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The Superhero Grimour: Magic In A Superhero Game.


steriaca

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This thread is to talk about different systems of magic in various superhero campaigns.

 

I myself like the classifications of Personal Magic, Universal Magic, and Dimensional Magic (Magic powered by caster's life energies, Magic by exploring loopholes in the laws of the universe, and Magic granted by higher or lower powers.)

 

What systems of magic do you use in your campaign?

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Well, someone cast a clean board spell. Owell, on with the thread.

 

Personal Spells.

Common Limitations: Concentration, Cost Endurance, Cost Endurance To Maintain, Extra Time, Gestures, Inaccurate, Incantations, Increased Endurance Cost, Physical Manifestation, Required A Roll (EGO, or Power: Magic), Restrain able, Side Effects, Stops Working If Knocked Out/Stunned.

Description: The mage uses his willpower and bioforcrs to cast spells. This, Endurance is important, as well as the casters physical and mental status.

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I don't know if particular systems or sources of magic are used by more than one super in most settings.  For instance, Zantana probably uses a far different form of magic than Dr. Fate.  The same goes for The Phantom Stranger, John Constantine and the rest of The Trenchcoat Brigade. They ALL seem to access magic in far different ways.

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Um... Can people post what they used for a magic system in their games please?

 

We don't use any magic system.  We just use the normal Hero rules.  Pay your points, get your powers.  I think "magic systems" are a product of old D&D gaming.  The belief that magic has to be handled differently, rule-wise, from everything else comes from that kind of game.

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It's been a long time since I have played in or run a superhero Hero game, but I have always thought the Variable Power Pool is perfect for magic for the same reasons it's great for gadgeteers.

 

Just as "technology" is not just knowing how to operate some extensive but finite set of given gadgets, "magic" is not just memorizing a list of incantatory spells or possessing a collection of unique and mysteriously powerful artifacts. Both are a set of methods and approaches that incorporate specialized knowledge but are adaptable to whatever situation that needs to be addressed or problem that needs to be solved.

 

In fact, the moment I fell in love with Hero is the moment I saw the Gadget Pool (ancestor to the Variable Power Pool) because I instantly saw it as the perfect way to do magic in a game.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

That was before I had a palindromedary, but I already had the incantation for one.

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"System" is perhaps a to strong word. Basically, like everything else in Hero, it is what the player and game master say it is. What I want is any unusual Magic ideas you used in your characters and world.

 

My take (Personal, Universal, and Dimentinal) originally came from TSR's Marvel Super Hero RPG ( FACERIP ).

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I've only used this in Fantasy not supers games, but because I like the idea of magicians having a "mana pool" or store of power to draw from, and like the idea of linking magic use to a Skill, and don't like the mandatory Active Point Penalties for Requires a Skill Roll....

 

I give the magic user an END Reserve named "Mana" in which the END has a Limitation: Requires a Skill Roll. To cast a spell requires mana which requires a Skill Roll, but the roll is not penalized by the Active Points of the spell - but by the Active Points of the END used, meaning there is a penalty only for spells with an overwhelming END cost.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Power Skill: Palindromedary

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There are three types of Magic characters in my Universe.

 

Some characters have powers that are based on their inherent ability to use magical energy.  This gives them immortality and immunity to disease, and multipower with slots for STR, EB, Mind Control, and always Telepathy.  These characters either have Flight outside the multipower, or Teleport within it.  The only limitations are either Gestures, Incantations, or OIHID for some the the multipower slots and/or flight.  The maximum active points for any power is 60 points.

 

Another type are magic wielders.  They have a mystic device or devices that give them superpowers.  Some have superstrength without the use of their device, or are weapons masters who magic device works like a utility belt.  These heroes have the inherent limitation of not being able to use their powers for personal gain, but can have the Inaccessible option of their Focus.  The maximum active points for any power is 50 points.

 

The Third type is a variant of the above, but the character can use the magic for personal gain.  However they must take the accessible limitation for any focus, but can take up to 60 active points maximum on their powers.

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Well, sure, HERO doesn't need a "magic system" in the sense of a subsidiary ruleset just for magic -- but that isn't the only sense of "magic system," and Steriaca's query pretty clearly involves those other meanings. Even though all Champions characters are built using the same rules, mystical characters can provide a different play experience than a mutant or the last son of a destroyed alien planet. So there's room for at least two kinds of "magic system." The first is the in-universe explanations of what magic is, how it works, and the various styles of magic that characters can use. The second system deals with the Powers, Modifiers, and Complications you use to translate the desired play experience into a character sheet.

 

Here, I'll only discuss the first kind of "system."

 

In Ultimate Mystic I divided magic into three basic types. Most of the magic styles in books, comics, or RL occultism seem to be variations and combinations of these.

 

1) Natural Magic is external to the person who uses it. The magic is already "out there" in the world, ready to be tapped by anyone who knows the procedures. Alchemy is paradigmatic: The magic is in the ingredients, released by applying the proper lab procedures. The "Voodoo Doll" is another example: The magic is in the sympathetic link between the hair, swatch of clothing, or other part of the victim incorporated into the doll, and the person from which they came.

 

2) Ritual Magic places greater emphasis on the special knowledge of the magician, implemented through more or less complex rituals. European grimoire magic is paradigmatic, with its magic circles, words of power, astrological correspondences, consecrated tools, and other paraphernalia. Ritual magic is also often spirit magic -- using the ritual to compel a spirit to do something, or making a spirit give you a magical power you can use later -- but not always.

 

3) High Magic works because it works. This is the magic of the gods and spirits themselves. The Evil Eye is another example. How does the angry or envious glance of a person with the Evil Eye curse its target? It just does. This comes closest to magic as pure super-power.

 

(One African tribe believes that people with the Evil Eye have an extra organ in their body, which gives them the power. Character origin/story hook: Some villainous person tries to locate and transplant this organ -- maybe from several people, making himself the Evil Eye curse-master supreme.)

 

RL magical styles often cross the boundaries. Like, a Hindu sadhu performs austerities and chants mantras hundreds of thousands of times to gain magical powers, which suggests ritual magic. But, the powers themselves have no instrumentality; they work by will alone, making them a kind of high magic.

 

In my campaigns, I and my players created characters who used all three classes of magic, in many different styles.

 

This classification is pretty meta, though. Particular characters didn't think of themselves as high magicians, natural magicians, or ritual magicians. Demonologist thinks of hmself as a Hermetic, Zontar Bok as a thaumaturge, etc.

 

If you create a magic system for a Champions campaign, though, I think the most important part is to keep it loose enough to justify whatever characters people want to play. You should never say, "You can't play that character because it doesn't fit the abstract metaphysical principles I have chosen." The system exists to provide an illusion of logic for a genre in which, actually, anything goes. A system can also give players a more concrete starting point than "Do Anything."

 

For this purpose, Steriaca's division into Personal, Universal, and Dimensional Magic is not half bad. Each class suggests a particular play experience, as well as particular magic styles, theories, and game mechanics, while not ruling anything out.

 

Dean Shomshak

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We don't use any magic system.  We just use the normal Hero rules.  Pay your points, get your powers.  I think "magic systems" are a product of old D&D gaming.  The belief that magic has to be handled differently, rule-wise, from everything else comes from that kind of game.

 

Yeah, for a Supers game I just let the players build their powers the way they want, and they get to declare the special effect.

 

Now for Fantasy Hero, my rule of thumb is "Casters buy a multipower, I approve the slot builds, and you never get to transform it into a VPP."

 

It keeps the casters both powerful and versatile, but not TOO powerful or versatile.  And the points they spend on the multipower & slots works out to about the same that the sword monkeys spend on Combat Luck, Deadly Blow, and CSLs.

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I should finish the descriptions of the other type of magic.

 

Universal.

Suggested Limitations: Can Be Dispelled, Extra Time, Focus, Limited Power (usually Requires Environment Benefitting Power Needed), Lockout, Nonpersistent, Requires A Roll (INT, various Knowledge Skills, Power), Standard Range, Side Effects.

Description: The magician manipulates his environment, using loopholes in the universal laws to power the effects wanted. Unfortunately for the magician, the universe hates to be manipulated, and can punish the magician accordingly.

 

Dimensional.

Suggested Limitations: Limited Power (Will Not Work If Reason For Casting Spell Doesn't Agree With The Entity Granting Power), Requires A Roll (PRE). Also gives an excuse for Complications Hunted (watched variant), and Social Complications.

Description: Magician asks a powerful entity to create the desired effect. Perhaps the most easy spells to cast, but not without its own perils (you don't want to piss off your patrian entity, and when it wants something, you must provide it).

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I should finish the descriptions of the other type of magic.

 

Universal.

Suggested Limitations: Can Be Dispelled, Extra Time, Focus, Limited Power (usually Requires Environment Benefitting Power Needed), Lockout, Nonpersistent, Requires A Roll (INT, various Knowledge Skills, Power), Standard Range, Side Effects.

Description: The magician manipulates his environment, using loopholes in the universal laws to power the effects wanted. Unfortunately for the magician, the universe hates to be manipulated, and can punish the magician accordingly.

 

Dimensional.

Suggested Limitations: Limited Power (Will Not Work If Reason For Casting Spell Doesn't Agree With The Entity Granting Power), Requires A Roll (PRE). Also gives an excuse for Complications Hunted (watched variant), and Social Complications.

Description: Magician asks a powerful entity to create the desired effect. Perhaps the most easy spells to cast, but not without its own perils (you don't want to piss off your patrian entity, and when it wants something, you must provide it).

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Elemental.

Suggested Limitations: Focus, Gestures, Incarnations, Only In Alternative Identity.

Description: The character is linked to one of more elements of magic, much like the stertypical magical girl in anime or manga. To use the magic, they must change into a form able to handle the magic. They also usually need focusing chants, objects, and gestures, at least at the beginning of there magical career.

Note: Element need not be limited to Earth, Air, Fire, Water, Wood, Metal, or Void. Love, Hate, Health, and Sadness are all viable elements.

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Magical Beast.

Common Limitations: None.

Description: The powers are natural to it, mostly because the character is a magical Beast (either one in its natural from, or one walking in an illusion of humanity). Examples include Dragons, Goblins, Tengu, Trent's, Angles, Demons, ect...

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  • 3 months later...

Mechanically, magic in my games are no different than any other source of powers. No "Suggested Limitations" or anything like that. It's more to do with special effect than anything. However Narratively, my setting has different magical dimensions, where the rules of physics work differently, and casting magic essentially involves tapping into those dimensions and making localized rifts where the rules of those dimensions overlap with the "normal" world. Most characters only tap into a single dimension, though Doctor Strange/Doctor Fate types exist who can tap into more or all of them. While no characters in my games have used magic as their power source, a couple NPCs I've made have magical (or magic adjacent) power sources (though they tend to be secondary magic-users, namely, a shadow-magic using Question homage, as well as an archer who uses alchemical arrows as well as a small VPP for alchemy and ritualism powers).

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