Newbie Question

[Neskeptic]

OK,

So do you need both the Hero Systen 5th addition book and the Champions book to play Champions, or just the Champs book?

[Hawksmoor]

You need FreD (Big Black Book with the Green Man) to play the game. It is so chocked full of rules and mechanics. Crunchy goodness

Champions is a setting sourcebook deviod of mechanics, with the exception of iconic powers and Character writeups in the back. Fluffy Goodness.

If you understand the genre you technically do not need champions, but it is worth it for the master's (Aaron Allston) take on the game.

Hawksmoor

[Neskeptic]

I can do without characters write-ups (been rpging 25 years - even Champs around 83-84, I think). But the iconic powers you mention, can they be created with FreD book?

[Hawksmoor]

Absolutely!

FRed even includes like 100 or so powers in the margins fully developed.

I'd say buy Champions only if you like the Superhero Genre and want a sourcebook. Champions Universe and Millenium City are the main setting books. All are good if you have the $$ to spend. Otherwise you are set. Bought Champs for the Allston name, and to have "standard" characters to judge my twinkishness against.

Hawksmoor

[Steve Long]

Let me clarify a few things.

1. You only ever need the 5E rulebook to play the game. Champions has a bunch of useful information and guidelines, even for as experienced a player as yourself, but it's not necessary, and it doesn't contain the HERO System rules. You can create any power you want using the 5E rules by themselves.

2. There are over 300 example powers in the sidebars of 5E. However, they're not all superpowers; some are FH spells, some are gadgets, and so on. If you want lots of superpowers, pick up The UNTIL Superpowers Database, which has over 3,000 of them (counting all options).

3. Champions is what we call a "genre book" -- it reviews the elements and nature of a particular genre, and provides information, advice, and resources on how to simulate, play, and run games in that genre using the HERO System rules. It's not a setting book; the only setting-specific information it has is five NPC heroes (the Champions) and several sample villains (including Mechanon). If you want Champions setting material, check out Champions Universe or Millennium City.

[TheEmerged]

My take on purchase necessity.

100% = FREd. It's really the only one you need.
75% = UNTIL Super Powers Database (or genre equivalent). Especially if you're fairly new to the system, this/these will give you a major heads-up on how power construction works.
60% = Ultimate Martial Artist. Some good mechanic explanations, and a ruleset that's going to cross numerous genres.
59% = Conquerors, Killers, and Crooks (CKC). If you're fairly new to the system or haven't played since earlier editions this one can give you some good examples of how the characters should look.
55% = Champions Battlegrounds. Normally I'm not a big fan of modules. Okay, normally I'm all but against modules except as a luxury product. This one however has some *very* good, adaptable material (what is Champions-specific is easily changed) worth recommending.
50% = HERO Bestiary. Not as important in some genres (Champions) as others (Fantasy, Star HERO, etc).
40% = Champions Universe & Millenium City. Good products if you're planning to run a campaign in the Champions Universe or (like me) a near equivalent.
25% = The *other* Genre Books. Nothing against Star HERO or Fantasy HERO, but if you have a decent grasp on the system and a good grasp on the genre these should be fairly low on your priority list.
10% = Champions. I accept that I'm in the minority here but I was heavily disappointed with this one. There's basically one chart in here I found useful; I photocopied it and haven't opened it since.

Your mileage will probably vary and all that

[lemming]

OK,

So do you need both the Hero Systen 5th addition book and the Champions book to play Champions, or just the Champs book?

You only need the 5th Edition Rules book (or Sidekick for that matter if you want a lighter version)

You'll want everything else.

[Neskeptic]

Just wanted to let everyone know, that based on the feedback here I went out today and purchased the FrED (lemme guess - 5th Edition?) book and the Until Superpowers Database. I'll get my 1984 Champions cobwebs cleared away and try and run a campaign. Thanx for the input!

[TheEmerged]

Just wanted to let everyone know, that based on the feedback here I went out today and purchased the FrED (lemme guess - 5th Edition?) book and the Until Superpowers Database. I'll get my 1984 Champions cobwebs cleared away and try and run a campaign. Thanx for the input!

No problem, and don't be afraid to ask for more.

/humor on

If nothing else, it'll give us more to argue about

/humor off

[Enforcer84]

No problem, and don't be afraid to ask for more.

/humor on

If nothing else, it'll give us more to argue about

/humor off

No it won't.