Power Framework woes

[C_Zeree]

Character concept: Force Mage with a gun.

Being a super hero level game, the character buys the gun, putting it into an MP because he wants to use different bullets. AP, frag, rubber, regular.

He also has his Magic VPP. Being a clever character, he crates a spell, enchanting his gun to provide an extra kick to his bullets. The spell idea is to provide 2xKB and +xd6 STUN to every attack up to 60 AP. Idea great, but I hit a wall because according to the rules one power framework can’t have a power that adds to or modifies a slot in another framework.

Suggestions? I was thinking GM’s fiat, since, to me, it makes dramatic sense. I’ll admit I’ve just taken up the rules though.

[Tom McCarthy]

I believe that limitation on frameworks boosting frameworks is to discourage abuse or surprisingly powerful combos. It takes relatively little in terms of VPP to really enhance a nice multipower or elemental control.

Since you as the GM see it coming, try letting your player use it for a game or two, telling him you'll put the kibosh on it if it's too potent. Give it a go and see what happens.

If it's too strong, try using the VPP to aid the reserve and slots; it's uglier mathematically, but gives a mid-point between yes/no.

[JmOz]

Correct me if I am wrong, but two different frameworks can be used together to make a multiple Power attack, just define the VPP as a EB with x2 KB (or if you want to get nasty, a strait EB, then a Flash: Touch, Does KB, Double KB, both bought with OAF (a 60 point VPP witll be able to create a 8d6 EB 0end, and the above flash 0end at 8d6)

[C_Zeree]

Originally posted by JmOz
Correct me if I am wrong, but two different frameworks can be used together to make a multiple Power attack, just define the VPP as a EB with x2 KB (or if you want to get nasty, a strait EB, then a Flash: Touch, Does KB, Double KB, both bought with OAF (a 60 point VPP witll be able to create a 8d6 EB 0end, and the above flash 0end at 8d6)

True, and the second version is quite mean. It is a possible work, although I would probably have it cost END, a spell after all, and I'd also tack on Invisible Power. It works with the attack, no glowing/flaming/sparkling bullets.

[JmOz]

Ahh but you see this is the wonderfull thing of the F/X: It doesn't need to, the F/X is magical bullets that look normal

as for the 0 end, well spice to taste, I figured it would be a minor spell type thing, but what ever

[C_Zeree]

Originally posted by JmOz
Ahh but you see this is the wonderfull thing of the F/X: It doesn't need to, the F/X is magical bullets that look normal

A concept I'll have to mull over. Two powers covered by the same F/X. I guess I already have that witht he different bullets though.

I didn't mean the comment about END to be a nitpick, just the flaovr of my system. As you said add spice to taste.

Thanks JmOz for your help, as well as Tom.

[ChaosDrgn]

May also want to look at the active points of what the person is doing and adjust it for your game.

[Oruncrest]

My suggestion: Use your Magic VPP to create an AID power to boost your multipower. The only problem is that when you change the VPP, the AID will fade, but that shouldn't be too big a problem.

[C_Zeree]

Originally posted by Oruncrest
My suggestion: Use your Magic VPP to create an AID power to boost your multipower. The only problem is that when you change the VPP, the AID will fade, but that shouldn't be too big a problem.

According to the guru in the FAQ:

Q: In light of the rule that one Power Framework can’t have a power that adds to or modifies a slot in another Power Framework (5E 203), could a character have (for example) a slot in an Elemental Control that contained an Adjustment Power that modified the reserve of a Multipower (not the slots, but the reserve)?

A: No, but of course the GM could allow this if he wanted to.

I was browsing the FAQ earlier today to make sure I didn't look over anything, and remembered seeing something about Adjustments. So Aid to frameworks suffers the same as my problem.

[PhilFleischmann]

I don't have a problem ignoring the "No Framework can add to another Framework" rule in certain circumstances. For example:

Case 1 - completely within the rules:
A simple gun 2d6 RKA.
A VPP spell pool of "enhance the gun" spells (make the bullets AP, Explosion, Penetrating, Extra Damage, etc.)

Case 2 - not strictly legal
Same as case 1, only now the gun has two settings/bullet types:
MP
1 u 2d6 RKA
2 u 6d6 EB
Same VPP as case 1.

Seriously, what is so abusive about case 2? You get more flexibility, and you pay more to get it. That's fair isn't it?

[CrosshairCollie]

Darn it, where's my book ...

In the 'overview of powers' section, where it goes over powers by type, under Adjustment powers, isn't there an Advantage for Adjustment Powers that lets them affect Adders and Advantages? Isn't that pretty much perfect for adding the Double Knockback? Like that with another Aid to boost the damage output (rather than linking an EB, which would apply against defenses separately), and you're in business.

[Southern Cross]

Not having my copy of FREd with me, I believe that an Aid that can add Adders to a Power is an Aid with a +1 Power Advantage (It still isn't possible to add Advantages to an existing Power,though).
If you can only add Power Advantages to the existing MP then you might want to purchase Variable Advantage as a Naked Power Advantage,with the -1/2 limitation "Not Usable when VPP is in use".