Anyone have Tomb of Horrors?

[paigeoliver]

Does anyone here have the old D&D module "Tomb of Horrors". I have most of it, but I am missing the map. I was wanting to modify it and use it for hero, but I can't make sense of it without the map.

[Gunrunner]

It wouldn't happen to be a Ravenloft module would it? I have a friend who used to run Ravenloft campaigns, so he might have it. Heck, he may have it even if it just normal D&D. In either case, I'll see if he has it and try to get a copy to you if he does. I'll get back to you when I find out.

[Vondy]

I don't have it. You can download Return to Tomb of horrors (which has all the maps, redone) as an e-book for $5. Not sure if that helps, at all.

[paigeoliver]

Oh, Ok, I'll do that if no one has the map for me.

[paigeoliver]

It wouldn't happen to be a Ravenloft module would it? I have a friend who used to run Ravenloft campaigns, so he might have it. Heck, he may have it even if it just normal D&D. In either case, I'll see if he has it and try to get a copy to you if he does. I'll get back to you when I find out.

It is not a Ravenloft module, it is a 1st edition D&D module, by Gary Gygax I believe. It was a VERY popular module and saw like 7 printings and a deluxe rerelease (Return to the Tomb of Horrors).

[lrojas]

Actually, the reason it became popular is because Gygax ran the module at cons and killed everyone who played it ( the characters not the actual people ), and so GMs started wanting to run it for their players back at home....

if you ask me... Tomb of horrors is a Sadist Dungeon made to torture players... the chances of surviving it ( as designed ) are very slim.

Temple of elemental Evil is a better module IMHO

[Metaphysician]

Yeah, I've heard its one of the most unwinnable modules ever created.

I think one called Throne of Bloodstone took the record, though. . .

[Hugh Neilson]

I think one called Throne of Bloodstone took the record, though. . .

Throne was, I believe, winnable. It tok some very tough combats, but it was made for "levels 20 - 100", IIRC.

Tomb, on the other hand, simply included a myriad of traps of the "Dragon's Lair" variety. Go the wrong way, and it's all over. I believe there was one combat, if you got to the end, and good luck winning that!

[Eosin]

I have played both the Throne & Tomb - we attempted the tomb a half dozen times but never got terribly far. The combat at the end IMO withhind sight is simply unwinnible under the conditions it was meant to be played.

The Throne of Bloodstone game on the other hand lasted some 10 months or so before it stalled. We weren't even dead - just at the brink of disaster with no real way out that did not involve mass casualty. We were looking an abyssal red-dragon in the mouth and under 2E? he was about to smoke us like a pack of cools.

The Throne can be a long term viable game but that is not true of the Tomb.

PS - I don't have the maps but you could probably google them and get some success.

[Hugh Neilson]

I have played both the Throne & Tomb - we attempted the tomb a half dozen times but never got terribly far. The combat at the end IMO withhind sight is simply unwinnible under the conditions it was meant to be played.

The final combat is less combat and more trap, much like the rest of the scenario. If you guess the best tactical approaches, you might survive. But you have to guess - nothing in the scenario tells you those unusual tactics which can succeed.

[Balok]

Yeah, I've heard its one of the most unwinnable modules ever created.

You can read about the history of the Tomb of Horrors here. Basically, it was created to show how a DM might deal with characters who had achieved high levels, thought they were unkillable, and needed a lesson. At least, according to Gygax.

Yes, the Tomb is unfair, in the sense that it's hard for players to deduce their way out of it -- they're liable to be hurt or killed. But it's NOT unfair when one approaches the problems from the perspective of Acererak, the inhabitant, whose goal was to keep riff-raff out of his tomb. He wasn't interested in anyone that couldn't get by his defenses -- because the ones who could were the tastiest, best souls for devouring. In addition, a *real* tomb builder would go out of his way to design traps people couldn't easily evade or disarm. His goal, after all, is to keep folks out, not to give them puzzles they can solve in exchange for a huge bank account.

As a GM, I made rumors about the Tomb clear to those players who thought to challenge it. If they asked around, they got a lot of "certain death to go in there" and "no one's ever come out" messages. In other words, I made it clear the module wouldn't be easy, and maybe not even survivable. Having prepared players, I figured if they still wanted to take on the challenge, that was on them -- and if it cost 'em characters, well, D&D is one of the games where character death is both real, and at times expected -- not like a lot of modern games that are based on genres where the protagonists are rarely even seriously harmed, much less killed.

I did have a player survive the Tomb (the only survivor from a party of six), and he got a lot of treasure, a lot of experience, and a lot of acclaim for having done it.

Not all groups like to face the real possibility of death, especially if they've worked a long time on a character. My view, depending on the genre, is that the threat is what adds spice. YMMV.

[Metaphysician]

I don't know, from what I've heard of Throne, the random encounters scattered throughout were rigged to be level-scalable.

[Savinien]

I have the map for Tomb of Horrors.

I'm not too familiar with the Bloodstone module, but love Ghost Tower Inverness which is slightly more 'winnable' than ToH.

Send me a PM if you're still intersted in getting a view of the map.

[Eosin]

Balok -

We played the module several times under 1E - the thing that made the final encounter unwinnable was that the demi-lich had never been published and was a monster unique to the module. Under those old rules - unless you knew that you were going to fight a demi-lich I just can't see how anyone could possibly guess and have prepared the spells necessary to win. If you play the module after the Fiend Folio (IIRC) then I think you got a chance if you knew the weaknesses of the DL (not much of one but at least a slim chance).

Anyhow congrats to your survivor.

[joen00b]

I know i have it somewhere. I even found my Lich Lords over the weekend (the end of true power gaming in D&D. I called it my Hero Killer module! as it killed everyones 'uber' characters that were ridiculous to begin with).