, by the way, I'm still getting the hang of the system.

Black Rose

Feb 28th, '03, 04:55 PM

Originally posted by pointyman2000
Been fiddling with the suggestions you guys have made, but I'm still not sure if I got it right... what do you guys think?

50 - Multipower: Electricity Control (OIF) [75 Active Points]
m1- 5 - Blaster = 10d6 Energy Blast (vs. ED); Armor Piercing; OIF
m2- 4 - Stasis Field = 4d6 Entangle; Backlash; Both Target and Entagle take Damage; Cannot make Barriers; OIF
m3- 2 - Energy Sword = 5d6 HKA (vs. ED); OIF; no STR damage; gestures with both hands

Will your GM allow a 15 DC killing attack in their game? I admit I don't know your campaign parametres, but that is a tad potent. The "no STR add" makes it less brutal, but still...

20 - Elemental Control: Electricity (OIF) [30 Active Points]
ec1- 21 - Flight; usable underwater, 25"; OIF

:eek: :eek::eek:You're gonna fly underwater using lightning?!?!?

ec2- 22 - Force Field (25 PD/ 25 ED); half END cost; OIF

35 - Power Source = END Reserve (200 END, 15 Rec), OIF
4 - Visor = 6pt. Flash Defense (sight group); OIF

Total Powers/ Equipment Cost: 159

Does this look balanced already? :)
Thanks for all the help, by the way, I'm still getting the hang of the system.

Other than the comments I made, it looks good.

schir1964

Feb 28th, '03, 06:56 PM

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<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type"
content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<meta name="GENERATOR" content="Creation Workshop">
<title>Unnamed</title></head>
<body bgcolor="#000000">
Unnamed
<table border="1" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="1" width="500">
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top">Points</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">Powers</td>
<td align="right" valign="top">END</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> 50</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">Multipower (75-pt reserve); SFX: Electricity Control; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top"> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> m-10</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">10d6 Energy Blast; Range (375"); Armor Piercing (×1): +½; Multipower: Variable Slot; SFX: Electricity Control; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top">7</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> m-8</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">4d6 Entangle (4 DEF); Range (350"); Backlash: +½; Entangle And Character Both Take Damage: +¼; Cannot Form Barriers: -¼; Multipower: Variable Slot; SFX: Electricity Control; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top">7</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> m-6</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">5d6 Killing Attack - Hand-To-Hand (HKA) (5½d6 Total Damage); Range (0"); No STR Bonus: -½; Gestures (Throughout Power): -½; Active Points: 75; Multipower: Variable Slot; SFX: Electricity Control; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top">7</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> 20</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">Elemental Control (30-pt reserve); SFX: Electricity Control; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top"> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> a-21</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">25" Flight (50" Noncombat); Usable Underwater: +¼;SFX: Electricity Control; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top">6</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> b-21</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">Force Field (25 PD, 25 ED); Reduced Endurance (Half Endurance): +¼; SFX: Electricity Control; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top">2</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> 23</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">Endurance Reserve (200 END, 15 END/1 Turn); Slow Recovery (1 Turn): +0; OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top"> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top"> 4</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">Flash Defense (Sight Group, 6 Pts); OIF: -½
</td>
<td align="right" valign="top"> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td align="right" valign="top">163</td>
<td valign="top" width="100%">Total Powers</td>
<td align="right" valign="top"> </td>
</tr>
</table>
 
</body>
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Are the slots in the Multipower supposed to Ultra's?

- Chrisopher Mullins

BasilDrag

Mar 1st, '03, 08:23 PM

Originally posted by pointyman2000
(snip)
m3- 2 - Energy Sword = 5d6 HKA (vs. ED); OIF; no STR damage; gestures with both hands
(snip)
Thanks for all the help, by the way, I'm still getting the hang of the system.

Swinging a sword is not a legitimate use of the Gestures Limitation.

Or did you have something else in mind?

--
Friends, books, a cheerful heart, and conscience clear are the most choice companions we have here. -- William Mather

pointyman2000

Mar 1st, '03, 10:11 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Black Rose

:eek: :eek::eek:You're gonna fly underwater using [b]lightning?!?!?

Now that you brought it up, it does sound a little silly, doesn't it? :)) Oh well, I'll probably just slap on something else. :) Thanks for pointing it out.

pointyman2000

Mar 1st, '03, 10:13 PM

Originally posted by BasilDrag
Swinging a sword is not a legitimate use of the Gestures Limitation.

Or did you have something else in mind?

I was thinking of brandishing it whenever it comes out in a "He-Man"-ish sort of way whenever he brings it out. Perhaps I should use the delayed phase limitation instead?

KawangaKid

Mar 2nd, '03, 06:38 PM

Keep in mind that you'll be incurring those gestures and / or phase delay each time you attack. Kinda puts the damper on things...