My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

[CorPse]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

That came out while I was in grad school ... gawd' date=' I'm old ...[/quote']

 

Hey, no matter how old you feel, you're certainly holding up better than Carl Sagan!

[Dholcrist]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Hey' date=' no matter how old you feel, you're certainly holding up better than Carl Sagan! [/quote']

 

Zing!

[Cancer]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

There's irony there. I was at the UW Astronomy Dept when he came to UW Medical Center for treatment of his final illness. He did stop by the department.

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Martian Volcanos May Not Be Extinct

 

Plans for the moonbase

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

I have considered turning the US Air Force into the US Aerospace Force (while still keeping the USAF acronym). It would be advised by the Navy in the operation of maintaining a fleet-like structure. The current ranks would be unchanged, however. The commanding officer of the spacecraft would refer to himself as "The C. O." rather than "The Captain." Likewise, his second in command would be called the X. O.

 

Thoughts on this one?

[Dholcrist]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

I have considered turning the US Air Force into the US Aerospace Force (while still keeping the USAF acronym). It would be advised by the Navy in the operation of maintaining a fleet-like structure. The current ranks would be unchanged, however. The commanding officer of the spacecraft would refer to himself as "The C. O." rather than "The Captain." Likewise, his second in command would be called the X. O.

 

Thoughts on this one?

 

I've always liked keeping future military structure (especially in regards to the US Military) very recognizable, but different enough so that you know changes have been made. Space: Above and Beyond was a good example of using the US Marine Corps as an interstellar fighting force, that while recognizable, was pretty different from the modern usage.

 

And I just liked their catchphrase: "In space, no one can hear you scream unless it is the battlecry of the United States Marine Corps! Hoorah!

 

To answer your question: looks good to me.

[CorPse]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

I have considered turning the US Air Force into the US Aerospace Force (while still keeping the USAF acronym). It would be advised by the Navy in the operation of maintaining a fleet-like structure. The current ranks would be unchanged, however. The commanding officer of the spacecraft would refer to himself as "The C. O." rather than "The Captain." Likewise, his second in command would be called the X. O.

 

Thoughts on this one?

 

I like it... a touch retro, but it makes good sense. How else could you organize a space fleet?

 

It certainly works on the new iteration of BSG.

[Spence]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

I have considered turning the US Air Force into the US Aerospace Force (while still keeping the USAF acronym). It would be advised by the Navy in the operation of maintaining a fleet-like structure. The current ranks would be unchanged, however. The commanding officer of the spacecraft would refer to himself as "The C. O." rather than "The Captain." Likewise, his second in command would be called the X. O.

 

Thoughts on this one?

 

If this follows reality, the crew will fall into referring to the C.O. as the Skipper or Old Man. Unless it is a really large ship. The larger the crew, the larger the staff and the more formal it is.

 

The XO is pretty much always the XO.

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

I don't know about Skipper, since that more of a Navy term, but I think "Old Man" is common in all the branches. Still, I was thinking about how to designate spacecraft. If the USAF is flying them, I doubt they'd go by the naval ship designations. What should I call them instead?

 

Also, aside from having the highest rank, the CO will also be the chief pilot. The XO will be the co-pilot if he's working alongside the CO or the pilot if he's working in a different shift. I was thinking about using the old five-man air crew: pilot, co-pilot, engineer, navigator, radioman. I'll have to add tactical officer and gunner in military vessels.

 

Thoughts on these?

[Cancer]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Air forces, for all their inferiority complex of being very junior services, tend to have really unimaginative names for their machines, strictly descriptive of function. And you're right about them keeping with CO = guy with hands actually on the wheel, even when that isn't the main function of the aircraft (as in bombing).

 

Navies long ago separated command from helmsman duty, reflecting the greater complexity of water craft, and recognizing that there's a lot more to performing a mission that just steering the boat. Right now, USAF at least has such a cult around the guy with the stick in his hand that I can't see them ever admitting that it could be a non-optimal command arrangement. I think it's also reflective of the longer-term nature of sea travel. Aircraft with endurance much more than a single multi-hour shift are so rare as to be unheard of, while sea voyages routinely take weeks or months. Having one guy do both command and steer will work for a few hours, but beyond that no human can do both effectively. So depending on the mission characteristics of your spacecraft, that might push you either toward the flying-ace command model or toward the captains courageous command model.

[Spence]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Air forces, for all their inferiority complex of being very junior services, tend to have really unimaginative names for their machines, strictly descriptive of function. And you're right about them keeping with CO = guy with hands actually on the wheel, even when that isn't the main function of the aircraft (as in bombing).

 

Navies long ago separated command from helmsman duty, reflecting the greater complexity of water craft, and recognizing that there's a lot more to performing a mission that just steering the boat. Right now, USAF at least has such a cult around the guy with the stick in his hand that I can't see them ever admitting that it could be a non-optimal command arrangement. I think it's also reflective of the longer-term nature of sea travel. Aircraft with endurance much more than a single multi-hour shift are so rare as to be unheard of, while sea voyages routinely take weeks or months. Having one guy do both command and steer will work for a few hours, but beyond that no human can do both effectively. So depending on the mission characteristics of your spacecraft, that might push you either toward the flying-ace command model or toward the captains courageous command model.

 

What he said And much better than I would have I think.

 

 

I would suggets Baldwins Helmsman series. He does a real good job in modifying the "Airforce CO is the pilot" type with the longer duration needs of a ship in a space opera setting. A really good read and some interesting ideas that may help.

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Thanks for the input. Having been an airline brat as a kid, I was familiar with an airline cockpit. But I have no experience with Naval ship layouts. I didn't want to copy the Star Trek bridge, and the shows that have starships don't have practical layouts, since there's no artificial gravity on the ships except when accelerating.

[Spence]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Thanks for the input. Having been an airline brat as a kid' date=' I was familiar with an airline cockpit. But I have no experience with Naval ship layouts. I didn't want to copy the Star Trek bridge, and the shows that have starships don't have practical layouts, since there's no artificial gravity on the ships except when accelerating.[/quote']

 

Let me dig up some web links that give a snapshot on the subject. Also a lot of 50's era scifi have great layouts for ships and the bridge.

[Dholcrist]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Thanks for the input. Having been an airline brat as a kid' date=' I was familiar with an airline cockpit. But I have no experience with Naval ship layouts. I didn't want to copy the Star Trek bridge, and the shows that have starships don't have practical layouts, since there's no artificial gravity on the ships except when accelerating.[/quote']

 

If you decide to go the Naval route, I think the new BSG's layout for a capital ship bridge is pretty practical, but instead of an arena like setup, perhaps spherical? Then again, since they're going to have to deal with a lot of G-Forces, perhaps acceleration couches arranged with your backs to the engines would be best. There was a story posted on here a few months ago that had near future starships that were arranged so forward acceleration created enough G force to simulate gravity, so that decks were arranged to take advantage of that. The only real problem with that would be in combat situations, when you might deal with G's far in excess of 1, and having it so you're being pressed down from your head doesn't sound like the best way of doing that. What do I know though?

[Spence]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

If you decide to go the Naval route' date=' I think the new BSG's layout for a capital ship bridge is pretty practical, but instead of an arena like setup, perhaps spherical? Then again, since they're going to have to deal with a lot of G-Forces, perhaps acceleration couches arranged with your backs to the engines would be best. There was a story posted on here a few months ago that had near future starships that were arranged so forward acceleration created enough G force to simulate gravity, so that decks were arranged to take advantage of that. The only real problem with that would be in combat situations, when you might deal with G's far in excess of 1, and having it so you're being pressed down from your head doesn't sound like the best way of doing that. What do I know though?[/quote']

 

 

Well my 2 devaluated US cents are this.

 

There is a best solution and a practical solution. Many time they are not the same.

 

Since we are talking high G's I would design my stations like a cockpit of a fighter. The crewman would strap in and wear a G suit. If everyone is in a cockpit they can't see each other anyway plus the stations will be high tech and can use multipurpose displays and keypads, like those used in some military applications now. Which ever station you log into configures to your need.

 

If I am a pilot and login the control stick controls attitude and the "throttle" controls power/thrust. If I am a weapon guy the same control stick aims the turrets or maybe act ike a mouse on a gam to select targets and so on.

 

Since keeping the crew coherent and responsive in high G situations is critical in battle, sacrificing volume/space to allow each "cockpit" to swing free on gimbals so that the occupant is always oriented in the best way to withstand the force of "gravity" would be worth it. The gimbals could be powered so they could be locked in position if required.

 

Taking it a little further, each "cockpit" could also have a "canopy" that could seal making it also serve as a "lifepod".

 

If the "cockpits" are spread out throughout the ship there would not only be no need for a "bridge" but a single hit kill the could never kill the entire command crew. And if a someone was killed, anyone in any "cockpit" could simply reconfigure and take over the task.

 

For large battlewagons the entire crew would not be in control capable stations, but they would all be in a version so they could take the G's. I would think that 2 to 3 times the needed command crew would have stations giving a significant number of ready replacements if things get nasty.

 

For a small attack ship the entire crew would be in control capable stations (5-20?).

 

Just an idea...

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

How would you design it for low-G? None of my designs would even come close to 1 G.

[Spence]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

How would you design it for low-G? None of my designs would even come close to 1 G.

 

The same without the gimbals. Just install the station oriented along the primary thrust access. It would make pod ejection easier to design in too.

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Cool. Thanks again.

[Spence]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Cool. Thanks again.

 

Out of curiosity, why a 1G limit?

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

I had decided that microgravity was one of the challenges of extended space travel. I set it up so that the spacecraft's thrust to mass ratio was 0.01 meters per second per second. So the gravity on board would be roughly 0.001 G. That seems reasonable to me, considering that interplanetary travel is still relatively new. Having a higher thrust would increase the gravity, which will take place in the future.

[CorPse]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Good stuff on that last long post, Spence.

 

Sounds like you should be in starship design!

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Here's a rough idea of the economics of the solar system:

 

Earth: imports raw ore and some finished products; exports food, water, metal, wood, plastic

 

Moon: imports metal, plastic and wood; exports helium-3

 

Lagrange Points: import raw materials, export finished products (hardware, spacecraft, etc.)

 

Mercury: imports air, food, water; exports finished products (mostly data from scientific projects)

 

Venus: imports air, food, water; exports finished products (hardware)

 

Mars: imports minerals; exports iron, hardware

 

Asteroids: import air, food, water; export ore and minerals

 

Jupiter's moons: import food, metal, plastic, wood; export water, ice, minerals from Trojans

 

Saturn's moons: import food, metal, water; export minerals, helium-3 mined from Saturn

[CorPse]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Here's a rough idea of the economics of the solar system:

 

Earth: imports raw ore and some finished products; exports food, water, metal, wood, plastic

 

Moon: imports metal, plastic and wood; exports helium-3

 

Lagrange Points: import raw materials, export finished products (hardware, spacecraft, etc.)

 

Mercury: imports air, food, water; exports finished products (mostly data from scientific projects)

 

Venus: imports air, food, water; exports finished products (hardware)

 

Mars: imports minerals; exports iron, hardware

 

Asteroids: import air, food, water; export ore and minerals

 

Jupiter's moons: import food, metal, plastic, wood; export water, ice, minerals from Trojans

 

Saturn's moons: import food, metal, water; export minerals, helium-3 mined from Saturn

 

Starting to remind me of Merchants of Venus. (Sadly, a game I've only watched.)

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Major areas in colonies:

 

Residential area

Commercial area

Power plants

Hydroponic section

Government/administrative area

Public safety (police, fire dept.)

Food production area

Air and water purification systems

Waste management systems

Schools

Medical facility

Recreational areas

Transportation and communication networks

 

Anything else?

[tkdguy]

Re: My mostly hard sci-fi campaign

 

Setbacks in colonization

 

Earth space

* Five people die when their vessel crashes on Clavius crater.

* An engineering disaster while building a military station in L4 kills three people; the work continues nonetheless.

 

Mars

* The first attempt at colonization in Chryse Planitia fails; the colonists return to Earth.

* Two thrillseekers die while attempting to scale Olympus Mons.

 

Asteroids

* One miner dies in Ceres when his space suit ruptures.

* A fully automated mine in Pallas collapses. No humans are around.

 

Jupiter

* A supply ship gets caught in Jupiter's gravity well and crashes into the planet; all hands are lost.

* A three-man sub in Europa's subterranean sea malfunctions; the crew barely escapes.

 

Saturn

* The power generators fail in Titan; the colonists are successfully evacuated.

* A prison riot in Mimas kills seven guards and fifteen prisoners.