New damage shield construction

[Sean Waters]

You can build a continuous EB No range One Hex AE, personal immunity, like a damage shield but cheaper and more effective: an 8d6 EB built this way would cost 73 points as against a DS of the same power which would cost 100. You can make it 4" radius for only 86 points. You don't need to grab anyone to damage them, just stand close.

Buy lots of running. Run close to lots of opponents. Run past the tough ones several times. If you can do this in a half move you can end with a martial dodge, because you haven't made an attack roll yet...OK, eventually someone will twig and hold an action...then you abort to that dodge early...

I can only think that this must be wrong, but can anyone tell me why? (OK the second version might be a LITTLE unpopular with team mates if you are not a bit careful...but you it is still darned effective and you could voluntarily limit the radius to (say) one hex radius (seven hexes)). Oh and the END cost is marginally higher, but END is cheap...

Here's a thought as well - you can buy UBO for the personal immunity part of the new construct, so for just 12 more points you could exempt up to 8 people from taking damage from your attack (or 5 points for one). Can't do that with Damage Shield...

[Lord Liaden]

Not to in any way denigrate your analysis, Lem - I think you've defined this issue very well - but the 5E construction of Damage Shield is one of the most controversial elements of the system. Many people (myself included) believe that DS is too expensive for what you get, when compared to constructs such as yours.

There have been many "fixes" proposed for this, from changing the cost of the Damage Shield Advantage, to folding Continuous into the cost of the Advantage as the default, to allowing all Ranged Powers with DS to take a No Range Limitation. Unfortunately there's been little concensus on what the best fix would be.

Just Search for "Damage Shield" and you'll get an eyeful.

[Sean Waters]

Not to in any way denigrate your analysis, Lem - I think you've defined this issue very well - but the 5E construction of Damage Shield is one of the most controversial elements of the system. Many people (myself included) believe that DS is too expensive for what you get, when compared to constructs such as yours.

There have been many "fixes" proposed for this, from changing the cost of the Damage Shield Advantage, to folding Continuous into the cost of the Advantage as the default, to allowing all Ranged Powers with DS to take a No Range Limitation. Unfortunately there's been little concensus on what the best fix would be.

Just Search for "Damage Shield" and you'll get an eyeful.

Boy are you right!

It might be interesting to get a concensus, perhaps post a poll, but then it might be a long poll list.

1. Damage shield is fine leave it alone
2. I don't like having to take 'no range' and not getting a limitation
3. I don't like having to pay for continuous on top of the DS advantage
4. I don't like the way you can't use the power as you normally would in addition to the DS effect
5. I don't like the wallpaper in here (there is always one...)

Anyone think of any more to add? Preferably not about the decor.

[PhilFleischmann]

I think the poll choices would be not "I don't like XYZ about Damage Shield," but "I think Damage Shield should be like this."

1. DS is fine as-is, leave it alone.
2. Don't require Continuous as a separate Advantage (like 4th Ed.)
3. Require Continuous, but allow No Range to be taken (no change for Drain, but cheaper for EB).
4. Make it a flat +1 Advantage, which includes the Continuous and No Range.
5. Make it a flat +3/4 Advantage, which includes the Continuous and No Range.
6. Eliminate the DS Advantage completely, and do it as above (Cont, 1hex AE, PI, No Range, perhaps with an additional optional limitation: "Requires Physical Contact").
7. Eliminate DS as an Advantage, and make it into a separate power.

IIRC, these are all the suggestions I can remember people making on these boards. If you make a poll, you'll need to add

8. Other. Explain.

of course.

For the record, my preference is #2. (But that's what a lot of people say about my preferences. )