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VVP from 5th to 6th edition (Spiderman)


iena

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Hello everybody,

 

I'm trying to support a member of my game party in building a ~ 520 point Spiderman version.

 

I have found in the web a 5th edition version of the web shooters build as VVP:

111 Webslinging Variable Power Pool, 90 base + 21 control cost, Powers Can Be Changed As A Zero-Phase Action (+1) (180 Active Points); Limited Class Of Powers Available (Webbing; -1), Restrainable (-1/2), Visible (Webbing; -1/4), IIF (Two independently useable web shooters; -1/4), Real Weapon (-1/4); all slots OAF (Web Line; -1)

 

 

1) Webswinging. Swinging 35", x4 Noncombat, Usable As Gliding (Car Surfing, sliding down surfaces or along lines, etc.; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) (60 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1) Real Cost: 30

 

2) Web Line. Stretching 12", Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (90 Active Points); OAF Unbreakable (-1), Always Direct (-1/4), Range Modifier Applies (-1/4), Limited Power (No damage from striking or squeezing; -1/4) Real Cost: 33

 

3) Web Bonds. Entangle 5d6, 5 DEF, Takes No Damage From Attacks Limited Group (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (87 Active Points); Set Effect (Hands Only/Feet Only) (-1), OAF (Web Line; -1), Limited Range (80"; -1/4), Limited Power (Only lasts 1 hour; -1/4) Real Cost: 25

4) Web Snare. Entangle 3d6, 5 DEF, Takes No Damage From Attacks (+1/4), Trigger (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger resets automatically, immediately after it activates, Trigger can expire (it has a time limit), Character does not control activation of personal Trigger; Web entraps any who happen into it unknowingly; +1/2), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (90 Active Points); Does Not Prevent The Use Of Accessible Foci (-1), OAF (Web Line; -1), Limited Range (80"; -1/4), Limited Power (Only lasts 1 hour; -1/4) Real Cost: 26

5) Web Blind Fold. Sight Group Flash 7d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Continuous (+1) (87 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Beam (-1/4), Does Not Work Against Desolidified Characters (-1/4), Limited Power (Only lasts one hour; -1/4), Limited Power (Can be removed from non-stick surface; -1/4) Real Cost: 29

6) Web Parachute. Gliding 12" (12 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Gestures, Requires Gestures throughout (-1/2) Real Cost: 5

7) Add More Webbing. Aid 2 1/2d6, Can Add Maximum Of 45 Points, any Web power one at a time (+1/4), Continuous (+1) (90 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Gestures, Requires Gestures throughout (-1/2), Limited Power (Only Lasts One Hour; -1/4) Real Cost: 33

 

Well, the problem here is that when I try to put this VVP in the Hero Design I can't match completely all the limitations... especially the ones listed for the VVP. How is it possible to have a "double" focus limitation IIF and OAF... ? And again, in the current version of the Hero Design I can't find the limitation "limited class of powers"... and what about the limitation "visible"...

 

Could you suggest the corrections to adapt this VVP for the 6th edition??

 

Thanks in advance.

 

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Well, the problem here is that when I try to put this VVP in the Hero Design I can't match completely all the limitations... especially the ones listed for the VVP.

 

How is it possible to have a "double" focus limitation IIF and OAF... ?

 

And again, in the current version of the Hero Design I can't find the limitation "limited class of powers"

 

... and what about the limitation "visible"...

 

 

People who are better with Hero Designer can correct me if I'm wrong...

 

In Hero Designer, you probably want to add IIF as a VPP Only Modifier, and OAF as a Common Modifier.

 

To do Limited Powers Available, you'd select "Add VPP Only Modifier" and select "Limited Power" from the Limitations list.

 

"Visible" is known as "Perceivable" in 6E.

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Hello everybody,

 

I'm trying to support a member of my game party in building a ~ 520 point Spiderman version.

 

I have found in the web a 5th edition version of the web shooters build as VVP:

111 Webslinging Variable Power Pool, 90 base + 21 control cost, Powers Can Be Changed As A Zero-Phase Action (+1) (180 Active Points); Limited Class Of Powers Available (Webbing; -1), Restrainable (-1/2), Visible (Webbing; -1/4), IIF (Two independently useable web shooters; -1/4), Real Weapon (-1/4); all slots OAF (Web Line; -1)

 

 

1) Webswinging. Swinging 35", x4 Noncombat, Usable As Gliding (Car Surfing, sliding down surfaces or along lines, etc.; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) (60 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1) Real Cost: 30

 

2) Web Line. Stretching 12", Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (90 Active Points); OAF Unbreakable (-1), Always Direct (-1/4), Range Modifier Applies (-1/4), Limited Power (No damage from striking or squeezing; -1/4) Real Cost: 33

 

3) Web Bonds. Entangle 5d6, 5 DEF, Takes No Damage From Attacks Limited Group (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (87 Active Points); Set Effect (Hands Only/Feet Only) (-1), OAF (Web Line; -1), Limited Range (80"; -1/4), Limited Power (Only lasts 1 hour; -1/4) Real Cost: 25

4) Web Snare. Entangle 3d6, 5 DEF, Takes No Damage From Attacks (+1/4), Trigger (Activating the Trigger is an Action that takes no time, Trigger resets automatically, immediately after it activates, Trigger can expire (it has a time limit), Character does not control activation of personal Trigger; Web entraps any who happen into it unknowingly; +1/2), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (90 Active Points); Does Not Prevent The Use Of Accessible Foci (-1), OAF (Web Line; -1), Limited Range (80"; -1/4), Limited Power (Only lasts 1 hour; -1/4) Real Cost: 26

5) Web Blind Fold. Sight Group Flash 7d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2), Continuous (+1) (87 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Beam (-1/4), Does Not Work Against Desolidified Characters (-1/4), Limited Power (Only lasts one hour; -1/4), Limited Power (Can be removed from non-stick surface; -1/4) Real Cost: 29

6) Web Parachute. Gliding 12" (12 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Gestures, Requires Gestures throughout (-1/2) Real Cost: 5

7) Add More Webbing. Aid 2 1/2d6, Can Add Maximum Of 45 Points, any Web power one at a time (+1/4), Continuous (+1) (90 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Gestures, Requires Gestures throughout (-1/2), Limited Power (Only Lasts One Hour; -1/4) Real Cost: 33

 

Well, the problem here is that when I try to put this VVP in the Hero Design I can't match completely all the limitations... especially the ones listed for the VVP. How is it possible to have a "double" focus limitation IIF and OAF... ? And again, in the current version of the Hero Design I can't find the limitation "limited class of powers"... and what about the limitation "visible"...

 

Could you suggest the corrections to adapt this VVP for the 6th edition??

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

This is how I've built Spidey and his amazing Web Shooters for 6e:

 

http://www.herogames.com/forums/files/file/257-peter-parker-6e-400/

http://www.herogames.com/forums/topic/90950-beginning-version-of-spider-man-for-6e-on-400-points/?p=2419664

 

84    Web Shooters (worn on each wrist): Variable Power Pool, 42 base + 60 control cost, No Skill Roll Required (+1), Powers Can Be Changed As A Zero-Phase Action (+1); all slots Persistent (+1/4), Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (154 Active Points); Limited Power Power loses about half of its effectiveness (-1); all slots Unified Power (Web Shooters; -1/4), 2 clips of 1 Continuing Fuel Charge lasting 20 Minutes (Increased Reloading Time: 2 Full Phases; Web Fluid; -1/4), Gestures (Must be able to squeeze palm trigger to use.; -1/4), IIF (2 Webshooters, 1 on each Arm) (Quantity = 2 (from 6e2 page 181) +5 Real points; -1/4)

[Notes: (x2 number of items)

Each VPP (2 Web Shooters are worn using the Equipment Doubling Rules) Slot has some form of the Range Based on Strength modifier.  This means they effectively still cost the wearer END to use though the exact amount is up to the Player and GM to agree on.  The slots only appear to have 105 Active Points due to the application of Reduced End and Persistent (They are all 60 Active Points if removed from the VPP) These VPP Only Modifiers are only being used to allow the application of the Continuous Charge Modifier to represent the limited amount of Web Fluid carried.  I think this is a much easier method to track than traditional Charges or a separate End Reserve.]

0    1) Web Wall: Barrier 8 PD/7 ED, 9 BODY (up to 8m long, 8m tall, and 1/2m thick), Opaque Sight Group (105 Active Points); Cannot Englobe (-1/4), Range Based On Strength (-1/4) Real Cost: 42 - END=0

0    2) Web Cocooning: Entangle 4d6, 6 PD/5 ED (Stops A Given Sense Normal Sight), Entangle And Character Both Take Damage (+1/4) (105 Active Points); Range Based On Strength (-1/4), Can Be Deflected (-1/4) Real Cost: 42 - END=0

0    3) Thrown Web Balls: Blast 8d6, Reduced Negation (1), Autofire (3 shots; +1/4), Constant (+1/2) (105 Active Points); Range Based On Strength (-1/4), Beam (-1/4) Real Cost: 42

[Notes: Constant was only included to meet requirement to fit into the VPP due to using a Continuing Charge instead of traditional Charges or End Reserve to describe the limited amount of Web fluid carried.  I would otherwise treat the Constant Advantage as Penetrating in this case (BODY rolled is the minimum STUN damage).] - END=0

0    4) Web Rope v1: Telekinesis (40 STR) (105 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Affects Whole Object (-1/4), Range Based On Strength (-1/4) Real Cost: 32 - END=0

0    5) Web Rope v2: Stretching 60m (105 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1), Cannot Do Damage (-1/2), Always Direct (-1/4) Real Cost: 30 - END=0

0    6) Web Rope v3: Swinging 60m, Combat Acceleration/Deceleration (+1/4), No Gravity Penalty (+1/2), Noncombat Acceleration/Deceleration (+1) (105 Active Points); OAF (Web Line; -1) Real Cost: 38 - END=0

0    7) Web Rope & Web Ballooning: Flight 30m, Range Based On STR (+1/4), Usable As Attack (+1 1/2), Grantor pays the END whenever the power is used, Grantor controls the power totally (105 Active Points); Limited Power Only for Swinging or Gliding (-1) Real Cost: 35

[Notes: Not only does this slot represent Swinging and Gliding.  It also covers Stretching by way of Usable As Attack. This was the only way Ranged Based on Strength (as an Advantage in this instance) could be applied to this slot.] - END=0

 

:)

HM

 

 

People who are better with Hero Designer can correct me if I'm wrong...

 

In Hero Designer, you probably want to add IIF as a VPP Only Modifier, and OAF as a Common Modifier.

 

To do Limited Powers Available, you'd select "Add VPP Only Modifier" and select "Limited Power" from the Limitations list.

 

"Visible" is known as "Perceivable" in 6E.

 

Here is what my version's VPP looks like within the software itself:

 

post-2288-0-49171900-1476852107.jpg

 

post-2288-0-52037500-1476852129.jpg

 

:)

 

HM

 

post-2288-0-49171900-1476852107_thumb.jpgpost-2288-0-52037500-1476852129_thumb.jpg

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The only difference in the VPP between 5E and 6E I am aware of (and I think I compared the text there way back) is that Control Cost and Reserve (not sure about the terms; Active Point Cap and Real Point Cost Sum for the Powers) no longer have to be the same. The change is so miniscule, you can likely back-port it to 5E without breaking anything.

Everything else was actually in the Powers/Advantages/Limitations themself being changed.

 

Spiderman is one of the odder heroes, as he is like Batman and Ironman what I call an "Adaptor". He adapts his gear to counter certain villains. Similar to Batman, he also is more prone to have Solo-Titles then group titles. As such extracting his "group" part is hard. See this old Thread by me on some pitfalls of translating him to a group-setting (Point 1 and 2 apply):
http://www.herogames.com/forums/topic/87378-translating-characters-from-fiction-and-the-secret-of-having-fun-in-roleplaying/

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Hi guys, as usual thanks everybody for your so complete answers. Now I can understand the difference between the two editions... But let me say that they are not so little... To build the same vvp in the 6th edition implies much more CP or quite weaker powers... My friend won't be really happy...

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Hi guys, as usual thanks everybody for your so complete answers. Now I can understand the difference between the two editions... But let me say that they are not so little... To build the same vvp in the 6th edition implies much more CP or quite weaker powers... My friend won't be really happy...

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I'm not sure that I agree that it needs to be weaker. Please take a closer look at my version. It deals with Endurance costs I don't think yours currently does. And the slots in yours that don't currently exist in mine (ex: Aid) could be added quite easily.

*It's also worth noting that my version is just an update to the example provided in Champions Complete.

:)
HM

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One thing, iena -- I think you have Pool and Control flip-flopped.  You'd need a 90-point Control to cover the Active Points of the slots, and a smaller Pool (say, 45 points -- 21 definitely isn't enough) to cover the Real Points of the slots.  I'd think that would bring your cost down considerably.

 

Correction:  Ah, just realized the 21 points is a 90-point Control after advantages and limitations.

 

Still, you don't need a 90-point Pool.  I'd think 40-50 would be fine, allowing him to have some Swinging plus other stuff at the same time, given the limitations on the slots.

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Build it as two Multipowers and you're probably a lot better off.  Have a basic one with Swinging, Web-Parachute, and any other movement powers.  Then have another with the attack powers.  Rather than messing with zero endurance on everything and then an Aid, give each slot in the second multipower Charges. (not charges on the MP itself, give the slots separate charges).  Make the Charges Boostable, so you can pump more "charges" into an attack.  Put a limitation on the movement MP so that if the attack MP runs out of charges, or if it burns out because of boostable, then the movement MP shuts down as well.

 

Easy, and cheap.

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Still, you don't need a 90-point Pool.  I'd think 40-50 would be fine

Exactly. 6ed VPPs are only more expensive if you try to keep the Pool as large as the Control. The Control cost needs to be as large as the largest Power's AP, but the Pool can be much, much smaller based on the RP of the slots after Limitations. Using the point costs in your original post as examples, the largest slot is 33 RP, so you would only need 33 Pool points to use any one web power at a time. That will bring the cost down significantly.

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BoloOfEarth, massey, bigdamnhero,

 

​Thanks a lot for your suggestions... I will share this with the friend I have to support.... It's funny but, as in my party game I'm the only one speaking a bit of English, I'm considered the expert of the rules... there's nothing farest from the truth... I'll do my best... 
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