Best Kind of Invisibility?

[Manic Typist]

A question occurred to me based upon another thread, where the consensus seems to have emerged (correctly) that Change Environment can, potentially, be used to mitigate the efficacy of Invisibility based upon the SFX of CE and Invisibility. A light-bending SFX would be revealed by a bag of flour dispersed into the air- but another "magic" effect that renders everything touched by the character (within reason) Invisible (perhaps after 1 Segment?) would not- but that person's position would be given away by standing knee deep in "muck" (two obvious holes in the much where the legs go)- but in turn that person (might, based on my read) still be invisible if the SFX were a mental command of "do not notice me."

 

That last one intrigues me. Are mental SFX like that the one the "best" in terms of offering the least vulnerability on the fringes? 

 

For that last example, I am inclined as a GM to give opposing rolls to perceivers more or less as you would given normal sense rolls versus "regular" invisibility, with appropriate modifiers as per usual. In this case, it would be for Perception or perhaps Deduction to (like Harry Dresden has done in similar situations) notice "Hey, I can't seem to get my eyes to rest on that corner of the room. I keep looking past a certain space...why can't I look there?" So they cannot perceive the PC but they CAN notice their own behavior has changed- if they make the roll, like someone might hear an Invisible to Sight person walking around.

 

However, would that mean that you could instead build invisibility as a limited form of Mind Control (One command: Do Not Notice Me)? Normally you shouldn't build one Power using another, but is this substantially different enough to warrant the deviation? If you fail to beat the EGO roll then you don't notice that you're not noticing something, etc.

 

Thoughts?

[Grailknight]

An interesting way of doing it. It works well but not as well as Invisibility.

 

Remember, once people do make their EGO rolls they will recall you and everything you did barring an additional +20 effect.

 

People will see you on camera and then not see you when they personally investigate.

 

In a crowd, someone will see you.

 

No special senses are required, but senses will not help until the EGO roll is made. Major plus.

 

Anyone with good range modifiers is a problem because the area cost on this will be prohibitive.

 

Would the power be gone once seen, or would you reapply it after a successful sighting? Would there be modifiers for subsequent attacks?

[bigdamnhero]

I like mental/psionic invisibility, but I've always just built it with Invisibility with Limitations for Does Not Work vs. Cameras, Robots, etc, and so forth. The sfx of spotting the fringe changes to a mental exercise rather than a purely visual one (as in your Dresden example) but since PER is INT-based anyway, that's not a significant mechanical difference.

 

I've also seen it done as Mental Illusions, which I'd say is more appropriate than Mind Control. But remember both MI and MC typically only affect one target at a time, or at most a limited AoE, so sneaking through a crowded room becomes problematic.

[Surrealone]

Normally you shouldn't build one Power using another, but is this substantially different enough to warrant the deviation? If you fail to beat the EGO roll then you don't notice that you're not noticing something, etc.

 

Thoughts?

 

Yes, it's substantially different enough to warrant the deviation -- specifically because it's still just a Mind Control with a limited set of commands (a la "do not notice me").  Grailknight already obviated the chief ways it differs from invisibility (doesn't work on cameras, chances of being noticed in a crowd, the need for AE and its resulting cost, etc.).  And, of course, breakout rolls would really limit the applicability of the command, especially if the intended individual (or group thereof) has a held action (meaning this segment can effectively be his 'next' phase) -- resulting in an immediate breakout roll (as I've seen it handled, anyway).