A Better "Stop Dead" Power

[segerge]

A favorite power construct of mine is a variation on the Champions:Powers "Stop Where You Are" power which added a Side Effect of 10d6 damage to the victim recipient, representing the target in effect running into an invisible wall of some sort.  Last night, I finally asked myself the question I should have two years ago concerning the use of Side Effect in this manner: "Would Steve Long allow this?"

 

It took only a moment's worth of introspection before I answered my own question with "Not only no, but hell no!"  So, back to the drawing board...

 

The "Stop Dead" power on the same page of Champions:Powers does exactly what I want, but its recommended usage in gameplay is either very complex or physically unrealistic.  Is there a better way to do this power, then?

 

Going back to the effect, it's basically the equivalent of the target running into an invisible wall.  And when you define it that way, there are much simpler methods to build invisible walls in HERO System:

 

Kinetic Damper:  Barrier 35 PD, 0 BODY (up to 1m long, 1m tall, and 1/2m thick), Non-Anchored, Invisible Power Effects (Inobvious to sight; +1/4) (84 Active Points); Time Limit (Extra Phase; -3), Cannot Englobe (-1/4), Does not work against stationary targets (-1/4)

 

This should be proof against any combination of target STR and velocity up to 35d6 of Move-Through, half of which will be taken by the victim target.  And, it should be a lot simpler to run in combat.

 

Thoughts?

 

[zslane]

In this case, what you are building isn't merely equivalent to the target running into an invisible wall, it is the target running into an invisible wall. If that is what is supposed to be happening, then your solution is the best solution because it discards a pure model-for-effect approach for one that models the phenomenon explicitly.

 

Model-for-effect is what you resort to when modeling explicitly yields a power that is just way too cumbersome or complex. It shouldn't automatically and thoughtlessly be the go-to methodology in every case.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Yeah if the concept is "they crash into a wall" then building a wall for them to crash into is fine.  If the concept is "they stop suddenly as if they hit a wall" maybe dispel running is a better option.  And cheaper.

[zslane]

Dispel on movement is probably not comprehensive enough. Presumably this power would also stop Knockback dead in its tracks as well. Just model what the thing is, rather than trying to individually model all the myriad ways it does what it does.

[bigdamnhero]

I like the idea of just modeling it as a wall to run into. Tho I'm not clear how it would work as an attack: normally I would create the Barrier on my Phase but the target would only take damage if/when they ran into it on their next Phase. And since it's Inobvious rather than Invisible, they have a chance to avoid it. Even if you used it as a held action, I don't normally let characters use held actions to interrupt another character's movement in mid-action. So maybe you need some sort of Trigger?

 

Also, if you're treating it as a Move-Thru, how do you handle Knockback to determine if the target takes full or 1/2 damage?

 

I agree the Stop Dead description is overly fiddly, but a simple Blast, damage limited to target's V/6 seems like it might be simpler to implement.

[Greywind]

20d6 RKA. That should be able to stop most things, dead.

[steriaca]

20d6 RKA. That should be able to stop most things, dead.

Yes...that will defently work. Too well.

[segerge]

I like the idea of just modeling it as a wall to run into. Tho I'm not clear how it would work as an attack: normally I would create the Barrier on my Phase but the target would only take damage if/when they ran into it on their next Phase. And since it's Inobvious rather than Invisible, they have a chance to avoid it. Even if you used it as a held action, I don't normally let characters use held actions to interrupt another character's movement in mid-action. So maybe you need some sort of Trigger?

 

The Kinetic Damper as presented in the original post was a 30-second proof of concept build in Hero Designer, without more thought put into it.  Making it fully invisible with a Trigger that fires when the target moves as you suggest would be changes I would make rebuilding it now.

[Christopher R Taylor]

The problem with the build concept is that its going to cost a gigantic amount of points for not a terrific amount of results.  An entangle would probably work fine (don't even need ED), call it instant so it stops them in their tracks, but doesn't keep them there.

[Hadmar von Wieser]

Yes, an ENTANGLE with limited duration (= instant) is my first choice, too. Works on knockbacked characters, too.

If we just want to STOP people. Hurting them needs another approach, I suppose.