Turakian Ages meets Terran Empire

[The Main Man]

For a long time I have owned both the Turakian Age and Terran Empire campaign books, but I could never quite get a campaign off the ground for a variety of reasons. Then I came up with a way to merge them.

I worked out a rough alternate history that takes the world from the Turakian Age to the Terran Empire age.

It begins with one important event NOT happening: Kal Turak never returns as Takofabes. Thus, there is extended prosperity for the world since Takofanes never fights an apocalyptic battle against the world.

Magic never crashes, the continents remain the same. I have some vague idea of a Dark Age brought about by stagnation and chaos.

From there, I have the idea that the Valdorian Age doesn't happen, but barbarism becomes the rule of the day, and magic knowledge is lost in raids, plunder, battle, and other general strife. Magic is taught more exclusively and is used by an elite class who use it to maintain power within feudal establishments.

I think Valdor could still rise to prominence, but more as a hybrid of Alexander the Great and Genghis Khan. He conquers an enormous part of the known world, bringing about cultural syncretism to his newfound allies and subordinate kingdoms and complete annihilation to those that resist or oppose him. I think this could and should have an effect on the races of Ambrethel.

Furthermore, long-hidden magic knowledge is rediscovered as spoils of war, and a sort of "Atlantean Revolution" begins, where magic is, for lack of a better word, "reengineered."

Society slowly shifts from monarchical feudalism to an age of mostly republics. Magic comes in two general varieties: technology and raw power - Incantations, Gestures, and Material components are seen as primitive means of harnessing magic.

Eventually, the world manages to first land on the moon. Soon enough, colonization follows, then terraforming of at least Mars and Venus. Then, first contact happens. I think the Xenovore Wars can still happen, possibly strengthening ties between the worlds' races, propelling them onto the Galactic Stage.

And now it is the "present."

I think it needs work. I still want to figure out the racial situation of Earth up to the present of the campaign add well as how it got there.


The idea is that of a more literal fusion of High Fantasy with Space Opera. Perhaps it could be called "High Science Fantasy."

First, what does anyone think of the idea? Second, while I plan to share some of my ideas regarding the possibilities, I'd like to hear some of my fellow HEROphiles' uninfluenced ideas first. What kinds of possibilities might such a different history hold for Earth and the alien races of the galaxy?

I made this thread in both the Fantasy and Star HERO sections because it spans two genres. I suppose this thread could focus on the more Sci-Fi possibilities.

But first, initial thoughts and suggestions please?

[wrestlinggeek]

Sounds like a campaign I'd love to play in. The one thing I can see is that you need to give a little more information about exactly how magic works at this point. You mentioned magic powering technology, so the first question I'd have is, where does magic end and technology begin in this universe?

[The Main Man]

Sounds like a campaign I'd love to play in. The one thing I can see is that you need to give a little more information about exactly how magic works at this point. You mentioned magic powering technology, so the first question I'd have is, where does magic end and technology begin in this universe?

The million dollar question. ...

Basically, no matter how much I academically understand Clarke's Third Law and variations, I can't seem to figure out how to apply it without the SFX falling too far into one or the other. It's an important obstacle to making the campaign work, among others. Anyone who can demonstrate what they think are sufficient SFX,, step right up. My key goal is to give magic a sufficiently scientific tone and for technology to be the application of such, as real technology is to real science, but it still captures an element of wonder, since it is magic after all.

Now as to where magic comes from, that I think I mostly figured out. I think it should be identified as coming from a fundamental universal element called "the Source." The Source is required for magic and magic-based technology to exist and be tapped into. Some beings, sentient or not, can naturally use it, others must learn how to use it, and technology can be used to harness it.

I have the idea that the Source could come from either the galactic core or else from stars. Not sure though...

Magic can use the typical Skill Roll, Gestures, and Incantations, but due to societal and cultural progress, they are probably seen as inefficient by professionals and experts. Students, hobbyists, and amateurs only. Of course, this could depend on the culture... Different alien races could have their own preferences for magic implementation.

[The Main Man]

My last post has me thinking about another important point: races.

First, what could the racial situation on Earth be in the first place?

I think humans continue to dominate the planet. Furthermore, I think that half-elves and half-orcs could rival their pure counterparts' numbers by now. I think Dwarves could dominate underground and still live in relative peace with Humans. Maybe Halflings, and by extension Gnomes, live between the two in relative peace as well.

Perhaps the Drakine are mere shadows of themselves? What about Elves?

I think it's a no-brainer that Mars and Venus are terraformed and colonized. There's something appealing about Orc-kin (Orcs, Goblins, Trolls) primarily living on Mars. I think two new hybrids could have emerged too: "Hobgoblins" (Orc and Goblin parents) and "Bugbears" (Orc and Troll parents).

Not sure about Venus though. I do like the idea that it is that classic swamp/jungle planet from the days of yore. Maybe the Seshurma dominate that planet. Them or maybe the Elves. Both?

Then there are the Erqigdlit, Pakads, Leomachi and all the Atlantean Age races...

[Lucius]

If we go by what's in Turakian Age, the Drakine are extinct. In fact, they never could have existed. They're a non-starter as a species.

The other "minor races" or less numerous sentient species would probably be lost as well, but remember - with the rise of biothaumaturgy, any or all of them could also be revived Perhaps the Pakusa are forgotten except for a few fossils and artifacts in museums, but as long as there are cats - either housecats or the "big cats" - there will be people who admire them and want to be like them, and some enterprising wizard will find the way to transform someone into a cat person. Such people and their descendents would form their own community....


If one effect of magic is that a given planet hosts, not a single dominant sentient species, but a score of them, often closely related, this should be true of all inhabited worlds and not just Earth. Rather than speaking of a "sentient species" or a planet's "dominant species" terms like "sentient genus" or "dominant genus" might be in use.

And given the amount of hybridization going on, I can't doubt that Humans, Elves, Dwarves, Hobbits, Orcs, Goblins, and Trolls, are all one genus.

I suggest you make a set of "types templates" for various niches that variant species would fill, that could be applied to Humans to get the above creatures and could apply to other species to get their equivalents.

Lucius Alexander

Palindromedary Enterprises

[Lord Liaden]

The million dollar question. ...

Basically, no matter how much I academically understand Clarke's Third Law and variations, I can't seem to figure out how to apply it without the SFX falling too far into one or the other. It's an important obstacle to making the campaign work, among others. Anyone who can demonstrate what they think are sufficient SFX,, step right up. My key goal is to give magic a sufficiently scientific tone and for technology to be the application of such, as real technology is to real science, but it still captures an element of wonder, since it is magic after all.

I ran into a similar problem when I updated the classic Champions villain Professor Muerte to current Champions Universe continuity, in an article in Digital Hero #44. My concept was that (through circumstances I won't waste space on here) Muerte had learned how to combine some of the forces and effects of magic with those of science. I very much wanted to avoid the approach of "with magic you can do anything," while still making it clear that the combination could give wondrous results beyond what science alone could achieve. My solution was to create specific, defined effects, with pseudoscientific names, consistent SFX, and a logical explanation as to how they worked.

Let me give you an example from the article. Prof. Muerte had applied empirical research to understanding what I called "necrobiology," the processes and functions of undead organisms. Muerte used that knowledge to "upgrade" a vampire, named Seraphina, by implanting mutated tissues into her body. These implants were not visible when Seraphina wanted to appear human, but by concentrating she could force additional blood to them, stimulating them to grow new body parts: enlarged fangs, protective scales covering her skin, functional wings with razor-sharp scale "feathers," and a hollow tongue which could extend more than ten meters, and affix to any open wound to rapidly suck blood from it. When Seraphina wished to resume her human appearance, she concentrated on drawing her blood flow away from these body parts, like a tree absorbing chlorophyl from its leaves in autumn, causing them to wither, fall from her body, and crumble to dust.

[The Main Man]

If we go by what's in Turakian Age, the Drakine are extinct. In fact, they never could have existed. They're a non-starter as a species.

The other "minor races" or less numerous sentient species would probably be lost as well, but remember - with the rise of biothaumaturgy, any or all of them could also be revived Perhaps the Pakusa are forgotten except for a few fossils and artifacts in museums, but as long as there are cats - either housecats or the "big cats" - there will be people who admire them and want to be like them, and some enterprising wizard will find the way to transform someone into a cat person. Such people and their descendents would form their own community....


If one effect of magic is that a given planet hosts, not a single dominant sentient species, but a score of them, often closely related, this should be true of all inhabited worlds and not just Earth. Rather than speaking of a "sentient species" or a planet's "dominant species" terms like "sentient genus" or "dominant genus" might be in use.

And given the amount of hybridization going on, I can't doubt that Humans, Elves, Dwarves, Hobbits, Orcs, Goblins, and Trolls, are all one genus.

I suggest you make a set of "types templates" for various niches that variant species would fill, that could be applied to Humans to get the above creatures and could apply to other species to get their equivalents.

Lucius Alexander

Palindromedary Enterprises

I have an idea like that, yeah. First, I had the idea that the so-called gods are actually galaxars, and some of them created races across the galaxy, in some cases several made them on the same planet out of competition.

So if we go by the major races, they might all be variations on a base form. Furthermore, what if, while we humans dominated in the end, it wasn't the case on other worlds? What if Ackalians were the "orcs" of their planet? what if the Varanyi were the "elves" of theirs? And of course the Se'ecra present the possibility that some worlds have unique or radically current demiraces and patron "gods" to go with them, or else the goods work with what is there: humans, elves, dwarves, etc came from apes, but a detent bar creature might be used for other aliens.

[The Main Man]

I ran into a similar problem when I updated the classic Champions villain Professor Muerte to current Champions Universe continuity, in an article in Digital Hero #44. My concept was that (through circumstances I won't waste space on here) Muerte had learned how to combine some of the forces and effects of magic with those of science. I very much wanted to avoid the approach of "with magic you can do anything," while still making it clear that the combination could give wondrous results beyond what science alone could achieve. My solution was to create specific, defined effects, with pseudoscientific names, consistent SFX, and a logical explanation as to how they worked.

Let me give you an example from the article. Prof. Muerte had applied empirical research to understanding what I called "necrobiology," the processes and functions of undead organisms. Muerte used that knowledge to "upgrade" a vampire, named Seraphina, by implanting mutated tissues into her body. These implants were not visible when Seraphina wanted to appear human, but by concentrating she could force additional blood to them, stimulating them to grow new body parts: enlarged fangs, protective scales covering her skin, functional wings with razor-sharp scale "feathers," and a hollow tongue which could extend more than ten meters, and affix to any open wound to rapidly suck blood from it. When Seraphina wished to resume her human appearance, she concentrated on drawing her blood flow away from these body parts, like a tree absorbing chlorophyl from its leaves in autumn, causing them to wither, fall from her body, and crumble to dust.

Hm... I'll have to try that out. Perhaps cross-refer between actual sciences and categories of magic - find the parallels perhaps?

[Lord Liaden]

Hm... I'll have to try that out. Perhapsfiery cross-refer between actual sciences and categories of magic - find the parallels perhaps?

I think that approach has promise. There are a number of obvious parallels: alchemy with various categories of chemistry; fire-magic aiding the use of nuclear fusion; summoned lightning as a source of electrical current; elementals or golems fashioned out of modern materials, such as plastic, smog, or radioactives; and the like.

Imagine the mechanisms that could be built using an alchemical totally-frictionless lubricant, for example.

[Dr Divago]

magic and technology... how did you mix them?
magic is a different word for technology? and rockets are powered by fire elemental engine... tv is a magical clairsentience sphere and Volta discovered how to bring electrical elemental energy into special crystal creating his first "Battery"?
i'd like to play in a "technomantic" world, but i see it's not really easy: you could easily tend to create technology with a different name.

However, one setting i really love (and one of the campaign i miss more) is Star Wars that is technically "High-and-Epic Fantasy Setting in Space with SciFi colour" so i think i'll love this type of campaign

[Lord Liaden]

If you have access to the Fantasy HERO genre book for the Fourth Edition of the game, you might find inspiration from looking at the various "Spell Colleges" it describes. They're much like the "Arcana" depicted in the Fantasy HERO Grimoire for Sixth Edition, but the design philosophy and presentation of the colleges is noticeably different. Each college includes a description of the philosophy behind that style of magic, what it draws on for power and how it functions; distinctive SFX, including apparati and spell-casting styles, reflective of that philosophy, which are common to all spells in the college; and an explanation for each individual spell of how it fits with that philosophy and SFX. IMHO the resulting impression is of rational thought applied to the "science" of magic, moreso than is common to most fantasy games.

[Lucius]

Awareness. Will. Symbolism.

For magic to work, always, there must be a mind. Even primitive organisms that use it instinctively, have some level of consciousness.

That is why every machine must have an Operator. Modern thaumaturgy may use tools far more sophisticated than wands and potions and incantations, but still there must be Intention and Attention, or a device will remain like Schroedinger's Black Box with the possibly dead cat inside, suspended between possibilities and unable to definitely manifest.

From the massive engine of a starcrosser, to a simple household ablutorium or illuminator that any child can Operate, a thaumaturgical artifact can only function when an individual Awareness of some sort is involved.

But not all self-aware intelligences are natural. Even the earliest shamans and witches, who called their conjurations "spirits" or "demons," were able to create AIs - Aware Invocations. Modern AIs have the potential to make life even more convenient and pleasant. But they must be used carefully....

Lucius Alexander

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