Jump to content

Item Creation


starthunder

Recommended Posts

I've searched and I can't find an answer, I apologize if there is one, please point me to it if there is.

 

I have a Shamanistic type hero. The idea is to create various totems to be used up. Making the totems would take an hour, with gestures using both hands and concentration.

 

For instance if I want 2 totems that regenerate someone for an hour, but with extra time, so after an hour you role the dice.

 

     so, in the above example: 2 people are needing to be regenerated, he takes the 2 totems, gives one to each of them, in an hour the regeneration goes off. Or a totem that gives mental defense for an hour.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You could do it as a VPP. 

 

The limitations would be something like 'takes hours to change' (time to make new totems) and maybe 'only change in given circumstances' (I.e. you can't do it while held prisoner and stuff).  

 

Assuming the whole VPP just covers the 'totems' you make, then probably slapping a focus limitation on the whole thing (every power in the VPP has to have the focus limitation, but the VPP itself isn't actually granted by a focus).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't see how Summon can be used for this.

 

 

I can see how Delayed Effect can.

 

Mind Guard Fetish: (Total: 12 Active Cost, 2 Real Cost) +10 Mental Defense (20 points total), Delayed Effect (+1/4) (12 Active Points); Extra Time (1 Hour, Only to Activate, -1 1/2), OAF (-1), Focus, Again (-1), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), 1 Continuing Charge lasting 1 Hour (-1/4) (Real Cost: 2)

 

You use the Gestures, Incantation, Focus (I assume you need supplies to make the item, and that if you're crafting it it's easy to interrupt and take the stuff away) and Extra Time to "start up" the power then use Delayed Effect to "suspend" it until you want it to work. It has one continuing Charge lasting for one hour. The Focus Limitation is taken twice because Limitations on Delayed Effect Powers normally only come in play while "setting it up" but in this case the item continues to exist while waiting to be used and continues to exist while being used and can be grabbed, destroyed, etc. at any point.

 

Note that you can normally only have so many Delayed Effect Powers in play at one time. I think the rules suggest up to your INT/5 but it depends on whoever is running the game.

 

Heal Wounds Fetish: (Total: 10 Active Cost, 3 Real Cost) Regeneration (1 BODY per Hour), Delayed Effect (+1/4) (10 Active Points); OAF (-1), Focus Again (-1), Incantations (-1/4), Gestures (-1/4), 1 Continuing Charge lasting 1 Hour (-1/4) (Real Cost: 3)

 

No Extra Time on this one because Regeneration is normally supposed to take a long time anyway. Otherwise the explanation is pretty similar.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

Palindromedary Totem

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you'd need to add Usable on Other to both of those powers if the shaman is going to pass along the totems to others.

There is no reason to do so. A Universal Focus is usable by whoever has the Focus.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

These powers need Usable on Other like a palindromedary needs another head.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What about using the Limitation, Physical Manifestation, the represent the totems?  If I am understanding you correctly, what you are describing sounds similar to a Shaman in World of Warcraft.  They conjure attackable totems that have various effects (e.g. healing nearby targets).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The idea is to create various totems to be used up. Making the totems would take an hour, with gestures using both hands and concentration.

I would go with Trigger instead of Delayed Effect* to reflect the fact that the Powers take a long time (etc) to prepare but are quick to Activate:

 

The MD one is pretty straightforward:

 

Totem Of Mental Strength:  Mental Defense (10 points total), Trigger (Activating the Trigger requires a Zero Phase Action, Trigger requires a Turn or more to reset; +1/4), Usable By Other (+1/4) (15 Active Points); Extra Time (1 Hour, -3), OAF (-1), Concentration (0 DCV; -1/2), Gestures (Requires both hands; -1/2), 1 Continuing Charge lasting 1 Hour (-1/4) [2 RP]

 

With the Resurrection totem the only catch is you buy Extra Time twice, once to prepare the totem and once for it to take effect after being Triggered. This is a little non-standard, so you'll definitely want to get GM approval first, but it makes sense to me:

 

Totem Of Rebirth:  Healing BODY 3d6, Can Heal Limbs, Resurrection, Trigger (Activating the Trigger requires a Zero Phase Action, Trigger requires a Turn or more to reset; +1/4) (69 Active Points); Extra Time to prepare (1 Hour, -3), Takes Effect 1 Hour After Being Triggered (-3), 1 Charge (-2), OAF (-1), Gestures (Requires both hands; -1/2), Concentration (0 DCV; -1/2) [6 RP]

 

* Edited to add: I typically go with Trigger for item-based powers and Delayed Effect for "I hold the spell ready in my head" -type powers. But that's just me; I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with using Delayed Effect here instead.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As for UOO vs. Universal Focus, 6e1 p380 sez:

 

Focus is not the Usable On Others Advantage; characters shouldn’t be allowed to buy abilities through Universal Foci then routinely loan those Foci to other characters.

I strongly agree with this. Healing is an Adjustment Power that is routinely used on other characters, so I don't think it matters there. But for MD, I would make the character pay for UOO; too much potential for abuse otherwise. YMMV.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think one of the generally accepted methods for item creation such as this is using Summon.

That is a very common assumption based on the name of the power. Summon is for summoning creatures not items. 

"Allows a character to summon a being from another location or plane of existence, or to create certain types of beings or objects. Examples include a sea king summoning fish, a necromancer creating zombies, or a sorcerer conjuring demons." Champions Complete pg87  Objects are defined as Bases or Vehicles.

 

Creating totems in the way that the OP describe it is a VPP similar to a Gadget Pool. (CC pg 123).

 

If you can hand the Totem to anyone and they can activate it and use the abilities that the Totem has, Then the power has usable on Others (CC pg 119)

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you can hand the Totem to anyone and they can activate it and use the abilities that the Totem has, Then the power has usable on Others (CC pg 119)

I agree for the MD totem. But for the Resurrection totem, the impression I got from the OP's description was that the Shaman activates the totem when he hands it to the person in need of resurrecting - who, being dead, can't exactly activate it themselves. So I don't think you would need UOO unless you want the totem recipient to be able to resurrect 3rd parties?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are several ways to build a power that creates an item. However few of them are simple. Item Creation is a severe problem area in the HERO system ruleset; all of the methods presented below can be Dispelled, Drained, or Suppressed with varying levels of effort, assuming the GM knows in advance which method is going to be used and builds the adjustment powers accordingly.

 

The first method I'm going to discuss isn't legal by the rules as written in CC/FHC or HERO system 6th, so have your GM look over your constructs closely and give permission to use them.

Using Summon. Summon is normally only legal for characters, vehicles, bases, and other constructs which receive their own sheet; and the rules for creating items built with power constructs are based upon those for ""creating" inanimate objects defined with CP" (FHC 102)

When using summon to create an item built as a power construct (such as most weapons or suits of armor): First you build the "final product" (the item to be summoned). Then you use that item's Active Points/5 to determine the base active points of the Summon (as if the items APs were it's total value as a character). Such summons must always be Slavishly Devoted (a +1 modifier), in part because no EGO roll is needed to control them. The duration of Summon when used in this way is always 1 Phase per Task you could order a creature to perform if summoned by the same power (which is equal to the summoner's EGO barring additional levels of Amicable).

For example, summoning a 12 gauge shotgun (with 60 APs) is a 12 base active point summon, and will be at least a 24 Active Point summon after mandatory modifiers, but not including Expanded Class, which would be common in these kind of builds. The summoned shotgun will last for 10 phases if you have a 10 EGO, and comes with a full clip of charges (if any), every time it's summoned... Meaning charges generally shouldn't be worth any limitation value as they won't really limit the use of the power unless the Summon power is also highly limited.

This is the kind of item summoning used by the main character in the anime Fate/Stay Night, it is also the closest to the various "Bound" Item spells from the Elder Scrolls line of games.

 

The second method of building a power that creates an item is legal with access to Fantasy HERO, and is discussed on pg 320 of the 6th edition version of that book under "Alternate Enchanted Item Creation Rules".

This version uses the rules for Differing Modifiers as it's basis, It sets the base active point value of the "item creation" power as being equal to the real point cost of the "enchanted item" to be created. The default creation time for these "enchanted items" is equal to 1 day per 10 active points in the creation power, increasing or decreasing this creation time is a -1/2 modifier per step down the time chart, or a +1/4 modifier per step up the time chart. This form of Item Creation costs Long-Term Endurance (at the standard rate) by default, and may be converted to regular END cost as a +1/4 modifier. Modifiers applied to this power affect the Creation Process, not the use of the Item.

You must purchase each item creation power separately as there is no version of Expanded Effect presented for this power. However, the Active and Real cost of these powers is usually very low, so using a VPP is a fairly easy way get around that.

This is the kind of system closest to the Item Creation feats in DnD/Pathfinder. It is highly suitable for heroic campaigns when used use in addition to, or as a replacement for using skill rolls to create items.

 

The third method of building powers which create items is legal in CC/FHC, however it can also result in exceedingly complicated and long-winded power constructs.

First you build the "final product" just like you would for first and second methods... However, then you then apply Delayed Effect and Useable by Others* to the existing construct to define a "creation" stage separate from the item's "activation" stage. Then you apply all of the modifiers apropos to your campaign's Item Creation system as Storing limitations. If you are purchasing lots of these kind of powers in a Framework, you can substitute Delayed Effect and Storing modifiers for modifiers applied to changing the slots of your Framework to represent to act of creating the items. Such powers are usually built using charges, or as Zero END with a Time Limit. 

*Although a universal focus technically lets others use powers linked to it, this is so that the item can be stolen and used against you. If the item in question is Intended to be passed around to people, the rules clearly state that should have to pay for the usable by others modifier; since you should never be allowed to gain an advantage from having placed a negatively valued modifier on a power construct.

This method closest to what the original poster is asking for, and is the one often used in Alchemy and Rune magic style systems. This method is really best suited for powers that have limited durations, and it is not a suitable method for creating permanent items. I personally dislike this method because it bloats the Active Point and Real costs of powers built using it.

 

The final method I will discuss is entirely up to GM fiat:

Use a skill roll, such as Inventor, Weaponsmith, or a Power skill defined by the GM. There are few clearly defined rules for this, but the penalty should likely be at least -1 per 5 real points or -1 per 10 active points in the item to be created, and creation should take between 1 hour and 1 day (or some increment therein for every 5 real points or 10 active points).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Creation and lending of items in Superheroic games is in general hard to balance, and thus not allowed. In heroic games the rules are a bit mor lenient.

The general rule for Superheroic games is: You only get what you pay for. You can ocassionally lend a item, or pick up an enemy weapon. But not regulary.

 

What you want sounds like a regularily used power. Wich implies some use of the Usable on others/by others advantage.

 

I've searched and I can't find an answer, I apologize if there is one, please point me to it if there is.

 

I have a Shamanistic type hero. The idea is to create various totems to be used up. Making the totems would take an hour, with gestures using both hands and concentration.

 

For instance if I want 2 totems that regenerate someone for an hour, but with extra time, so after an hour you role the dice.

 

     so, in the above example: 2 people are needing to be regenerated, he takes the 2 totems, gives one to each of them, in an hour the regeneration goes off. Or a totem that gives mental defense for an hour.

The important part when building powers is this:
What is the intended game effect? What is the intended game use?

 

The intended game effect appears to be a heal, that goes off one hour after being applied.

What is the intended game use? Pre-emptive applying healing to the team?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Unfortunately, your content contains terms that we do not allow. Please edit your content to remove the highlighted words below.
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...