Taking time to charge a Blast

[Steffen]

Hello!

 

One of my players is trying to build a blast power that makes more damage the more time the character spends to power it up while allowing him to interrupt the process and spontaneously release the by then built up energy.

 

Example:

The character activates the power and at the end of the same phase his fists glow with a 3d6 Blast. He continues and on his next phase the Blast does have 6d6. He goes on but an opponent gets too close and before his next regular phase the character decides to attack with the built up 6d6 Blast.

 

The only thing I came up with is a partially limited compound power with increasing Extra Time limitations on additional Blast dice plus some handwaving from my side.

 

Is there a better or correct way to do this?

 

Thanks!

[IndianaJoe3]

That's one way of doing it. You could also represent the, "charging up" with Aid.

[Hyper-Man]

I think the 'Boost' form of Aid is what you are looking for.

 

example:

 

22    Capacitor Blast: Blast 3d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (22 Active Points) - END=0
22    Charge: Boost  Capacitor Blast 5d6 (standard effect: 15 points), Constant (+1/2), Uncontrolled (+1/2) (60 Active Points); Only to Aid Self (-1), Costs Endurance (to maintain Boost) (-1/2), Extra Time (Delayed Phase, -1/4) - END=6

 

The drawback to this method is that the character has to pay the escalating END cost of the Boost each Phase (6, 12, 18, etc..).

 

Hero Designer does not allow Reduced END to be applied to a Power that already has Costs End to Maintain (what turns Aid into Boost).  With GM permission you could apply a Naked Advantage.  Regular Reduced END would only lower the escalation cost (3, 6, 9 etc..).  Costs END Only To Activate would mean each Phase's additional Boost would only be 6 END (actually 7 including the cost of the Naked Advantage).

 

15    Efficient Capacitor: Costs Endurance Only To Activate (+1/4) for up to 60 Active Points of Charge (15 Active Points) - END=1

 

The only thing else to consider is a custom Limitation on Charge to force a 'reset' of the Boost cycle whenever the Capacitor Blast is actually used. 

 

Edit - I think the Lockout Limitation (-1/2) applied to the Blast and Boost would work and eliminate the need for Extra Time.

 

HM

[Hyper-Man]

Here it is using Lockout instead of Extra Time:

 

15    Capacitor Blast: Blast 3d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (22 Active Points); Lockout (-1/2) - END=0
20    Charge: Boost  Capacitor Blast 5d6 (standard effect: 15 points), Constant (+1/2), Uncontrolled (+1/2) (60 Active Points); Only to Aid Self (-1), Costs Endurance (to maintain Boost) (-1/2), Lockout (-1/2) - END=6

 

And the two ways of reducing the END cost.
15    Efficient Capacitor: Costs Endurance Only To Activate (+1/4) for up to 60 Active Points of Charge (15 Active Points) - END=1
15    Efficient Capacitor (alternate): Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4) for up to 60 Active Points of Charge (15 Active Points) - END=0

 

Technically the first Reduced END option has no limit - as long as the character pays the 6+1 END cost each Phase the Blast gets another +3d6 until it is actually used. 

 

HM
 

[Cantriped]

The traditional way of accomplishing this result, and the one suggested by the source book IIRC, is the one suggested by the OP.

You purchase the ability as a Compound Power, with each step requiring more Extra Time than the last. For example:

 

Kamehameha!

​Blast 3d6 (Energy) (15 APs) plus​ Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (Full Phase; -1/2) plus Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (Extra Phase; -3/4) plus Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (1 Turn; -1 1/4). Total Cost:  40 points (15+​10+8+7).

 

Normally you have to decide on the level of the Blast you're attempting when you begin activating the power; since you would technically be activating each level simultaneously and then waiting for the slowest component to finish charging. Thereafter you would be locked into the amount of Extra Time that level of Blast takes to fire, be unable to fire off any other attacks (including sub levels of the power which have already finished charging), and if you take BODY or STUN while activating the power, the entire would be interrupted. However, as the GM you are within your rights (per the Core Concept of "You Can Change Anything) to make an exception to the rule and allow them to fire their partially charged blast (dealing the amount of damage appropriate to the amount of time they spent charging.

 

Hyper-Man's Blast + Boost combo also works, however it is worth noting that a 5d6 Boost has a Maximum Effect of 30 APs, which is only enough to add +6d6 Blast (or +4d6 Zero END Blast)* to the power, regardless of how long you spend charging it. However the advantage of this construct  is that once you've charged up the Blast, you can continue to fire off full-power blasts every phase until you stop maintaining the Boost.

*Unlike Added DCs from CSLs and Martial Arts, the effects of Adjustment Powers are prorated against all modifiers (including Reduced Endurance), instead of just a limited list of modifiers.

A minor correction though; Boost is already Constant (as a result of taking Costs END To Maintain), so it doesn't qualify to take Constant again, nor does it normally build up to its maximum effect over time like a Constant Aid would. So Hyper-Man's construct should be taking Cumulative instead; which luckily has the same value and can be combined with Increased Maximum Effect to achieve more APs the longer it is charged.

[Christopher R Taylor]

I think maybe a creative, alternate use of the "Cumulative" power might apply here.

 

As in: if cumulative is applied to an instant power, it can be defined to instead gain power every phase it is held back and not used, up to the maximum effect.  That would let you sit back and charge up 4 phases for 4 extra iterations of the power, and let loose at the end.  I'd suggest this takes the character's attack action that phase, as cumulative normally would.

[Hyper-Man]

The traditional way of accomplishing this result, and the one suggested by the source book IIRC, is the one suggested by the OP.

You purchase the ability as a Compound Power, with each step requiring more Extra Time than the last. For example:

 

Kamehameha!

​Blast 3d6 (Energy) (15 APs) plus​ Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (Full Phase; -1/2) plus Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (Extra Phase; -3/4) plus Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (1 Turn; -1 1/4). Total Cost:  40 points (15+​10+8+7).

 

Normally you have to decide on the level of the Blast you're attempting when you begin activating the power; since you would technically be activating each level simultaneously and then waiting for the slowest component to finish charging. Thereafter you would be locked into the amount of Extra Time that level of Blast takes to fire, be unable to fire off any other attacks (including sub levels of the power which have already finished charging), and if you take BODY or STUN while activating the power, the entire would be interrupted. However, as the GM you are within your rights (per the Core Concept of "You Can Change Anything) to make an exception to the rule and allow them to fire their partially charged blast (dealing the amount of damage appropriate to the amount of time they spent charging.

 

Hyper-Man's Blast + Boost combo also works, however it is worth noting that a 5d6 Boost has a Maximum Effect of 30 APs, which is only enough to add +6d6 Blast (or +4d6 Zero END Blast)* to the power, regardless of how long you spend charging it. However the advantage of this construct  is that once you've charged up the Blast, you can continue to fire off full-power blasts every phase until you stop maintaining the Boost.

*Unlike Added DCs from CSLs and Martial Arts, the effects of Adjustment Powers are prorated against all modifiers (including Reduced Endurance), instead of just a limited list of modifiers.

A minor correction though; Boost is already Constant (as a result of taking Costs END To Maintain), so it doesn't qualify to take Constant again, nor does it normally build up to its maximum effect over time like a Constant Aid would. So Hyper-Man's construct should be taking Cumulative instead; which luckily has the same value and can be combined with Increased Maximum Effect to achieve more APs the longer it is charged.

 

I incorrectly assumed that since Increased Maximum Effect was no longer an advantage that Boost had no limit. Cumulative is not legal for Aid/Boost either. 

 

Thinking about it some more I think Christopher's idea for a custom cumulative/delayed effect directly applied to the Blast might be the easiest approach.

 

HM

[Cantriped]

That may be in 6th Edition (I haven't checked), but in Champions Complete​; Cumulative applies to "Any Power that applies an Effect Roll against a defense to determine a non-damage effect (usually Continuing-effect Mental Powers and Adjustment Powers)" and Increased Maximum Effect applies to "Positive Adjustment Powers and Cumulative ​Powers". Furthermore, none of the relevant rules in CC explicitly prohibit this combination of Game Elements (See CC 45, 51, 102, and 107). So I would allow it in one of my campaigns.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Perhaps that's the way to rule it then: say "cumulative" applied to damage effects like blast is a build-up effect rather than continuous adding effect.

[Cantriped]

I think if you are going that route you might as well just write an entirely new Modifier. The modifier you are suggesting and Cumulative are fundamentally different mechanically speaking. Cumulative allows you to add multiple effect rolls (after applying defenses) to achieve a threshold of effect (such as for Mind Control), or achieve the power's maximum effect (such as for Aid). The modifier you are suggesting allows you to multiply the DCs of a power by the number of phases you spend charging the power, up to an arbitrary maximum based on the value of the Advantage I presume. For example:

Accumulates (x2 base DCs after 2 Phases; +3/4s), (x3 base DCs after 3 Phases; +1 1/2), (x4 base DCs after 4 Phases; +2 1/4).

[Hyper-Man]

 

I incorrectly assumed that since Increased Maximum Effect was no longer an advantage that Boost had no limit. Cumulative is not legal for Aid/Boost either. 

 

Thinking about it some more I think Christopher's idea for a custom cumulative/delayed effect directly applied to the Blast might be the easiest approach.

 

HM

 

Ok, it looks like Increased Maximum Effect is only mentioned once in 6e and the cost is never referenced. This is likely the reason it was never included in Hero Designer for 6th edition characters, I added it using the Custom Advantage option.  I added Constant as a separate Advantage to eliminate the need for separate Attack Actions after the Boost is first Activated.  I thought Uncontrolled was needed as well but apparently not.  I applied the Lockout Limitation as a way of forcing a 'reset' of the Boost each time the Blast is used.

 

From 6e1 page 168:

Boost does not keep adding and adding more Character Points every Phase automatically. The END the character pays simply maintains the points added by the first roll. To add more points, the character has to use an Attack Action, roll the dice again, and pay more END. The maximum effect for the Aid still applies.

 

Here is the updated RAW build:

 

15    Capacitor Blast: Blast 3d6, Reduced Endurance (0 END; +1/2) (22 Active Points); Lockout (-1/2) - END=0

20    Charge: Boost  Capacitor Blast 5d6 (standard effect: 15 points), Increased Maximum Effect (custom) (x2 [60 Total]; +1/4), Reduced Endurance (1/2 END; +1/4*), Constant (+1/2) (60 Active Points); Only to Aid Self (-1), Lockout (-1/2), Costs Endurance (to maintain; -1/2) - END=2

 

Charge costs 2 END the first Phase, 4 the second, 6 the third and 8 END on the fourth once the maximum +60 effect has been reached.  Whenever the Blast is actually fired the Boost cycle ends due to the Lockout.

 

HM

[Christopher R Taylor]

Mechanically it could behave the same, you can keep adding effect up to double your base dice, each phase of "accumulating" and up the effect by double for each advantage.  Spending a phase not doing anything to do more damage is a pretty big sacrifice, even for double damage.

Sure, it would let you do a 16d6 attack for 60 active points as built, so you'd probably want to increase the advantage cost.  Your +¾ is probably a reasonable advantage.  That would dial a 60 active point power down to 6½d6 (13d6 total).  A 60 active point power at a +½ advantage to increase, that gives you 15d6 for +1¼ advantage but it starts going pearshaped after that: 16d6 for +1¾ because the base dice reduces to 4d6.

 

But doubling would get really ugly fast, no matter what advantage you used.  6d6, 12d6 24d6.,,,

[Cantriped]

I based the +3/4 per Phase/Multiplier Point on the idea that it was functionally similar, but somewhat better than my Kamehameha! ​build in that you can fire it off partially charged, and also that having a higher Speed lets you charge high multipliers faster than using steps on the Time Chart would. If it were written out, I would suggest giving Accumulates an interruption clause similar to that of Extra Time for the sake of maintaining the Risk to Reward parity of the tactic.

[PhilFleischmann]

The traditional way of accomplishing this result, and the one suggested by the source book IIRC, is the one suggested by the OP.

You purchase the ability as a Compound Power, with each step requiring more Extra Time than the last. For example:

 

Kamehameha!

​Blast 3d6 (Energy) (15 APs) plus​ Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (Full Phase; -1/2) plus Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (Extra Phase; -3/4) plus Blast +3d6 (Energy) (15 APs); Extra Time (1 Turn; -1 1/4). Total Cost:  40 points (15+​10+8+7).

This is the way I would do it.  And I would probably allow for another +3d6 with Extra Time (2 Extra Phases; -1) since there's no -1 level.

[Doc Democracy]

Hmm. My way round this might simply to buy an END reserve. The maximum END in the battery should be the END cost of the full blast, you then need to buy the REC to reflect how quickly you want the battery to charge. The more END in the battery, the more of the Blast you can use.

 

You would need to define under what circumstances the battery recovers. I would also limit the battery such that it decays when not in use, so when not actively recovering it loses END, meaning that it mostly begins at zero END. My first inclination is that the REC of the END Battery costs END and requires a half phase to recover.

 

I will go to my books and see what that might cost...

[Doc Democracy]

I am presuming SPD6 and a 12D6 blast.

 

3D6 Blast, 0 END; +9D6 Blast.

 

I am going to say the 9D6 costs 6END (no limitation value as I don't think it really limits the use of the power) and can only be added in 3 3D6 chunks at 2END pEr chunk.

 

A 6END, 12REC endurance reserve would cost 10 points. I rate the reserve decay and the REC costing END as +1/2 limitation. So, all-in-all, 7 points for the END reserve. It requires the GM to be willing to prorate the recovery (12 REC for a SPD 6 character comes to 2END per phase that the character pays END).

 

My only issue with this (I think it matches the desired mechanic) is that the character is paying 7 points to have an energy blast that costs action time and a very similar amount of END than if he had bought it straight. I would be inclined to charge 0 points for the END reserve and give the 9D6 a +1/2 limitation "takes time to charge", which makes things look more fairly costed...

 

Doc

[Steffen]

That's a lot to check and consider. Thank you all for your help!