Difficulty ratings for Bestiary/MMM/etc...

[DarkGreen]

Hello all... I've finally convinced my D&D group to come to the side of truth and light (HERO obviously).

One thing I did find useful in DnD was the ability to look up monsters by relative difficulty so if the PCs do something unexpected and I need a monster I can find one.

Has anybody put together a rough list of the published monsters in a spreadsheet? I can come up with some offense and defense metrics, but don't want to re-enter all the data.

-Dark Green

[ghost-angel]

In Hero, I've never found it that easy.

A 150 pt character could be easily outdone by a 75pt character who is optimized to kill.

That said, the back of HSB and MMM both have Monster Summary Tables listing in brief the majority of their combat abilities.

[Curufea]

The best way to do it, I think is to work out where your PC's biggest strengths and weaknesses are - and compare the monsters to those to work out if they are difficult to defeat.
i.e. if your PCs don't have mental defences - any monster with an ego attack will be quite difficult.

[DarkGreen]

The best way to do it, I think is to work out where your PC's biggest strengths and weaknesses are - and compare the monsters to those to work out if they are difficult to defeat.
i.e. if your PCs don't have mental defences - any monster with an ego attack will be quite difficult.

That's an excellent point and place to start.

I was thinking if I had the tables in the back of the books in an excel table I could compute columns for offensive and defensive effectiveness as a start. I know the point values don't do the trick (although it's better than earlier editions where giants and vermin had hundreds of points in size powers, those were the days ).

[Lord Liaden]

You might get some use out of this online Combat Rating System for HERO characters.

BTW this webpage will show you how to save the program to your computer.

[DarkGreen]

You might get some use out of this online Combat Rating System for HERO characters.

Wow Liaden, that's most excellent, nice linkage!

Now I just need the score for all the monsters

Also, lol at your title.

[Lord Liaden]

In case you didn't see it, check out the second link that I added by edit.

And I don't exactly see you outclassing me in the face department.

[DarkGreen]

In case you didn't see it, check out the second link that I added by edit.

And I don't exactly see you outclassing me in the face department.

Very cool, I can see the formula (AND it's a nice lesson in active html...)

Faces are over-rated.

[Frenchman]

I made up a really quick and dirty way to evaluate a character's combat ability: OCV+DCV+0.5(rDEF)+0.25(DEF)+DCs+Movement= a number. If they have martial arts, add +4.
You can compare that number to other numbers and see how they stack up. It doesn't take speed into account, and extreme min/maxing can throw it off too, but it works well for the most part.
Oh, yeah, definitions.
OCV and DCV - The characters modified OCV and DCV using all combat skill levels that can be applied to one attack, but not using any particular maneuver.
rDEF - resistant PD + resistant ED.
DEF - NONresistant PD + ED
DCs - the number of damage classes done with the attack used to figure CVs above. Obviously, you should choose their typical/most powerful attack.
Movement - The number of inches of combat movement in their primary mode of movement.

Again, its Q&D, but it lets you gauge two opponents against eachother at a glance.

[Curufea]

I'm not sure a single number is best - I'll have a look at compiling some lists.
Really you want max of PD, ED, EGO damage and defense for a turn (so multiply it by speed), OCV and DCV, with maybe a special icon for unusual attacks or defenses. So, seven numbers.

They can go here.

[Doc Democracy]

I made up a really quick and dirty way to evaluate a character's combat ability: OCV+DCV+0.5(rDEF)+0.25(DEF)+DCs+Movement= a number. If they have martial arts, add +4.
You can compare that number to other numbers and see how they stack up. It doesn't take speed into account, and extreme min/maxing can throw it off too, but it works well for the most part.

You could get Hero Designer to do that for you...each character sheet could have that number generated automatically somewhere for you....

Doc

[Frenchman]

You could get Hero Designer to do that for you...each character sheet could have that number generated automatically somewhere for you....

Doc

Thats an intriguing idea. Too bad I have to go to work right now.

[Frenchman]

I also like Curufea's idea of us (the HERO community) compiling a database of relative threat level. But what would an "average" threat be for different point values and genres? Figuring out what an "average" 100-point beasty should have for attack and defense values may go a long way to getting a standard Threat Level agreed upon.

[DarkGreen]

Thats an intriguing idea. Too bad I have to go to work right now.

That does sound cool. Did they release hero designer files on the bestiary / MMM ?

[Captain Obvious]

But what would an "average" threat be for different point values and genres?

An average measure by itself would be meaningless. You'd have to also run the PCs through the same algorithm to compare them to the monster in question.

The 200 point Elementals and Demons from Valdorian Age are pretty scary to VA characters, who, unless they're all Conaned up, will need to figure out their weaknesses to defeat them. The same creatures are a challenge to a typical high fantasy party, and they're an appetizer for fantasy supers.

But, if some calculation says that they're, say, a 10 threat, then you can see that your party of VA thieves is a 4, your other VA group of Conan tributes is a 6, your Turakian party is an 8, and your Mythic Greece party-of-the-gods is a 16, and get some idea from that.

Situation can matter too. A giant spider is a lot scarier when you're scaling a cliff than it is when you're on a plain.

The best thing to do would be to compare CVs, compare party damage vs monster BODY and vice versa, and compare movement abilities, all with situation in mind. Multiples of a monster (a pack, a flock, a horde, what have you) would effectively be the same as an increase of damage and BODY of a single critter.