Hard Target: Statting The Minigun

[Black Lotus]

why is it "str min doesn't add to damage"? it normally doesn't for an RKA

You always add that in for ranged weapons, that's why it's there. With H2H it affects the damage you can do with the weapon, up to 2x the weapon's original Damage Classes.

[Toadmaster]

Would you allow Reduced Penetration to be bought double-strength (attacks are divided by 1/4) for -1/2 instead of -1/4? To put it another way, the attack's penetration ability is quartered, instead of merely halved.

Yes I would allow this, in fact I have done so for shotguns to increase variables, I use unmodified damage (although reduced DC) for sabot slugs, 1x Rpen for Slugs (these are quite deadly but don't compare to rifles for penetration since they are large diameter, fairly slow softish lead bullets), 2x Rpen, Red by Range for Buckshot and 3x Rpen, RbR for smaller shot, (also reduced starting DC) this gives me a shotgun similar to the ones in 3rd edition, a 12 gauge looks something like this

Slug 2 1/2d6 RPen (two 1d6+1 attacks vs armor)
Sabot slug 1 1/2d6
Buck 4d6 Rpen x2, RbR (4 1d6 attacks vs armor at close range)
Small shot 3d6 RPen x3, RbR (8 1 pip attacks vs armor at close range)

So against unarmored targets the shotgun is very nasty, even with an inappropriate hunting load, but as you add armor it rapidly requires slugs to have a chance and you really should get yourself a rifle.

[ghost-angel]

why is it "str min doesn't add to damage"? it normally doesn't for an RKA

The books states you should use this for building Guns, specifically because when building weapons STR can add to damage - such as simulating certain Bows or other muscle-powered ranged weapons - if you want them to.

It's a book legal Limitation for Real Weapon RKA.

[ghost-angel]

Okay, here's the tentative first writeup.

General Electric XM-214 Automatic Gun ___________________

RKA 4d6 (60 Character Points), Area of Effect (1 Hex; +1/2), Autofire 10 Only (+1), Charges (200; +1); Beam (-1/4), OAF Bulky (-1 1/2), Real Weapon (-1/4), Reduced Penetration (-1/4), Strength Minimum (26, STR Min Cannot Add/ Subtract Damage; -1 1/2). Notes: Weapon MUST be used two-handed. The weapon weighs 30 lbs, and the clip (backpack) weighs 35 lbs.

Active Points: 210. Real Point Cost: 44.

Comments? Suggestions? Additions? Criticisms?

EDIT: Changed Autofire 10 to Autofire 10 Only.

Just from a pure gameplay POV I'd be inclined to reduce the Autofire to 5 instead, but you've got that to accurately reflect the RoF, correct? If yes then nevermind.

Due to the Reduced Penetration this will effectively knocksomeone silly if they've got 12rPD but never hurt them.. in fact someone with 9rPD may not get that hurt at all. You've mentioned you like a higher lethality rate, or at least damage rate, so you might either want to increase to 6D6K (for 2x3D6 with Reduced Penetration) or remove that limitation.

Other than that it appears to be an effective build.

[Black Lotus]

Just from a pure gameplay POV I'd be inclined to reduce the Autofire to 5 instead, but you've got that to accurately reflect the RoF, correct? If yes then nevermind.

Due to the Reduced Penetration this will effectively knocksomeone silly if they've got 12rPD but never hurt them.. in fact someone with 9rPD may not get that hurt at all. You've mentioned you like a higher lethality rate, or at least damage rate, so you might either want to increase to 6D6K (for 2x3D6 with Reduced Penetration) or remove that limitation.

Other than that it appears to be an effective build.

The bullets are only 5.56mm, so their low penetration is quite appropriate (all other things being equal, of course). I may still increase the damage anyway, though.

[ghost-angel]

The bullets are only 5.56mm, so their low penetration is quite appropriate (all other things being equal, of course). I may still increase the damage anyway, though.

and besides.. fired upon a crowd of unarmored normals they become dogmeat in short order. So, 4D6 may be the best damage level for the effect desired. Or compromise and go up to 5D6.

[Black Lotus]

You know, it seems to me that firearms with an Autofire rate of 10 should have some sort of default OCV bonus. Getting up to those levels is hard uness you fire upon a very large object....

Wait. There it is. Don't expext to hit something 5 - 10 times with the minigun unless it's kind of large and has a crappy DCV, or you are a master at using the weapon. Makes sense. And with the fact that it is AoE (1 Hex), it makes even more sense since it goes against a DCV of 3. And also, upping the OCV would make the gun quite deadly to smaller targets.

Okay, I'm happy. Just needed to write out my thoughts. And I think, with the AoE and everything else, 4d6 (Reduced Penetration) should be enough damage for a tight volley of 5 5.56mm projectiles, even with my crazy damage system.

[Fox1]

You know, it seems to me that firearms with an Autofire rate of 10 should have some sort of default OCV bonus. Getting up to those levels is hard uness you fire upon a very large object....

Dark Champions brings back the old rule of +1 OCV per 5 shots in Autofire as an option.

[Fox1]

why is it "str min doesn't add to damage"? it normally doesn't for an RKA

The FAQ attempts to answer this, and does it very badly, i.e. it was based upon an original concept of killing attack that never made it into the rules others.

Think of it like this (in designer thoughts):

"Killing Attack gives 1d6 per 15 points, if they want a ranged version of it- tack on usable at Range. Hmm, STR shouldn't add, lets make that a limit...

That's cool, let's work on other things.

You know a thought occurs, maybe it would be better if we define two types of KA, one ranged and one not. STR wouldn't normally work with the Ranged version... Yeah, that's better.

<Designer forgets to remove that note about that "STR not adding to STR Min" limit for RKA based firearms>


Not really sure if that was the exact thought process, but it how the FAQ made it sound.

Whatever the truth, it's a error that they never corrected. Best option is to house rule it away.

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

ah ok, thanks guys!

[pinecone]

Write up looks cool...I'd have made it a multi so I can also have a AE: Line for supression fire as well... I guess a Cyborged commando might very well carry something like this while on a "bug hunt"......

[Black Lotus]

Here's a quandary I've been mulling over (again): Should I add any +OCV modifier to the writeup, given as it's Autofire 10? Such as +1 or +2? I'd welcome any suggestions (and logic behind the suggestions, if you want) anyone has concerning the issue. Apparently the official convention is +1 OCV per 5 Autofire, but perhaps the sheer bulkiness of this gun offsets that. And, of course, you could quite probably score many hits against a large target.

The main disadvantage to +2 OCV is that it guarantees one extra hit on the target (every roill will be made by an additional 2), making this weapon +4d6 deadlier against smaller targets.

And what about RMod? Miniguns do have quite a long range, as evidenced by their barrels, and it's easy to track by watching bullet impacts. On the other hand, perhaps the recoil of the weapon offsets this, as well.

Suggestions?

[Black Lotus]

Write up looks cool...I'd have made it a multi so I can also have a AE: Line for supression fire as well... I guess a Cyborged commando might very well carry something like this while on a "bug hunt"......

I've thought about AE: Line, but it just doesn't seem as though it ought to work that way -- mainly because the Line would have to be No Range, and also quite long to accurately represent the range of the weapon (it has quite a long range). Though I do agree that bullets which miss the main target perhaps should get an opportunity to hit targets behind the first target -- since there are so many bullets. Still, it's be far to overpowered that way, and I'm not sure if it's the best solution.

Oh, and what is that modifier that makes a weapon more effective at certain ranges? Like when a gun is more effective at close range? I need to add that in. This weapon should get a large bonus if fired at a target who is adjacent or close by. Suggestions?

[Roy_The_Ruthles]

i think +2 is nessisary, to represent the fact that it's a torrent of metal

[gewing]

One of the things suggested for making the real-life man-pack minigun more practical as a weapon was to lower the RoF to 3000 rounds per minute, which is still an insane stream of metal flying downrange but perhaps a bit more manageable.

IIRC the REAL ones usually downshifted to only 1000rpm for battery powered use. IThink it took something like 2 12 volt auto batteries to run them (many military systems have traditionally been 24 volt).


There are replica gatling guns in .22lr. I'd love to see one converted to have a large ammo supply and run by a motor.

If you use the 5 bullets = one shot idea(good one by the way) I'd make it reduced pen. Those 5 bullets will tear things up, but not penetrate any significant amount more armor.

You might make it area effect Line also.