Gods and Champions

[Metaphysician]

I just got a lot more interested in seeing ARCANE ENEMIES and the write-up on Tezcatlipoca. I might be able to use this one in my campaign. Might be interesting to see how the non-divine characters react to a pantheon vs. pantheon war with their companion Horus-Re on one side...

Heh, let me put it this way: Tezcatlapoca is a megavillain.

[JeffreyWKramer]

Yep, this definitely makes me more interested in ARCANE ENEMIES.

[Kirby]

Warrior Nun Areala is fun in a quirky kind of way. ... I didn't think it made fun of the Catholic Church in any way and the writer complied with a complaint from a real order of nuns that Areala's costume was too revealing.

While I've never read the series, is this the "Warrior Nun" where she wears a habit that reveals cleavage and shows off pretty much all of her legs? If this is it, I saw that as part of the desperation grunginess that comics were becoming (in my opinion). Granted, I haven't read comics or gone into a comic store regularly in years, so they could have changed overall, but I doubt it.

If this is the same "nun," about what issue # did they finally change her costume?

[BishopofB&W]

While I've never read the series, is this the "Warrior Nun" where she wears a habit that reveals cleavage and shows off pretty much all of her legs? If this is it, I saw that as part of the desperation grunginess that comics were becoming (in my opinion). Granted, I haven't read comics or gone into a comic store regularly in years, so they could have changed overall, but I doubt it.

If this is the same "nun," about what issue # did they finally change her costume?

That's the one. I can't find any of the comics, but I've got a couple of trade paperbacks. I'll look in the #2 paperback: Rituals. In the plot, Areala nearly dies. While she's in coma, Mother Superior re-designs her outfit for more modesty. She explains that she never liked the old one due to its high '70s influence(Those mid-thigh slits up the sides). Understandable for a superhero comic book but inappropriate for a nun. BTW, her habit transformed into battle mode in a manner reminiscent of G-Force Transmute!) Anyway, an order of NY martial artist nuns complained and the writer got rid of the cleaveage and added leggings under the habit.

[SKJAM!]

Nah... I just want to put that team in the GGU.

By the by, I've mentioned the Jesus Freaks team/performance troupe in a couple of backgrounds. Would you like more information on them?

[Blue]

Doesn't it seem that religous based Superheroes get a sort of lopsided treatment? Characters like Thor, Hercules and others never seem to catch much flak for claiming to be pagan gods and such, but Christian based supers are either unheard of or portrayed as over zealous wack jobs. I'm not a particularly religous person so please don't take this a some sort of rant, just something I've noticed.

I think characters like Thor should be facing some major PR issues, more so than mutant really. Claiming not only to be divine, but Pagan would raise some serious issues in some places. Maybe there would be an organization like the Church of the Archangel Michael or other mutant hate groups, but religously inspired and dedicated to putting down/debunking the false gods. Has anyone done anything like this in their campaigns?

I haven't been in this thread yet, so I haven't read everything.

My character, Anthem, I made catholic, just because I was writing stories based around her and liked writing confessional scenes where her priest is the only one who knows her identity. And it made a nice contrast for... wait for it... the campaign's major religious evil whack-job. Yup, I'm guilty.

The primary villain of the campaign was a pope from a period back in the 600's when there was no pope in the Vatican record. So I made up a story that he was "expunged" from all records and denounced and lost to history due to his horrible inquisition-like tactics and ruthless pursuit of power for the church.

He had an ability to convert, though a baptismal, heroes into villains. He did so with 2 of the campaign background heroes, giving them religious names. SO there was not just one religious whack-job, there was a team! Magdalene, Crucifier, The Black Pope, etc.

But mind you, that doesn't keep me from making pagan whack-jobs too. I'm equal opportunity in that regard.

And I've recently been updating the greek gods to make them superheroes of ancient times, some of whom still exist today in lower profile capacities.

[OddHat]

In my own campaigns, the largest and most respected private force of Supers in the world is controlled by the Catholic Church. They are the closest I have to a JLI. One of my players is born-again, and had great fun playing a Demon-Fighting Priest working for Rome. Most of his characters are religious in their private lives.

Satanic and Edomite Cults are my favorite source for villains, and more or less every magician in my campaigns has some sort of theological link.

I've used religious Villain and Heroes from Christian, Jewish, Islamic, Shinto, Taoist and Hindu sources so far; rich sources of ideas, all of them. The key to doing it right is to take their beliefs seriously. Want a Hindu hero? Do your research, and treat him with respect. Want a Jewish Villain? Make sure that his reasons for acting as he does make as much sense as those of any of your other Villains. The trap to avoid is making a caricature. It can be tough.

When I can, I try to have religious villains pursue goals that make sense in context. If you're being chased by a Catholic super-team, it's because they've come to believe that you're under infernal influence or otherwise a threat to the world, not because "Catholics attack non-Catholics."

If you're not sure your group will be comfortable with it, it's best kept in the background.

[Worldmaker]

By the by, I've mentioned the Jesus Freaks team/performance troupe in a couple of backgrounds. Would you like more information on them?

In a couple of which backgrounds? You've mentioned them for characters already in play in the GGU?

By all means I'd like more information.

[Worldmaker]

The primary villain of the campaign was a pope from a period back in the 600's when there was no pope in the Vatican record. So I made up a story that he was "expunged" from all records and denounced and lost to history due to his horrible inquisition-like tactics and ruthless pursuit of power for the church.

He had an ability to convert, though a baptismal, heroes into villains. He did so with 2 of the campaign background heroes, giving them religious names. SO there was not just one religious whack-job, there was a team! Magdalene, Crucifier, The Black Pope, etc.

But mind you, that doesn't keep me from making pagan whack-jobs too. I'm equal opportunity in that regard.

Do you have a writeup for this guy?

[Rene]

Yes, Astro City's CONFESSION is probably the best attempt so far of mixing superheroes and religion in a positive (but not rosy-colored) light. The Confessor was a devout Christian super-character that was both admirable and complex.

BTW, the Islamic villain in Wild Cards is named "Nur-ah-Allah", the Light of Allah.

Wild Cards also had Reverend Leo Barnett. What was great about Barnett was that when you first hear of him (fundamentalist preacher who hates the Wild Card), you think he will be this archetypical religious wacko-villain, but he is a lot more complex (and even occasionaly sympathetic) than that. He is basically a nice guy who genuinely hates the sin but loves the sinner, even though he is kinda of an antagonist to most of the heroes, who are almost all liberals.

[SKJAM!]

In a couple of which backgrounds? You've mentioned them for characters already in play in the GGU?

By all means I'd like more information.

In the campaign background for Venture Institute itself, and Mr White (the VI librarian) and Redbird (just showing up to talk to Zach) are former members.

The Jesus Freaks group formed for the first time in 1968 when three deformed metahumans happened to meet at a Christian commune in northern Minnesota. They decided to put their talents to good use to raise funds for the commune by going around the countryside performing. Every once in a while they'd be able to use their powers to save lives or solve crimes too.

The group has grown (up to eight full-time members) and shrunk (down to one) several times over the decades. The membership requirements are being obviously physically deformed (angel wings don't count, devil wings do) and having accepted Jesus Christ as your lord and savior. Almost all of the members have had some sort of metahuman power, but usually at a low level. (50/50 up to 100/150 for the really impressive ones.) The group encourages all its members to learn some sort of performance skill, as their primary function is still fundraising for Christian charities.

While their official home is in Minnesota, the Jesus Freaks are usually on the road somewhere.

For those who haven't read the VI campaign materials, Mr. White is an eyeless albino who can read any form of print by touch. (He's also a skilled pianist.)

Redbird has red-feathered wings instead of arms, and the lower body of a bird. He can fly, and is pretty good at aerobatics.

[Pendaran]

Thanks, it also makes for good rivalry or hunted for any PCs who ARE 'real' gods or champions of Gods. If say, Magni (son of Thor) finds out there is some guy falsely calling himself Odin or Heimdell in order to pull a con... or Horus' champion sees a group of gullible folks gathering around a female mastermind who's dubbed herself Isis... well, once they find out, watch the fireworks start.

All I will say to this, Hermit, is "great minds..."

Grr.. you know, in that Horus-Re has been divinely sanctified as a Pharoh way, way, way back when, he'd probably have something of a deep personal conflict of not treating something like that as having to be dealt with as Pharoh would given the specific affrontery..

Wait, of course you know that Jeff :P

[Blue]

Do you have a writeup for this guy?

Not on this computer. Maybe on my laptop at home. I'll have to check.

[Vondy]

I thought thor took the position that the asgardians were worshipped as gods once, a long time ago, but not anymore - hence implying himself that he was not a god, or at least, not currently being worshipped as one.

If so he's pretty much said that he's just a really ancient alien/extradimensional being who uses his age old tried and tested "norse-storm-hammer-guy" motiff when fighting the forces of evil.

Maybe some fringers would point fingers and call him the "tool of the devil" or a "false god" or whatnot, but I would think mainstream folks and the media in general wouldn't be too peeved or worried about it. His "flak" would be minimal, I think.

I mean, come on, I'm an orthodox Jew - have you seen what some of the websites (blood libels online) out there say about my faith and the things I don't actually believe or do that they say I do? I don't get much flak when I'm out and about - especially not from your average "man on the street" (or at least I didn't when I was living in the diaspora, here its a complete nonsequiter).

I mean - instead of the problems coming from weirdos who hate them, what if the problems came from weirdos who loved them? What if they had cultists running around shadowing their every move, or leaving offerings outside their door? What if the problem stemmed from the claims their unwanted worshippers were making?

I can see it now:

Its a rare cozy and quiet evening at the Avengers mansion. Just having finished his hundred-ton workout followed by a hot shower Thor has sat down at the kitchen table and begun to crack walnuts with mjolnir for the the scarlet witch's famous walnut-run sponge cake when Cap walks in and sits down across from him. The winghead sighed, looked concerned.

"Thor," he said. "Got a minute."

"Verily," norse-storm-hammer-hero answered. "Is something amiss."

"Well," Cap said, somewhat uncomfortable. "Its the god thing."

"God?" norse-storm-hammer-hero asked, curious. "I did not know you were a religious man."

"Its not something I talk about much," Cap answered. "My faith is an intensely private affair, and each man has a right to believe as he chooses..."

"Yet something troubles you," norse-storm-hammer-hero said, cracking another nut, a small zap being heard.

"Its Tommy Brown."

"Tommy Brown?"

"He's a boy who goes to my church," Cap answered. "His parents are very worried about him. He's become... confused."

"A crisis of faith?"

"You could say that," Cap answered, sighing again, still uncomfortable. "He thinks you're a god."

Hours later Thor is sitting next to Tommy on the couch in the boys parents home, his hand on his shoulder as the parents, reverened miller, and Cap listen quietly from the kitchen: "So you see Tommy," norse-storm-hammer-hero answered, "though mankind was once primitive and superstitious and worshipped my people as Gods we are in fact merely visiting alien beings with strange and amazing powers from a pocket dimension called asgard."

"Oh, I understand now Mr. Thor. Your a space alien."

"Er... Good Tommy."

Tommy's father walks into the room tamping his pipe, "thank you Mr. Thor for setting our boy straight. It was mighty neighborly of you."

"I am the mighty thor, it was my pleasure."

Cap and reverend miller look on, nodding sagely while Mrs. Brown rushes up, a fresh baked cherry pie in hand, and kisses norse-storm-hammer-hero on the cheek. "Won't you stay for dinner, we're having roast beef."

"I'm afraid I can't Mrs. Brown. Ragnorok is coming after-all." Throwing mjolnir and catching it by its strap and flying out the window and back towards the avengers mansion.

Reverend Miller looked at Cap: "Ragnor-what?"

Cap smiled with chagrin: "Don't ask."

----------------

Landing across the street from the Avengers Mansion Thor tucked mjolnir into his belt and started towards the gate, stopping in the street as his eyes fell upon a flyer tacked to a nearby power-pole. It advertised a cult of thor sponsored orgy and human sacrifice, a picture of his face used without permission was boldly on the copy. As he looked down the street the he norse-storm-hammer-hero's blood ran cold. All of the poles had such flyers on them...

"These people are all mad!"

[bblackmoor]

instead of the problems coming from weirdos who hate them, what if the problems came from weirdos who loved them? What if they had cultists running around shadowing their every move, or leaving offerings outside their door? What if the problem stemmed from the claims their unwanted worshippers were making?

That is a great idea.

One of my current characters actually is an avatar of a Celtic/Roman deity. I have been planning to kill him off the next time I run, in dramatic fashion, so that I can recycle the basic character concept without all of the baggage the current character has accumulated.

I think you just provided my new character a Disad.