Global Guardians - Champs by email (review)

[Capt Aardvark]

After fooling with these people for about 9 months, neither of the two campaigns that I had been accepted into have actually started. Months, literally MONTHS of character audits, lots of house rules that change how most of us design characters and play Champions, and a Master of Ceremonies with a very irritable nature have finally convinced me that I should quietly back away and pretend I don't know about them.

How it works: you see what campaigns have openings, submit a character history and write-up (specifics vary), see if you're chosen, and then sit and wait. Eventually they get around to auditing your character, at which point they remove your favorite powers, charge you extra for others due to 'house rules', inform you that you have a different hair color or birthday or DNPC or something, and then remind you to shave off the 38 points they tacked on due to decreasing your OAF to an OIF or something.

It's possible that once you get into an active game, it's fun outweighs all the inconveniences. I wouldn't know. Apparently there's a year-long waiting period before you find out. Doesn't SAY there is one....

Also, if you are new and accidentally violate some obscure board rule or guideline, you will be publicly humiliated by the boss. Thank goodness it wasn't me; I just watched it happen time after time to others. Wanna see some astonishing flames? Tune in.

That being said, they have some fantastic databases of unusual character limitations and psychological disadvantages of great use for players and GMs. Many are things I hadn't heard of or thought of in 20 years of playing Champions, and was just plain tickled about.

I just felt that a review was in order, since HERO lists them as a link. Do with it what you will… I'd be very interested in input from GG players who have survived all of this, but not from the Uber-GM. I've heard enough from him.

[Trebuchet]

If you're going to post this kind of patently hostile review, don't you think it's only fair that Worldmaker has the right to reply to your criticism? Or is this merely intended as an attack? If that's actually the case; then all you're doing is trolling.

[Mightybec]

So, your review is of waiting to get into a game, and not actually playing one, right? Do you have an example of what powers were cut that you thought were acceptable?

Note: GM, GG Majestic

[Celtic Cowboy]

If you're going to post this kind of patently hostile review, don't you think it's only fair that Worldmaker has the right to reply to your criticism?

From what I've seen in previous critical discussions of GGU Worldmaker takes exception quit easily and any response he would likely make would only serve to either fan the flames or drag this out for days as has happened several times before.

That being said I will add that I played in a GGU game before their universe reset, used a stock character they had available, and generally had a very good time.

GGU's extensive house rules are (to the best of my knowledge) on their website and while missing one or two is understandable turning in a character straight out of Hero Designer without consulting these house rules is just asking for endless edits.

Are they freaking picky about characters going into their game?
Oh yeah, in spades.

Would this bug me as a player making a unique character instead of a prebuilt?
Without a doubt - I want to play not spend weeks tweaking a character.

Does this in the end make GGU play better?
I'd have to give them the benefit of the doubt and say yes. When a character gets through this process the unique games GM knows it's not some rules rapist dream come true that's going to ruin the game for everyone else. All players are on similar ground and they work with the consistancy of the games universe. It keeps the shared universe the games run going.


Worldmaker doesn't need anybodys permission or approval to run his game site any way he wants to. If players don't like the rules, or the person behind the rules, they absolutly have the right to leave and find a game elsewhere. While I'm not a fan of his attitude at times, there's a heck of a lot of players over on GGU so they must be doing something right.

[Hugh Neilson]

hmmm...a fair and balanced comment. These are rare and should be encouraged, methinks

[Trebuchet]

From what I've seen in previous critical discussions of GGU Worldmaker takes exception quit easily and any response he would likely make would only serve to either fan the flames or drag this out for days as has happened several times before.

If you've followed the NGD boards at all, you know I've clashed with Worldmaker many many times over political issues. Nor have I ever played in his campaign. So I'm not defending him because he's a guy I often agree with or because he's a good buddy of mine. I'm defending him because he's a decent man, and worthy of respect.

But it seems to me to be totally unfair to blast his campaign (especially, as Mightybec noted, without ever having ever played in it) and then say "I'd be very interested in input from GG players who have survived all of this, but not from the Uber-GM. I've heard enough from him." That's purely trollish BS as far as I'm concerned, and whatever my past differences with Worldmaker he deserves more respect than that. He works hard to put together a campaign that many people can enjoy, and I can only assume most of those house rules are to prevent abuses that have occured in the past. We all know there are loads of munchkin players out there; most of us have had the misfortune to play with them. In a recent thread he gave a fairly detailed explanation recently of typical modifications that he required on submitted characters and I thought most of them seemed pretty reasonable, as was his tone throughout the discussion.

So please give WM both the credit he is due and the courtesy of allowing him to reply. He may not choose to even reply to such a trollish post, and I wouldn't blame him a bit. Seriously, how are we supposed to take a guy who posts in the HERO forums purely to bash someone else's game that he hasn't even played?

[Celtic Cowboy]

But it seems to me to be totally unfair to blast his campaign (especially, as Mightybec noted, without ever having ever played in it) and then say "I'd be very interested in input from GG players who have survived all of this, but not from the Uber-GM. I've heard enough from him." That's purely trollish BS as far as I'm concerned, and whatever my past differences with Worldmaker he deserves more respect than that.

Since the original post did blast the GGU process I'll have to in retrospect agree with you on this.

If you're going to blast the guys work it's not fair to expect him to stay out of the comments, good - bad - or otherwise.

If someone wants feedback on GGU from users, and not Uber-Gm, then it might have been better to simply state that they had some problems with the GM about the strong house rules and review process, and wanted to hear from players that gone through the process and their thoughts as players.

[Enforcer84]

I'm not much of a PBEM player, but the world they have set up is pretty cool. As a matter of fact the only 'problem' I had with Global Guardians was when I first saw the site a few years back; I was put off by the "No Magic" creedo. I never asked about it though and now I notice it changed. Oh well, that's what I get for jumping to conclusions.

[Blue]

I think Worldmaker was on the short list of people who I once added to my ignore list (due to some argument he was having in another forum where both participants earned the Ignore). Having said, that he seems like a nice guy.

Coming in here and posting something about the process you have to go through to get into a game seems fair to me. I once considered joining in one of these then decided against it due to time constraints. But the fact that there were people visiting here soliciting participants makes this a fair grounds on which to broach the subject.

Of course Worldmaker should rebut anything said in this thread if he feels it's warranted. But I recommend against it. It sounds like he has plenty of happy players and should feel no need to respond.

As for what has been said about the process for getting into a game... I do think it's good to know this. I'm a person of little patience. Recreation is recreation; don't make it into work! My games do have rules, but I try and accomodate everyone because it's all about fun. Jumping through hoops is what I do all day, and this sounds like more of that.

In that respect, thanks for the.... uh... review.

[red_eagle123]

I have to say, Trebuchet hit the nail on the head. This is a pure Troll thread. You want responses from players who've made it through the audit process? Okay, here you go.

I enjoy the audit system. I find it helps a lot, and sets my mind at ease knowing that there isn't a uber-munchkin out there that creates a character that totally over-shadows my own. The house rules aren't that far off from what Hero Designer kicks out, with only a few modifications really.

What the original poster gave as his/her/it's experiences was, as far as I can determine, NOT the average experience. Either he/she/it's a munchkin that tried to submit a character idea that's way beyond the pale, or is totally over-blowing what really happened.

If your character concept can't stand a little tweaking to fit in with the multitude of other players and characters, then perhaps it's best you do quietly go away. However, it seems to me that this post is not 'quietly' going away. Rather it's a temper tantrum of the worst sort.

And just in case anyone asks, I've had two pre-reboot characters, one modified post-reboot and one brand new post-reboot character and am Co-GM for the Legacy campaign.

[Blue]

Now that's helpful: Hearing from someone is or was in a game. I hope there are more of these.

[Whytboy]

Well, if you want me to add another opinion. I'm really pleased with the GG World.

When I first started.. my first character concept was flat out rejected. I was a little on the angry side... but hey, even having been a Face to Face Champions GM for around 13 years prior to that, I've done the same thing to people face to face... so I can handle that.

So I made 3 more. Eventually they got through the audit. One took a lot of work... and I even got World Maker to change one of the house rules to acccomodate my character (since he agreed it was the only way to do it). Anyway, Made three characters and before I knew it..all three were in three seperate games... I dont remember waiting long. (That being said.. I tend to make wierd characters that are different enough to be interesting to GMs)

Just before the Reboot, one of the embassies came available for a GM. I decided to run it since it was my home town. It was a blast.... We just got done with our first adventure, and the reboot happened.

Sure, Like everyone else, I didnt understand it. I had three good characters ... in play..and one game I was GMing. why the reboot?

Not much I could do to make it not happen... so I put in to GM the same type of game. and I remade one of my characters for the new world. My one character just got started..and my team that I am GMing is waiting to be auditted, eagerly too. I've had some time to think about what they are doing and they are basically picking up right where the last group was supposed to be. Infact I even had a couple of players wait for my game to come up.. talk about a GM ego boost.

I like the world... I like my games... and yeah.. I've talked to WorldMaker. Sometimes hes cool... sometimes he flys off the handle. Well thats the way I see it, but I deal with 10 people.. he has to deal with 200.. I can cut him a bit of slack!

[Doug McCrae]

I have to say, Trebuchet hit the nail on the head. This is a pure Troll thread.

...

If your character concept can't stand a little tweaking to fit in with the multitude of other players and characters, then perhaps it's best you do quietly go away. However, it seems to me that this post is not 'quietly' going away. Rather it's a temper tantrum of the worst sort.

I disagree with this completely. IMO the post is neither trollish nor a temper tantrum but a fair and balanced account of one person's experiences with the GGU. Not sure if it qualifies as a review, mind you, but it's certainly useful for prospective players. There's no reason whatever Global Guardians should be immune from criticism, just because the GM posts here.

The one element I would quibble with is where the writer says he doesn't want to hear more from Worldmaker, which is unfair. And, let's face it, never gonna happen in a million years.

[Magmarock]

May I ask, why the "reboot"? Was that to coincide with 5th Ed coming out or was something wrong with the campaign world?

I thought about joining a couple of years ago, but was intimidated by the strict audit process (and the no-magic thing didn't help). Since then, I've considered many times to join GGU but just haven't gotten around to it. I am in other PBEM games and I don't want to get overwhelmed.

I think that asking for feedback from the players only is a valid request, although the "Uber GM" comment was uncalled for. CA wants to hear what other players have experienced in the audit process. If WM is smart, he would listen with an open mind, because maybe, just maybe, the screening process could be streamlined a bit. Although it is clear that CA is a little disgruntled, he did hang in there for a long time and so his complaint has some validity.

Of course, GGU is not a business and the players are not paying customers, but like any business or organization, GGU is serving the players... so ignoring negative feedback will only hurt GGU in the long run.

I am curious to see what powers were disallowed for CA's character, too.


Mags

[Worldmaker]

I just felt that a review was in order, since HERO lists them as a link. Do with it what you will… I'd be very interested in input from GG players who have survived all of this, but not from the Uber-GM. I've heard enough from him.

I can't really respond to this anyway, except to say that I have no idea who you are, so I have no idea how close to the real world your rather heavily distorted version of the audit process actually is.

However, given that you admit to recently abandoning several campaigns I can make a guess. If you are who I think you are, then at least two of the campaigns you were in were quite active, yet you, yourself, never bothered to participate and were thus dropped from them.

In any case, I know the truth about how things work. You're telling lies about me. If that's what you need to be happy, then more power to you.