Doresh Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 Maybe not the ideal title for a first post, but you gotta start somewhere. Anyhow, I've recently started digging into the fabled Hero System. No problems so far, as I like crunch, and the legends seem to have been a bit exaggerated XD So when I got the 2 core volumes for toolkit and example purposes, I noticed that there's stuff missing in Champions Complete aside from Classes of Mind and Absolute Effect, namely when it comes to STR Min modifications. Champions Complete seems to have removed a lot of them, most prominent being the modifications for using autofire and wielding a 1-1/2- or 2-handed weapon one-handed. So how are you handling things? Going by the older rules, or by the new iteration that essentially removes these modifications? I can certainly see a merit in both. Having autofire less dependend on STR or bracing makes things more action-y, and it seems like the earlier rules made it a bit too easy for fighter-type characters to swing around their greatswords one-handed. (Though the omission does leave little difference between 1 1/2 and 2-handed. I would just go with "1 1/2 handed allows one-handed swings in case you need to hold onto stuff, but shields and a secon weapon are out of the question") Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 Anyhow, I've recently started digging into the fabled Hero System. No problems so far, as I like crunch, and the legends seem to have been a bit exaggerated XD No question there. Hero got a rep as a super complex system with way too much fiddliness and it isn't. But once word gets out there, its hard to fix. So when I got the 2 core volumes for toolkit and example purposes, I noticed that there's stuff missing in Champions Complete aside from Classes of Mind and Absolute Effect, namely when it comes to STR Min modifications. Champions Complete seems to have removed a lot of them, most prominent being the modifications for using autofire and wielding a 1-1/2- or 2-handed weapon one-handed. Champions Complete is a stripped down version, and the classes of mind got pitched as unnecessarily complicated and limiting, as I understand it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L. Marcus Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 And since CC is, well, superheroic, and STR Min and Handedness is more for heroic play, it's no wonder it was left out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 Nothing in Champions Complete is considered to be an official change to anything in the core 6e1 and 6e2 books so they can always be referenced and used if available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbywolfe Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 Nothing in Champions Complete is considered to be an official change to anything in the core 6e1 and 6e2 books so they can always be referenced and used if available.The change dropping Class of Mind IS considered an official change and Jason has confirmed that CC supersedes 6E1-2, though people keep denying it for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doresh Posted January 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 And since CC is, well, superheroic, and STR Min and Handedness is more for heroic play, it's no wonder it was left out. True, but the book still contains the heroic stuff. Still, I don't mind the omissions. Gives real weapons a certain "what you see is what you get" quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 I guess its a matter of perspective. Leaving out something in a set of new rules doesn't mean that the stuff left out is no longer a rule. The class of minds change is, but not detailing how to use strength minima with autofire isn't, for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted January 30, 2015 Report Share Posted January 30, 2015 The change dropping Class of Mind IS considered an official change and Jason has confirmed that CC supersedes 6E1-2, though people keep denying it for some reason. Not denying anything. I didn't say 6e1 and 6e2 are still the Official core rules. But if someone has access to those they can certainly be used in place of the 'official' current rules of Champions Complete without breaking anything. Another way of looking at it would be to consider 6e1 and 6e2 as a sort of APG0 (zero). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbywolfe Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 To answer the OP's question, I think it was either simply an oversight, or considered not worth the space since it is rarely an issue in Superheroic games. How using more or less hands than required affects STR Min is covered in Fantasy Hero Complete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Baker Posted January 31, 2015 Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 Nothing to add except, "Welcome!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doresh Posted January 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2015 Thanks. I hope to be somewhat productive here ! To answer the OP's question, I think it was either simply an oversight, or considered not worth the space since it is rarely an issue in Superheroic games. How using more or less hands than required affects STR Min is covered in Fantasy Hero Complete. Good to know. This rule does make more sense in fantasy games. Though it might be optional, as there don't really seem to be many fantasy RPGs that cover this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.