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How To Build A SuperSoaker or Paint Ball Gun?


bigdamnhero

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I'm writing an urban fantasy game for a convention. One of the characters is an engineer with a Gadget VPP of various gizmos she's invented to work against different types of creatures. One of the weapons I want her to have is a water pistol filled with holy water for use against against vampires and so forth (ala Lost Boys). Or maybe instead I'll do it with a paint ball gun, with the balls filled with holy water (ala Harry Dresden).

 

Now the fact that it does damage to certain creatures is due to their Susceptibilities. On her end, it's just a plastic gun that squirts water. Or it shoots plastic balls that to most people just sting a little and splatter you with harmless water. Either way, obviously it shouldn't be very expensive. But I don't want to just give it to her for free either, if only because it needs to take up some room in her VPP. (Conceptually, if she carries the holy water gun it's a tradeoff with something else, so mechanically it needs to have some RP value.)

 

So my question is: how do you build & balance something that has no in-game effect most of the time, yet is highly effective against certain creatures? One option would be to build it based on the effect it has against vampires, and then give it a huge ol' Conditional Limitation. That doesn't seem terribly fair to me, tho, since what's causing the damage is the target's Susceptibility, not the attacker's Power. But since it's all in a VPP, the PC isn't actually paying points for the slot anyway, so maybe it's a wash?

 

Either way, it's been a long time since I played paintball or played with a super soaker, so I have no idea regarding range, charges, etc?

 

Thought I'd see what others think. Thanks!

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Yeah the only thing that's really at stake here is the effect, not the delivery system.  Your GM may even let you get away with a change environment since what you're using isn't particularly noteworthy in its self, only in the effect it has on the targets because of their complications.

 

Change Environment (target is wet, -1 Temperature Levelt) Holy Water; OAF delivery system, x charges.  Maybe 1-2 points.  

 

The special effect of the water is what's doing the critters in; their susceptibility to that special effect.  Its just blessed water otherwise.

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Another way to skin a cat

 

1d6 Cosmetic transform (wet with holy water, recovers via drying/befouling the water) OAF(-1), 64 charges (+1/2), partial transform (+1/2). 6 active, 3 real.

This is how I would do it, too -- but I'd also make it a Fragile Focus [-1/4] since it's easily destroyed (and readily replaced at the nearest toy store ... or by keeping a stash of them at home) ... and I'd bring the charge count down to 32 charges [+1/4] in the case of the super soaker ... or 2 clips of 32 charges [+1/4] in the case of the paintball gun.  These changes would drop the real cost to 2 CP.

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IMHO, paintballs only hurt at point blank range ... and only if not wearing the proper protection.  Under such conditions they can leave a welt which then becomes a bruise.  IMHO that translates to ~1 BODY (max) without significant effect ... and maybe 1/2 d6 STUN (tops) ... with a -very- limited range.  A winter coat should mitigate this entirely in non-vital areas, IMHO.

 

An impact to a vital area like male genitalia, an eye, an ear, etc. would of course have more pronounced effects ... appropriate to the region that was hit ... and the range.  i.e. An eye hit at 15 meters would be annoying but not devastating ... whereas at 1 meter that's a very different story.

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Why are you guys all making this hard?

 

Define the damage the holy water does to undead and whatever limits apply to it and then choose a type of focus for that power. The focus could be a water pistol or a crossbow or a shoulder launched missile but its only a SFX.

ie 27 Holy water shooting Paint Ball Gun:  Killing Attack - Ranged 2d6, Autofire (3 shots; +1/4), Does BODY (+1) (82 Active Points); OAF (-1), Attack Versus Alternate Defense (target not Undead or Demonic; -1/2), Beam (-1/4), Limited Range ~100m (-1/4), 64 Charges (+1/2)

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Why are you guys all making this hard?

 

Define the damage the holy water does to undead and whatever limits apply to it and then choose a type of focus for that power. The focus could be a water pistol or a crossbow or a shoulder launched missile but its only a SFX.

 

The damage is defined by the undead as a complication so there is no 'base power'.  What the pistol does is give range to a substance carried by the character that triggers the complication.  So, if you are carrying water and want to project it 50 feet, or 100 feet, what would you use to do that??

That is where some of the complexity comes in...

 

I think.  :-)

 

Doc

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I think it's funny that people keep building attacks based on damaging Powers, when it was pointed out up front that the damage comes from the Complications of the target.

 

What's needed is a Naked Advantage: Ranged, applied to holy water.

 

 

Water Gun:  (Total: 30 Active Cost, 13 Real Cost) Ranged (+1/2) for up to 60 Active Points of Fluids (30 Active Points); OAF Fragile (-1 1/4) (Real Cost: 13)

 

 

With this build, you can also load up to 60 Active points worth of acid or whatever. But "up to" 60 pts includes zero point sanctified water. Or ordinary water if you just want to make someone wet.

 

Lucius Alexander

 

I bless and sanctify this palindromedary

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Lucius,

I like your thinking but I feel it fails to meet these two key requirements from bigdamnhero's original post (red emphasis added by me): 

 

obviously it shouldn't be very expensive. But I don't want to just give it to her for free either, if only because it needs to take up some room in her VPP.

...
how do you build & balance something that has no in-game effect most of the time, yet is highly effective against certain creatures?

 

i.e. The two problems that I see with your proposal are:

  1. 13CP is a LOT of points to pay for something that has no in-game effect most of the time.  For comparative purposes, Oliver Queen's wealth comes into play a lot by permitting him to skip having a day job, buy unusual equipment/armor, fund the creation of all sorts of funky arrows, etc. ... and it costs somewhere between 11-15 CP.  Thus, IMHO something that has no in-game effect most of the time should be significantly cheaper than 11-15 CP.  Your proposed Naked Advantage's cost is high enough that it should come into play A LOT ( especially given the next problem), but we've been told by bigdamnhero that it won't.
  2. RAW precludes a player from putting a Naked Advantage into a VPP (or other framework) because Naked Advantages are considered Special Powers (unless, of course, the GM elects to ignore/override RAW).  Thus, in addition to being WAY overpriced for the value provided (since it'll be doing nothing most of the time), your proposed Naked Power Advantage entails 13 CP sitting directly on the character sheet ... outside of a framework ... when the solutions being sought are for things intended to be placed in a VPP.

 

I think it's funny that people keep building attacks based on damaging Powers, when it was pointed out up front that the damage comes from the Complications of the target.

It is ironic that this quoted text basically mocks people for failing to build around a key requirement (i.e. damage source being from target's complications) ... because in the very same response you proposed a Naked Advantage build that failed to build around not one, but TWO different key requirements (i.e. low cost and power being able to be used in a VPP).

 

Things that make you go, 'hmmmm.'

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something like Tom Cowan's answer:

 

Holy Water Pistol:  Killing Attack - Ranged 2d6 (37 Active Points); Limited Power Power loses almost all of its effectiveness (Works Only On Creatures Susceptible to Holy Water; -2), OAF Fragile (-1 1/4), Limited Range (-1/4), No Knockback (-1/4), 32 Charges (+1/4) Real Cost 8

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This is the same question as "how do I buy kryptonite?"

 

I'd suggest making this a perk. The water gun isn't the gadget. The holy water is what is important. The question you should ask is, how is she getting this much holy water? I'm not catholic, but I don't think they let you just walk in and fill up a super-soaker. If she doesn't want to roleplay going through the process whenever she fills up, then make it a perk.

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OK, while I agree with Massey, I'll do it the hard way for ya.

 

Step 1: Determine the highest damage this Susceptibility will have in the campaign.

 

Step 2: Buy an attack equal to this damage.

 

Step 3: Add the proper Limitations. I'd go with: Xd6 Blast - Limited Power(-2 only vs targets with Susceptibility), Limited Power(-1 may not exceed target's Susceptibility) Reduced by Range,                                                                             OAF and Charges.

 

Step 4: Add SFX fluff.

 

This works for any Susceptibility triggered by touch. Add Area of Effect if triggered by proximity.

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I like all the different ideas - thanks gang!

 

I *am* the GM, so getting GM approval isn't the problem. And this is for a convention game. So while roleplaying convincing a priest to bless another batch of holy water would be funny in an ongoing campaign, it's not going to come up in a one-shot.

 

FWIW: I have been hit with paintballs on the skin. They sting a little, but honestly even 1d6 Normal is pushing it. (Unless they've gotten a lot more powerful since the last time I played.) 

 

Re putting a Naked Advantage in a VPP: fair point, tho I wouldn't have a problem with approving it in this case.

 

Since the item is going in a VPP either way, the question isn't really how much it costs the character, but how much other gear she's not able to carry if she's carrying it. (The VPP can only be swapped out back at base.) All I'm really looking for is to make the player choose "If I take this, then I can't take that." So thematically, it feels like maybe it should take up slightly-less space as a "normal" gun?

 

I think Grailknight's approach is going to work best for this particular game. In an ongoing game, I might feel differently - maybe treat it as a roleplaying point rather than a game element, and let Encumbrance determine how much she can carry? But I think this will work close-enough for a one-off. Thanks again!

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I think the number of charges is low as the average paintball hopper can hold 200 'rounds' of paint.  Autofire is also worth considering since the rate of fire on some PBguns can get as high as 20/sec with none of the recoil issues associated with 'real' firearms.

That matches what I remember from the couple of times I played. But dealing with Autofire and damage from individual balls seems like it might be more trouble than it's worth here, and I would like the character to have at least the possibility of running out of ammo at some point in less than 12 Turns. So I'm thinking I might abstract 1 "Charge" as equal to "1 second of peppering the target with as many balls as you can" rather than 1 Charge = 1 ball. So then the number of Charges is really based on the number of targets they can hose down before running out of ammo. Call it 10-ish balls per "peppering" and that works out to maybe 20 Charges?

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Step 3: Add the proper Limitations. I'd go with: Xd6 Blast - Limited Power(-2 only vs targets with Susceptibility), Limited Power(-1 may not exceed target's Susceptibility) Reduced by Range,                                                                             OAF and Charges.

I think -2 is too low. I would go for -4 or so. The attack is not actually doing damage, so the damage aspect of it is hugely limited...

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In our home game we have a rule we call the Radio Shack exception: if it's something you can buy cheaply & easily at any retail outlet, and it's not a weapon, you don't have to pay points for it. I would probably allow this under that exception, since it doesn't actually inflict damage under normal circumstances.

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Seriously I know this is hero, but everyone is way overthinking this.  Its not a weapon, its just water someone blessed.  It should behave only like water unless its hitting the intended target; that's the opposite of an AVAD that does damage to everyone except a specific exception.

The only reason it does anything different to a target is their susceptibility.  If someone has susceptibility to chocolate, a Hershey's bar isn't a weapon, its just a candy bar.  Until it hits them.

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If someone uses something for a one off attack in champions, ie a Hero picks up a rifle and shoots at someone. That is free. If someone wants a weapon that always does damage no matter how rare, they spend the points for it. Special effect is meaningless for this. It's the same if I had a holy priest that made a spell that damages undead (ie D&D 3.x Turn undead) or If someone wants a weapon that does the same thing. You PAY for your attacks.

BTW the build I put forward also assumes that the Undead have a Vulnerability to Holy attacks.

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