Report from the Hero Announcement #2

[archermoo]

The meat of the announcement is that Cryptic is indeed going to be coming out with a Champions MMORPG called Champions Online, probably due out in 2009, though that is a WAG on my part. In an interesting twist, rather than Cryptic licensing the Champions Universe from DoJ, they are buying the Champions and Dark Champions IP (except Harbinger of Justice ), and as part of the deal are licensing the rights to print RPG books for those IP back to DoJ in perpetuity (and DoJ doesn't have to pay for it).

DoJ and Cryptic will be working closely together to help insure that any changes to the CU for Champions Online get reflected in the CU books that DoJ will be publishing. Both content-wise and appearance-wise.
Important Note: Cryptic is NOT buying the Hero System IP, just the Champions and Dark Champions IP.

Another Important Note: Champions Online will not be a Hero System MMORPG. My understanding is that Hero is planning on releasing a guide to allow players of Champions Online to recreate their characters in the Hero System at some point after CO comes out, but that it will NOT be using the Hero System itself.

Cryptic has also licensed the Hero System from DoJ so that they can use HERO terminology to describe things. Cryptic has also said that their plan is that CO will have an unprecidented level of customizability in character creation. There is the chance that if Cryptic and DoJ agree that the level of customizability is up to the standards of the HERO System the game may also get hung with the title of HERO Online. Though DoJ retains the right to say "no" on that.

One of the design features that Darren mentioned that Cryptic is looking at implementing that would allow you during character creation to create your own nemesis.

There is also every chance that there will be DoJ produced books that have bits and peices that will be useful for the CO players. Behind the scenes type things.

Oh, and Important Thing: DoJ will be getting access to Cryptic Studios art for publishing in their books.

Important Note from Steve: HERO 6th will in no way be "dumbed down" to make it more appealing to MMO players. I'll note he says this as an MMO player himself.

[yamamura]

The meat of the announcement is that Cryptic is indeed going to be coming out with a Champions MMORPG called Champions Online, probably due out in 2009, though that is a WAG on my part. In an interesting twist, rather than Cryptic licensing the Champions Universe from DoJ, they are buying the Champions and Dark Champions IP (except Harbinger of Justice ), and as part of the deal are licensing the rights to print RPG books for those IP back to DoJ in perpetuity (and DoJ doesn't have to pay for it).

DoJ and Cryptic will be working closely together to help insure that any changes to the CU for Champions Online get reflected in the CU books that DoJ will be publishing. Both content-wise and appearance-wise.
Important Note: Cryptic is NOT buying the Hero System IP, just the Champions and Dark Champions IP.

Another Important Note: Champions Online will not be a Hero System MMORPG. My understanding is that Hero is planning on releasing a guide to allow players of Champions Online to recreate their characters in the Hero System at some point after CO comes out, but that it will NOT be using the Hero System itself.

Cryptic has also licensed the Hero System from DoJ so that they can use HERO terminology to describe things. Cryptic has also said that their plan is that CO will have an unprecidented level of customizability in character creation. There is the chance that if Cryptic and DoJ agree that the level of customizability is up to the standards of the HERO System the game may also get hung with the title of HERO Online. Though DoJ retains the right to say "no" on that.

One of the design features that Darren mentioned that Cryptic is looking at implementing that would allow you during character creation to create your own nemesis.

There is also every chance that there will be DoJ produced books that have bits and peices that will be useful for the CO players. Behind the scenes type things.

Oh, and Important Thing: DoJ will be getting access to Cryptic Studios art for publishing in their books.

Important Note from Steve: HERO 6th will in no way be "dumbed down" to make it more appealing to MMO players. I'll note he says this as an MMO player himself.

Good! CoH/CoV needs the competition. Yay on DoJ and Cryptic's part!

[Omegaplex]

That's pretty exciting for all you guys. I wish you the best - should be a succcessful venture, too. But for me, personally, I don't MMO - I've been down that nasty timesink road, and simply can't invest in it anymore juggling an amazing wife, 2 great kids, and being a full-time cop. I find that people who are really into MMO's (play more than maybe a few hours a week, which will get you a good character in about 5 years) don't have kids. How the hell does Steve MMO with his schedule? I'm betting he's a level 3 tank in City of Heroes

But buying re-releases of books I already own, simply to tie-in to a game I won't play, isn't a win/win scenario for me. Might be a win/lose scenario if the books really kick rear, but we'll have to wait and see on that one.

I'll say this - Cryptic makes a great superhero MMO. I've been into City of Heroes (still have it on my PC even), and know they make a game you can't stop playing.

It's why I stopped

Anyway, keep chuggin' HERO!

[SAVeira]

In an interesting twist, rather than Cryptic licensing the Champions Universe from DoJ, they are buying the Champions and Dark Champions IP (except Harbinger of Justice ), and as part of the deal are licensing the rights to print RPG books for those IP back to DoJ in perpetuity (and DoJ doesn't have to pay for it).

Hope this does not come to back to haunt them.

A friend of mine was one of the creator of Heavy Gear. His royality checks came from Activision instead of DP9 for a couple years. Activison did not acquired the computer game license in 1995, the truth was that they got the IP. Dream Pod 9 had to license the games back from Activision. This created a number of headaches for DP9 over the later on. Activision may have sold the rights back but I am not aware of the current situation.

Steve being a lawyer should hopefully have a much better contact.

[Enforcer84]

I'm terribly happy to hear this news.

[Silverbullet]

Wow! Thats pretty cool. So does DoJ/Hero Games have a deal to be part of the development of the Champions Universe?

The continued "Champions ongoing story" is what I'm getting at....

[Supreme Serpent]

Another Important Note: Champions Online will not be a Hero System MMORPG. My understanding is that Hero is planning on releasing a guide to allow players of Champions Online to recreate their characters in the Hero System at some point after CO comes out, but that it will NOT be using the Hero System itself.

Cryptic has also licensed the Hero System from DoJ so that they can use HERO terminology to describe things. Cryptic has also said that their plan is that CO will have an unprecidented level of customizability in character creation.

Hmm. While having a pre-made universe saves Cryptic a good bit of work, I wonder if the CU will have enough appeal. While many folks here would be interested in playing in that universe, and some MMO gamers will give anything a shot, I think this'll have to be pretty good to really compete with City of Heroes. For most folks the CU properties aren't familiar enough to pull them over like a Marvel/DC license could have.

Kind of bummed that not using the Hero system itself, that was going to be part of the appeal to me. I guess the programmers looked at 5ER and threatened to revolt. The 'unprecedented level of customizability' sounds promising, if done well could help pull people in from other MMOs and also help gateway people to the RPG. "Start with X points, build the character how you want, earn XP you can save/spend as you go along" vs levels and 'all characters at X level are the same' type design. Want to start out with a Power 8 blast and lousy defenses? Go for it. Want to start with high accuracy but weak attacks? Go for it. etc.

Look forward to hearing more, will probably try it out, but have doubts as to how well it will do in the larger market. If it does poorly...well, no real skin off of DOJ's back from the sound of the deal. If it does well, we might look forward to Cryptic licensing out ChampionsClix, other Champions toys, cartoons and movie deals...who knows?

[Savinien]

It sounds like a win-win to me. Current HERO fans can keep playing 5e if they want, but the MMO will bring in hundreds of thousands of new players. Even if only a small percentage want to try and the pen and paper game, that will likely be a larger piece fo the pie than DoJ currently gets.

And, with CRYPTIC art behind the project, you can all quit complaining about the 5er layout and lack of good art. Sure, a lot of the old guard will whinge about buying new books, but I think it is awesome news for DoJ and the Hero System in the long haul.

Congrats!

[TygerLily]

Great news! This is a wonderful opportunity, IMHO, for Hero Games.

[Savinien]

Hmm. While having a pre-made universe saves Cryptic a good bit of work, I wonder if the CU will have enough appeal. While many folks here would be interested in playing in that universe, and some MMO gamers will give anything a shot, I think this'll have to be pretty good to really compete with City of Heroes. For most folks the CU properties aren't familiar enough to pull them over like a Marvel/DC license could have.

Kind of bummed that not using the Hero system itself, that was going to be part of the appeal to me. I guess the programmers looked at 5ER and threatened to revolt. The 'unprecedented level of customizability' sounds promising, if done well could help pull people in from other MMOs and also help gateway people to the RPG. "Start with X points, build the character how you want, earn XP you can save/spend as you go along" vs levels and 'all characters at X level are the same' type design. Want to start out with a Power 8 blast and lousy defenses? Go for it. Want to start with high accuracy but weak attacks? Go for it. etc.

Look forward to hearing more, will probably try it out, but have doubts as to how well it will do in the larger market. If it does poorly...well, no real skin off of DOJ's back from the sound of the deal. If it does well, we might look forward to Cryptic licensing out ChampionsClix, other Champions toys, cartoons and movie deals...who knows?

City of Heroes didn't have the known universes of Marvel/DC either and has been pretty successful.

[Supreme Serpent]

City of Heroes didn't have the known universes of Marvel/DC either and has been pretty successful.

Right...but before CoH, there wasn't a CoH. I think most of the folks that were interested in a superhero MMO already play CoH. CO has to convince people that it's better than CoH, whereas CoH just had to convince people that it was better than nothing.

[yamamura]

City of Heroes didn't have the known universes of Marvel/DC either and has been pretty successful.

Totally agree here. Heck, when playing CoH/CoV, there are times I ignore the back story in favor of advancing. In this case, I will actually know some of the back story. Heck if they do a future ala Galactic Champions, my name might even be in an online game. Go Viper!

[Omegaplex]

Sure, a lot of the old guard will whinge about buying new books, but I think it is awesome news for DoJ and the Hero System in the long haul.

Congrats!

If 'whinge' means 'complain,' you're right. I think HERO will see a lot of turnover, but a large increase in new userbase. I suspect I'll be waiting 6th out, though. No need to repurchase a shelf ($1,000) worth of HERO. I'll wait for Horror HERO 6th, or Danger International 6th (ie, something not a re-release), and then we'll talk Might not be until 2012, given all the stuff I'm sure they'll want to re-release, but maybe they'll only focus on the Champions & Dark Champions lines. Then again, with so many new people, I'm sure they'll want to capitolize and re-release Star HERO, Fantasy HERO, Pulp HERO... /sigh.

But just remember... us 'old guard' were playing HERO while these snappy MMO kids were still peeking at the Sears catalog. Don't discard us TOO fast now

[Lord Mhoram]

And, with CRYPTIC art behind the project, you can all quit complaining about the 5er layout and lack of good art. Sure, a lot of the old guard will whinge about buying new books, but I think it is awesome news for DoJ and the Hero System in the long haul.

Congrats!

I agree. I'm likely buying out of the books for 6th (I like 5th fine), but I agree that it will be great for the company, and that is a good thing.

[gregghelmberger]

I think for the most part I'll end up buying the two main rulebooks and then just filling in corners when books come out covering ground that hasn't been covered in 5th Edition -- like the Dr. Destroyer and Mechanon books, which already have me salivating. I certainly won't be ponying up the thousand+ bucks to re-purchase everything.

As far as the big announcement goes, I find myself a little leery that they SOLD the IP instead of licensing it, but hopefully they have the language worked out so that when the MMO goes belly up (either in two years if unsuccessful or in eight if successful) it doesn't drag the Champions paper books into the dumpster with it. MMOs just don't have the legs PnP games do.