How to build: Lack of Natural BODY Healing

[Pteryx]

Every character recovers their REC's worth of BODY each month by default, with no intervention necessary to make it happen.  However, for some character types, notably robots, this may not necessarily make sense.  I'm not sure what level of Physical Complication a lack of natural BODY healing should be, though (or, alternately, what level of Limitation on one's REC that would be, if the GM doesn't think it should count towards one's Complication total).  Any suggestions?  -- Pteryx

[Surrealone]

Let's see, REC has the following functions:

• STUN recovery post-seg12
• STUN recovery as a full phase action
• BODY recovery each month (including medical attention that might accelerate the base rate)

So you're suggesting limiting REC such that it loses about 1/3 of its effectiveness (as represented by strikethrough, above).  I'd actually argue it's less than 1/3 of its effectiveness ... because when playing ... who actually relies on natural BODY recovery rate?  Next to no one ... unless the game's point level is VERY low and the game pace is suitably slow.  With that in mind, I'd plant this closer to REC losing about 1/4 of its effectiveness ... resulting in a Limited Power [-1/4].

 

As for the complication, I see a 5pt Physical Complication, at best:

• Affects character infrequently (since folks don't tend to rely on natural healing, anyway) = 5pts
• Barely impairs character's ability to function effectively (rarely has significant impact ... since, again, who waits on natural healing rate for BODY?) = 0pts

Obviously, if people rely on natural (REC-based) healing rates for BODY in your world/game frequently (meaning lots of downtime), then adjust the complication upward accordingly. Also, I'm going to say it anyway even though I think it should go without saying: either take the limitation on REC or take the Complication ... not both, as that would be double-dipping.

​That's my best stab at it and how I'd go about it, myself...

[Greywind]

It is only worth a note on the record sheet and not worth points.

[Surrealone]

It is only worth a note on the record sheet and not worth points.

I don't know that I agree with this.  Consider that if there's no natural rate of BODY recovery, it means medical attention doesn't work.  With no BODY recovery, blood doesn't clot and wounds don't close ... at all.  This implies that hospitalization has no effect and neither does the Paramedic skill's use to stabilize the character.

 

Those sorts of things are worth something.  Not much, but something.  5 pts for the complication or something less on an above average REC ... seems reasonable, since there -is- a legitimate new risk at play.

[薔薇語]

I think Surrealone nailed it. 100% agreed that unless this appears as a truly noticeable defect in the campaign, a five point disad is fine.

 

As to making it a power lim, I think that is a bad idea. I generally think permanent physical limitations on normal functions should be complications.

 

Soar.

[Surrealone]

I, too, think the Complication is probably the better route; it's just cleaner.

[Christopher R Taylor]

I would buy it as a physical complication, but you could put a 1/2 limitation on Recovery too.  Its almost never an issue in a game.

[Surrealone]

I would buy it as a physical complication, but you could put a 1/2 limitation on Recovery too.  Its almost never an issue in a game.

 

Don't you think a 1/2 limitation is generous given that, as you said, it's almost never an issue in game? 

[Hyper-Man]

I think a 5-10 point Complication is about all this would be worth depending on the setting and sfx of course.  If normal first aid healing would not work either it should be worth more.

 

Combined with many of the Automaton abilities It would fit the situation of the younger Elrich brother in the Full Metal Alchemist Anime very well.  To save his younger brother when hiss body was lost in a failed alchemy ritual the older brother bound his soul to an inanimate suit of armor.  It became animated once the procedure was complete.  The armor/body was quite tough but would never 'heal' any real damage on its own.  The brothers could normally repair damage to it quite easily via alchemy.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Don't you think a 1/2 limitation is generous given that, as you said, it's almost never an issue in game? 

 

 

Probably, in a superhero game I'm not sure its even worth a limitation.

[Greywind]

Which was why I said it was only worth a note on the character record and not worth any points.

[Lucius]

It is only worth a note on the record sheet and not worth points.

 

 

I don't know that I agree with this.  Consider that if there's no natural rate of BODY recovery, it means medical attention doesn't work.  With no BODY recovery, blood doesn't clot and wounds don't close ... at all.  This implies that hospitalization has no effect and neither does the Paramedic skill's use to stabilize the character.

 

Those sorts of things are worth something.  Not much, but something.  5 pts for the complication or something less on an above average REC ... seems reasonable, since there -is- a legitimate new risk at play.

 

While I agree with you about disagreeing with Graywind, I don't necessarily agree with all of your reasoning. If there is a Limitation (I'd say -1/4, unless the character has Regeneration) on REC to prevent it from RECovering BODy, then hospitalization won't help but I don't think it follows that Paramedic can't help nor that the character is now effectively dead if below zero BOD (since they will start bleeding and the bleeding can't be stopped.)

 

Now if a different Skill than Paramedics is called for, such as Science: Robotics or Power Skill: Necromancy, that might be just a note on the sheet - or maybe a small Complication.

 

If, once BOD is below zero, the character can't be stabilized short of Healing or Regeneration (and assuming the character doesn't have those Powers) that might be a Limitation on BOD.

 

A lot depends on character and context. If the character has an Automaton Power: Takes No Stun, and all abilities are on END Reserve or Charges so END isn't used, you can just buy REC down to zero (and END too.)

 

Lucius Alexander

 

The palindromedary wants to buy REC with an Advantage to move it up the Time Chart

[Surrealone]

I agree -- context is hyper important.  I also agree that if Takes No Stun and an END Reserve/Charges are in play, 0 REC/END makes sense.  I got the sense that's not the case, though -- hence this topic.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Its worth a small physical complication at least - after all, it is a complication physically that is more of a... disadvantage... than others have.  The severity is decent, but the frequency is going to be almost never unless your campaign is pretty lethal and healing magic/etc is rare.

[Mister E]

 

 

That which is not dead can eternal lie & in strange aeons even death may die.

[Maccabe]

Look up Cellular Smoke Signals, the ultimate disadvantage list.  They rate it as;

Can Only Recover From BODY Damage In A Suitably Equipped Repair Shop
Frequently, Greatly 15pts.

 

http://www.cellularsmoke.net/rpgs/ml_physical.php

[Pteryx]

Is it normal to encounter relentless MySQL errors from that site?  I was hoping to browse it for more ideas, but have been finding it unusable, and it hasn't cleared up in hours.

[薔薇語]

Look up Cellular Smoke Signals, the ultimate disadvantage list. They rate it as;

Can Only Recover From BODY Damage In A Suitably Equipped Repair Shop

Frequently, Greatly 15pts.

 

http://www.cellularsmoke.net/rpgs/ml_physical.php

The problem with that is that the 'greatly' impairing part is way over the top for most games. Normally people have alternate means of gaining back body not constained by their basic healing. The only time this would really become a severe and immediate threat in a Champion's game would be if someone is bleeding out and can not stop that due to this lim. But that tends to be quite rare in my experience.

 

Soar.

[Tasha]

Of course this IS the Hero System board and not the Champions board. I think that the Complication will be different depending on genre. ie In Champions, PCs nearly never take body so the complication isn't worth many points, but in a Swords and Sorcery style Fantasy Hero game, not healing naturally is a huge deal. esp since any magic is rare at best. Same with most Modern era Heroic Level games.

[womble]

The problem with that is that the 'greatly' impairing part is way over the top for most games. Normally people have alternate means of gaining back body not constained by their basic healing. The only time this would really become a severe and immediate threat in a Champion's game would be if someone is bleeding out and can not stop that due to this lim. But that tends to be quite rare in my experience.

 

Soar.

That complication sounds like it's explicitly for automata and other mechanical beings, and it adds rather more than "no Body REC", stipulating the specific requirements for Body to be restored. Magic Body healing won't apply in this case, which makes it worse, in some settings, than a fleshy person's simply not healing their wounds naturally.

[Hugh Neilson]

I think Surrealone nailed it. 100% agreed that unless this appears as a truly noticeable defect in the campaign, a five point disad is fine.

 

As to making it a power lim, I think that is a bad idea. I generally think permanent physical limitations on normal functions should be complications.

On the other hand, if it is a Limitation, it will save more points for someone who invested in a 12 (or 30) REC than it will for someone who just kept the base 4 REC, and would have recovered much more slowly with no limitation. Part of the value of increased REC is natural healing. If that 12 (or 30) REC leaves only 4 REC for natural healing, it has been limited.

 

The frequency of natural healing in the specific game will determine the extent of the value of any such limitation (right down to "no value"), but that is also true of a complication.

[Markdoc]

While I would agree that the value of the complication is going to be campaign dependent (as is any complication), I think some of the responses here underestimate how frequently this could be an issue. It's more than just the risk of bleeding out in combat. In games (even in Champions games) adventures can often involve more than one significant fight and can take place over relatively extended periods of time. In our Champions, games though it was vanishingly rare for characters to take lethal amounts of BOD, PCs (and NPCs) did take BOD from time to time - which means in some cases, the character in question may be forced to play for several sessions with a reduced BOD total.

 

cheers, Mark

[ghost-angel]

Is it normal to encounter relentless MySQL errors from that site?  I was hoping to browse it for more ideas, but have been finding it unusable, and it hasn't cleared up in hours.

 

Yes it is, because the back end toasted itself sometime last year and I haven't ever gotten around to fixing it.

 

This one works, and may have even more on it than my last incarnation held:

http://masterlistsofcomplications.wikia.com/wiki/The_Master_List_of_Complications_Wiki

 

Also, I agree Physical Complication is the way to go, anywhere from 5-15 Points depending on the severity and frequency of the issue in game. Modeled after the automaton one mentioned above in some fashion.

[Scott Baker]

Yes it is, because the back end toasted itself sometime last year and I haven't ever gotten around to fixing it.

 

This one works, and may have even more on it than my last incarnation held:

http://masterlistsofcomplications.wikia.com/wiki/The_Master_List_of_Complications_Wiki

 

Also, I agree Physical Complication is the way to go, anywhere from 5-15 Points depending on the severity and frequency of the issue in game. Modeled after the automaton one mentioned above in some fashion.

Last time I was there it wasn't as complete and wasn't very active. By the total number of entries, it doesn't look like much has changed. But it is still a good resource. 

[ghost-angel]

I had some other links hanging around, I'll find 'em and post 'em, or rebuild my site. Maybe both.