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Athlete HERO


Ken Solo

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For a long time now i have been wanting to run games using elements of sports. Other than martial arts manuvers, I have never been sure how to pull this off. The ultimate logical extension of what I'd like to do is be able to run a baseball game or football game using HERO rules. I liked the idea of two super-hero teams from different ciites getting together for an annual softball game. (It was even an illo in one of the Champions supliments, Quantum flying up to catch a baseball sent out of the park by Defender....I don't recall which book)

But...

How does one work the mechanics???

Pitching and batting looks like a Skill vs. Skill contest but it also looks kind of like the batter is using a held action to Block a pitch.

Is catching a fly ball a roll to hit a DCV? One usually has to move to where the ball will be, so is this Manuver a Move-Catch?

 

There is a rule in the 5th (I'm not sure about Revised, b/c I have not read it all yet) about catching things (like people falling off buildings) and that should prove helpful in some cases.

Assuming a baseball going toward the outfield is just suffering Knockback, what mechanic determines which direction it goes?

 

 

The Super Power Wrestling League or Ultimate Fighting Champion type things are easy in HERO. Team sports are hard (for me)

Has anyone put thought into this yet?

I plan on working on this in a few weeks when final exams are over.

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Re: Athlete HERO

 

I'll see what I can find there. Then I'll check back here. I know the brilliant minds that haunt these boards will come up with something.

 

My next project after all is Golf HERO.

 

 

Tell me we have all those super doctors out there, and none of them play golf?!? :snicker:

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Re: Athlete HERO

 

I would say hitting a ball is an attack. Ball = DCV 3 + 10 (size). You could use Velocity-Based DCV which would be 7 but I think a 17 DCV is just a bit much. Roll STR damage against DEF 5 BODY 5 to see if you break the bat. If they make the attack roll by more than 1 I would let the attack determine direction, else determine it randomly. I would base distance on throwing a baseball and then add 5-10 points of STR due to the bat being used as a lever.

 

I would do catching as 'Blocking For Someone Else' ignoring the -2 OCV if the ball was thrown directly at you.

 

Running should be fairly straight foward. You would need to hex out a baseball field.

 

Pitching would be a thrown weapon attack at the desired location. I would require PS Baseball or PS Pitcher for putting some kind of spin on the ball. Maybe for every 2 points the roll is made add + 1 DCV to the ball and/or pitcher can alter direction of ball by a certain degree.

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Re: Athlete HERO

 

I would go skill vs skill on the pitcher vs batter, determining distance by how much the batter makes the die roll (probably with some as-yet-undetermined modifier for STR). To catch the ball, the fielder has to make a skill roll modified by how far he has to run to get there (somewhat like Dive for Cover). If he doesn't catch it in the air, he can pick it up just by running to it on the ground. Throwing to another player is handled somewhat like complementary skill rolls. The ball's speed is determined as per any thrown object.

 

I've thought about this sort of thing, too. Just not enough to have sat down, worked it all out, and playtested it. ;)

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Re: Athlete HERO

 

I've thought about it but........it would seem very very complicated especially considering everything that goes into a baseball game. As a former high school pitcher, you might need some kind of PS: For every individual pitch particular pitcher would throw. Every pitcher would have a fastball (different Levels of speed of course). But pitches do different things curves, sliders, Knucklers, screwball, split-finger, change-up. etc. Plus the fact that throwing sidearm or underhand would make the trajectory different. With hitters, some cant it high-and inside, some low-and-away, etc. Fielders would be somewhat easy I think. 2 questions. 1) Can they get to the ball 2) Will they catch it when they get there welll 3 counting the throw.

 

This is just basic But how do you measure different strikeout rates. Rob Deer struck about once every 2.5 times at bat. Joe Sewell struck out only 4 times in an entire season once. Perception would play into batters walks I think. I'm rambling now.

 

One idea is maybe check out how Strat-O-Matic does it and go from there. That is the closest to a true sports rpg I can think of. Its been close to 20 years since I played Strat-O-Matic and then only once, so I dont remember.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Re: Athlete HERO

 

On striking out: Low strikeout rates = levels into OCV (hitting for average). High strikeout rates = levels into damage class (hitting for power).

 

Why a skilled hitter doesn't make contact whenever they want by putting levels into OCV when needed?

 

Style limitations. Use martial arts to model hitter/batter confrontation.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Re: Athlete HERO

 

Let's see... I'll go with football since I know that best.

 

Your average team member would probably have KS: Football, as well as KS: Our specific football offense/defense (depending on which side of the ball he was on). You could have everyone make a KS roll on each play to make sure they performed the correct action (i.e., a wide receiver doesn't run the wrong route, etc). A successful Teamwork roll by the Quarterback (or any other team captain) would add his margin of success to any KS rolls by the team. Actually, you'd probably only have the Center roll for the entire offensive line. He usually gets the rest of the line in place.

 

If each player makes his roll, then he knows what the appropriate action he should take would be. If you, as a GM or Player, doesn't know anything about football offense or defense, this might be kind of tough to simulate. After all, if you're making individual rolls and moving each player according to Champions rules, and you don't know what Cover 2 is, then it doesn't matter if your safety rolls a 3 on his KS roll. Part of making their KS roll would be to remember the appropriate action relative to their opponents' game plan. Thus, if you're going up against an option team, part of the Defensive End's roll would be to remember to "stay home" and not rush the QB. You could also make Perception rolls to tell the difference between certain types of plays (the QB makes a Concealment roll as he fakes a hand-off and goes for the play-action--the DB makes his Per roll and so he doesn't creep up to the line).

 

Tackling is easy. It's called performing a grab. Sure-handed tacklers would have a level or two of OCV with a grab. Some individuals (like Roy Williams of the Dallas Cowboys) may just go ahead and lay somebody out with Knockback off of a Flying Tackle. But most human tacklers won't be able to score enough Body to do real KB. Running backs will make Acrobatics rolls to attempt to spin out of a tackle, or to add on an extra point of DCV or two (football pads in general should be a few points of PD Armor, with a DCV penalty of -2 or so).

 

The QB would make a to-hit roll against the DCV of his receiver's hex. He can then take a further penalty to that OCV roll in order to make the ball hard for any defenders to catch. If he is successful, the receiver can make an OCV roll vs an OCV of 3 (and the defender needs an OCV vs OCV roll, plus any modifiers the QB took). If he fails to hit, the ball scatters. If it scatters by only a hex, the receiver (or defender) can still make an attempt to catch the ball by making an OCV vs OCV roll. If he misses by more, a WR or CB with a held action can dive for cover and attempt to catch the ball (as before, OCV vs OCV). A CB can, of course, at any time, sacrifice a held action to dive for cover into the path of a ball and attempt to intercept (OCV vs OCV). If the roll is successful, the pass is deflected. If the roll succeeds by 2 or more, the pass is intercepted.

 

Blocking is merely players moving themselves into the path of a defender and either making a tackle or making a block roll, and interposing between the defender and the ball carrier.

 

Field goals are an OCV vs the DCV of the hexes between the goalposts, plus range modifiers and any for wind. Kicks are at -2 OCV due to the fact that you're kicking the darn ball, and not throwing it.

 

Football Hero would be a game of held actions. I may have made catching passes too easy (they probably need a penalty based upon the direction of the pass relative to the receiver-- from the front -0, from the side -1, from behind -2). But hey, this is a first draft and I was thinking as I typed. I'm goin' to bed.

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  • 9 years later...

Discussion still alive? I'm blowing the dust and cobwebs off of it.

 

I'm considering a Football sim based around HERO, not unlike the OP "many years ago, far, far away...". With HE6 as a reference.

 

Interesting thoughts re: simplifying the combat resolution during play, I gather, one play being composed of 1+ rounds / phases / segments.

 

Re: characteristics, dropping things like Energy Defense. No need for it in this genre.

 

Re: skills, definitely skill based. Was thinking of things like "Run Route"; sure it seems like basic movement, but the quality of that movement, how "open" a receiver can be considered to his QB, matters. Could be an expensive broad skill, or a more specialized skill set, i.e. "Run Route: Out", "Run Route: Post", "Run Route: Fly", etc.

 

Along similar lines for "Block Defender", so on and so forth.

 

Not sure yet if / what to do about advantages/disadvantages just yet. It's not just about the CP concerns, although it is. That's simple enough to account for I think. It's more about, "okay, so there's and AD or DISAD, 'so what?', how that gets simulated during game / play resolution".

 

Thank you for the thoughts re: player quality; simulating a draft, type thing, that's good to know, some youngbloods could enter the league, maybe seeding fewer higher CP levels, but always having a package in mind for basic positions, type thing. i.e. A 150 vs 250 vs 350 CP QB drafting with QB things, versus WR versus LB versus DL or OL, etc.

 

Additionally, I'm considering, not just players on field, but also helping the "Coach" (Heads and/or Assistants) as well. For instance, could motivate team during a series to want to block better; so blocking would be stronger for a series, turns, etc. Or for a defense to want to create a turn over, so player abilities to intercept or force fumble will be augmented, with corresponding disadvantages, such as weaker coverage, maybe, or missing tackles.

 

That said, reading the disclaimer HE6 V1 p26 for instance, "Heroic Versus Superheroic" duly noted. I'd like to get a little better idea what sort of CP totals to expect and expect to make a realistic go of it. Will work these things out through experimentation as well, but with an educated guess in mind is helpful.

 

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  • 7 months later...

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