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Mental Invisiblity


mattingly

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I want a mentalist to be able to turn off the perceptive centers of the brain, in regards to his own presence, so that even though the target's eyes can see him, the brain does not interpret those signals. But, if the target can beat the mentalist at an EGO Roll, he can perceive the hidden target (I don't want the power to be absolute).

 

Mental Invisibility: Invisibility to Sight, Hearing, and Smell/Taste, Based on ECV (+1); Requires an Opposed Skill Roll (EGO versus EGO, -1/2), Only versus Sentient Minds (-1/4)

 

Does the Invisibility need BOECV, or is that a waste?

 

Does the EGO versus EGO count as a Limitation, or should it be assumed to be the special effect of the Fringe?

 

Should the Sentient Minds be worth a -1/2, since it won't work against robots/cameras/etc.?

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We have a character in our game with a sinilar effect on his invisability, except no ego roll. He didn't take vs ECV. We didn't feel it was nessisary. Requires opposed skill roll imo would only we worth -1/4 since most of the time, this this roll will be lopsided heavily in your favor. I think we gave -1/4 for only vs sentient minds.

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Re: Mental Invisiblity

 

Originally posted by mattingly

Does the Invisibility need BOECV, or is that a waste?

I would not waste points on BoECV. The Invisibility is just normal invisiblility. The fact that someone can see through it with an EGO roll is a limitation, as all other Invisibility types do not have the defect. The fact that it works on the mind is just part of the SFX.

 

Does the EGO versus EGO count as a Limitation, or should it be assumed to be the special effect of the Fringe?

I think this is definately worth a Limitation value. When you consider that Activation 11- is a -1 Limitation, and that an EGO roll is at least an 11-, I would give it a -1 Limitation to be aborted by an EGO roll.

 

Should the Sentient Minds be worth a -1/2, since it won't work against robots/cameras/etc.?

I think it was given to one of the new villains, but I cannot remember which one. I would go with -1/4 for the value, as the character will be encountering far more Sentient Minds than it will be video cameras.

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BOECV is not needed. I wouldn't consider the Ego vs. Ego roll to be the fringe; if you want no fringe for people who fail the roll, buy it (with some of those points saved from BOECV).

 

Question: How often do targets get to make the Ego vs. Ego roll? If they fail it once are they screwed for the rest of the encounter?

 

Only vs Sentient Minds: Does a character watching the scene live through a closed-circuit camera (or television) see the character? What about a battlesuit character on the scene who sees through video cameras (i.e., no actual windows in the battlesuit)?

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Re: Re: Mental Invisiblity

 

Originally posted by Monolith

I would not waste points on BoECV. The Invisibility is just normal invisiblility. The fact that someone can see through it with an EGO roll is a limitation, as all other Invisibility types do not have the defect. The fact that it works on the mind is just part of the SFX.

 

 

I think this is definately worth a Limitation value. When you consider that Activation 11- is a -1 Limitation, and that an EGO roll is at least an 11-, I would give it a -1 Limitation to be aborted by an EGO roll.

 

 

I think it was given to one of the new villains, but I cannot remember which one. I would go with -1/4 for the value, as the character will be encountering far more Sentient Minds than it will be video cameras.

 

I agree with the first two points, although I might make the EGO roll Limitation smaller if the character has a significantly higher Ego than most others in the campaign.

 

The Ultimate Mentalist gave "Only vs. living minds" as a -1/2 Limitation. Even though you're defining it more sharply as "sentient minds", I wouldn't go lower than that in most campaigns. OTOH, if this were for a fantasy game I'd make it -1/4 since electronic surveillance would not exist, while in a sci-fi game I might go as high as -1 depending on the prevalence of robots etc.

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The reason that I was considering BOECV is that even if the target has unusual senses, his brain would not believe them. In that case, I could probably just make it Sight (the only normal Targeting sense), BOECV, to cover all the "brain's senses."

 

But regular Invisiblity to most Groups with the Skill Roll Limitation and Living Minds (I like that better than Sentient, since it should also work versus animals) ought to cover it.

 

The opposed Skill Roll would be lopsided, yes, assuming others had not bought up their EGOs. The mentalist's in question is 14-. Assuming most targets will be an 11- or 12-, they'll be operating at a -2 or -3 most of the time, giving roughtly an 8- to spot him.

 

Good questions, Geoff. I'd rule that the Ego vs. Ego would be rolled each Phase (or maybe once at the beginning, and then again each time that the targets interact).

 

A character watching the scene live through a closed-circuit camera (or television) would see the character, but a battlesuit character on the scene who sees through video cameras would not, because of range. If the target is far away (outside of the AP x 5 inches), he'd be unaffected by it, but a target within the mentalist's range (or maybe line of sight) would still have his brain blocked from seeing.

 

So, it looks like I'll be going with:

Mental Invisibility: Invisibility to Sight, Hearing, Smell/Taste, and Radio; Requires an Opposed Skill Roll (EGO versus EGO, -1/2), Only versus Living Minds within Range (-1/2)

 

The mentalist will have two main defenses; being mentally invisible, or putting up a telekinetic force field, but he can't do both at once, so I don't want to limit the Invisibility too much, since it will be his primary defense. Without the EGO vs EGO Limitation, a fully invisible mentalist could easily get abusive, but I feel like this will balance him out.

 

Any other comments?

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I think I might be more inclined to work that power up using Mental Illusions. It's already based on ECV, and you get some nifty limitations right off the bat - Self Only (-1), and a Set Effect - "You can't see me" (using Mind Control as a guideline - Set Effect, single emotion - I'd give this a -1 also).

 

Of course, this only works on one target at a time...

 

You could, however, give it No Range (-1/2), and then tack on an Area of Effect (Radius) (+1)...

 

I haven't figured out comparative point costs or anything, so I don't know how the two options would stack up against each other THAT way. Still, the MI seems more appropriate to me.

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Originally posted by mattingly

The Real Cost for Mental Illusions would probably work out the same, but the Active Points and END would be a lot higher.

 

I think those active points are worth paying for it.

MI may be the only way to truly take care of ALL senses.

 

Isn't this basically what "The Shadow" has?

 

Interesting question: If someone observes him clairvoryantly from outside the Area Effect, does he see him??

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Originally posted by Osprey

I think those active points are worth paying for it.

MI may be the only way to truly take care of ALL senses.

The problem with Mental Illusion is that it can only affect one person at a time (unless you buy it AE; and then it gets really expensive). With Invisibility the character can affect 10 people in the room, but they each get their own EGO roll to try and "see" the character. That is a big difference.

 

Isn't this basically what "The Shadow" has?

I would consider The Shadow to have the Invisibility power, pretty much like this character's.

 

Interesting question: If someone observes him clairvoryantly from outside the Area Effect, does he see him??

I would rule yes, but I do not completely know all the SFX of the character in question.

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