Dune HERO

[2gunkid]

I'm thinking about starting up a HERO game set in Frank Herbert's DUNE universe...and I'm playing with the idea of shields...any suggestions?


The shields are a force field that stops completely physical attacks of a certain velocity or slower, blow up and cause the las(er)-gun to blow up if shot by one, and can be rendered inoperable by a huge static charge. It also makes it harder to move and perceive things while its activated

I was thinking about defining it as:

Force Wall (Self Only, set shape, PD: 25, Not vs. "slow" attacks, not in static fields, 0 END, OIF: Shield Generator)

RKA (4d6, NND, Does Body, Trigger: Hit by Las Gun, Only to target las gun shooting it, Side Effect: [4d6 RKA, AoE: Radius] 1 charge, OIF: Shield Generator)

Change Environment: (-2" Running, -3 PER rolls, 1 hex area, 0 end, persistant, linked to Force Wall, OIF: Shield Generator)

The points don't really matter, I'm just trying to get a feel for game mechanics.

Thanks,

James.

[MarkusDark]

But your writeup seems good. Question - when shields blow up, do they always take out the wearer? If not, I'd probably lower the side effect a bit. Also, are the Las guns Energy attacks? If so, the Shields are extremely dangerous to use as one shot from a Las would blow them, and anyone around them, up.

Don't forget the 0 range on the FW

I would probably use an end battery and have them cost at least something to maintain - maybe even something like 16 charges that last for one turn each.

In the movies, I remember hearing someone say that they don't normally use Shields on Dune as the sand quickly fouls/destroys the electronics.

When I created a "Dune Style" shield, I bought it as an ablative FF with some Damage Reduction thrown in. Of course, I probably missed the mark by a mile with it.

[2gunkid]

Good Call on the "No Range" for the force wall.

Las guns are energy-based, so getting hit with a las-gun does take out the shield wearer...but now that you mention it, also the las-gun holder...so maybe that initial RKA should be area-of-effect as well...

This is why most of the fighting in the books are done with knives and swords and what-not, because Shield technology made las-gun use a mutual-annhilation deal.

Also, an active shield tends to attract and enrage near-by sandworms...but I was going to cover that in the Sandworm write-up.

Thanks for chipping in,

James.

[SuperPheemy]

I always thought that the interaction between the shield and a lasgun resluted in an explosive chain reaction. A BIG explosive chain reaction.

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by SuperPheemy
I always thought that the interaction between the shield and a lasgun resluted in an explosive chain reaction. A BIG explosive chain reaction.

I seem to remember this as well. At one point in the first book (I believe it was when the Sardukar were wiping out house Atredes) a massive explosion obliterates a division of solders. One character turns to another and asks if he has broken out the Atomics. The other replies that no, that would violate a bunch of treaties. He aimed a Lasgun at a Shield belt and set it on a timer.

In other words, a distant observer who knows about these things can confuse the effect of a lasgun hitting a shield with a medium scale ATOMIC detonation.

[AnotherSkip]

I think the greatest danger mentioned of the sheilds is that when an energy weapon hit's the sheild it
1 automatically destroys the wearer
2 automatically destroys the shooter, irregardless of range
the implication being given that the energy released is so huge that near atomic is right, basically the explosion needs to be large enough that it guarantees death for cities.

near atomic is good enough.


BTW what book is the LP on delay and sheild generator trick mentioned?

we were doing similar things in a Battletech campaign....





evil feinds that we were....

[AnotherSkip]

AFter having got my greedy little hands on Star Hero im Running full bore into a simple problem.

I thought there were Aliens in DUNE.

SH in _many_ places keeps on bringin up "there are no Aliens in DUNE".

1. the Spice Worms are certainly "monstrous" enough to qualify though because they are considered more animals/weapons they are certainly not "playable aliens" as we think of them (and technically they are native, the houses are Aliens invading from the POV of DUNE.

2. Are not the methane/hydrogen breathing Navigators aliens? Able to navigate "hyperspace" and more or less shortcut hard science distances and make a star spanning empire possible?


Sure, ill agree all of the stories are not about "Human vs Alien conflict" (except possibly in the case of #1 at most) having a much more difficult sociopolitical in species conflict. But to me there is a _huge_ difference between "there are no aliens" and "there are no aliens that are typically considered playable or have been major characters".

That is the thing i'm sticking on.

Of course I could be wrong (and remembering things incorrectly) not the first and not the last.....

[2gunkid]

The Navigators were mutated humans, not aliens...though the distinction is a little fuzzy. Their changes were a by-product of spice use.

The worms are technicaly aliens, I guess, depending on where you're standing, though.



James.

[Captain Obvious]

It's been a long long time since I read Dune, and I've never gotten around to the others in the series. I don't really remember the shield-laser dynamic, but I can say right now, if I was a strategist in that universe, I'd be building a bunch of cheap RC vehicles armed with lasers and controlled from orbit.

Those mentats aren't earning their keep if they haven't come up with this strategy by now....

[SuperPheemy]

Yeah, but for every mentat that comes up with the laser-armed RC vehicle, there's another working for the other side who will come up with the counterstrategy. Part of why the DUNE universe continually boils down to the human equation is that humans are the one variable left in the universe (and even then the Bene Gesserat are close to learning how to predict that variable).

The human factor becomes more important as a metaplot as the story continues through Children of Dune.

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Captain Obvious
It's been a long long time since I read Dune, and I've never gotten around to the others in the series. I don't really remember the shield-laser dynamic, but I can say right now, if I was a strategist in that universe, I'd be building a bunch of cheap RC vehicles armed with lasers and controlled from orbit.

Those mentats aren't earning their keep if they haven't come up with this strategy by now....

I think everyone knows about that as a concept. You even get the idea it may happen on other worlds, but not on Dune.

One of the things about the books is that alot of the action in the early novels takes place on Dune (hence the name of the series) and the one thing you absolutely do not want to do is nuke the planet to glass. The entire economy of the known universe would collapse if somebody destroyed all the spice, and the spice can only be mined on Dune. In fact, at a couple of points power is siezed from the old regime just because a rebel is willing to do that and the old guard steps down rather than see it happen.

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by AnotherSkip
I think the greatest danger mentioned of the sheilds is that when an energy weapon hit's the sheild it
BTW what book is the LP on delay and sheild generator trick mentioned?

Turned out I was remembering it wrongly. In the first novel, when House Harkonnen was blitzing house Atredes, Duncan Idaho picks up Paul and Jessica out in the open desert after they escape the Harkonnens. A massive blast is seen and Paul (shocked) asks Duncan if he used the family Atomics. Dunan replys that no, he just noticed that their enemies were making liberal, almost flagrent use of Lasguns.
As they were retreating from their fortifications anyway, he set up a shield running on automatic in a place he knew they attack later. Duncan mentions something to the effect that if the Harkonens dont have strong lasgun discipline they deserve what they get.

[Captain Obvious]

Originally posted by Jhamin
and the one thing you absolutely do not want to do is nuke the planet to glass.

Isn't most of the human activity on the planet confined to a big outcrop of rock that sticks out above the sand? You could nuke that to glass if you wanted to, and the sandworms would go on their merry way making spice. Whatever was left after that (mostly spice harvesters and an ornithopter here and there) would just be a mop-up operation. Or, heck, leave them alone and wait for them to drag themselves in and beg for shelter.

Or maybe I just don't remember enough about the one book in the series to fully understand the logistics of this enterprise....

[Jhamin]

Originally posted by Captain Obvious
Isn't most of the human activity on the planet confined to a big outcrop of rock that sticks out above the sand? You could nuke that to glass if you wanted to, and the sandworms would go on their merry way making spice. Whatever was left after that (mostly spice harvesters and an ornithopter here and there) would just be a mop-up operation. Or, heck, leave them alone and wait for them to drag themselves in and beg for shelter.

At the time of the 1st novel, there were scattered but established settlements all over the northern hemisphere of the planet. You are thinking of the capital city which was built inside a natural geological formation call "the shield wall" which was a ring of mountains high enough to block sandstorms completely. It was the capital, but by no means the only large settlement. The southern hemisphere was indeed one vast desert with few "safe zones" to build cities in. The southern waste was considered uninhabitable due to Worm activity and was rarely even visited by spice miners. The fact that the native Fremen nomads wandered freely through the southern hemisphere and had large settlements there was a shock to the powers that be.

Conventional thinking was that if you did too much damage to the northern settlements in an attack you run the risk of not having anywhere safe when the next sandstorm hit or a worm wandered by. There was also mention of a ban on Atomics in warfare that was enforced by the Noble houses. I got the impression that if you violated that agreement you would invite the wrath of all the Nobles everywhere. Thus no nukes.

Even the Harkonen attack that wiped out House Atredes was seen as an unbelievable move because the cost of transporting that many troops ate up decades worth of profit from the spice trade. Atredes defences were built up with the assumption that nobody would ever invest that much in an attack that might fail. They didn't count on the emperor loaning his elite troops to house Harkonen, or being betrayed by one of their own. WIthout both the implication was they might have withstood the attack.

The universe of Dune wasn't short on weapons of mass destruction, but there were such technological and balance of power issues to deal with that most combat occured on the level of shielded, knife-weilding platoons. The scary thing about Paul, and later Lato II was that they had enough precognitian that they could weigh the pros and cons of tipping the balance of power in ways that were unavalible to anybody else.

[AnotherSkip]

Originally posted by Jhamin
You are thinking of the capital city which was built inside a natural geological formation call "the shield wall" which was a ring of mountains high enough to block sandstorms completely.

Well it _is_ the only "civilised" location scene in most of the movies.
I certainly don't blame people for thinking that way.

Heck it's been 10-20 years since i have read the books, some of the stuff is pretty fuzzy in there.....