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How much TK/STR does it take...


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#41 Christopher R Taylor

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Posted 14 August 2017 - 09:22 AM

In comic books, physics tends to take a break.  Catching someone who is falling doesn't save them any more than them hitting the ground, but Superman can do it.  Sure, there's no way Superman can have leverage to do some of the stuff he does, but he's got super strength so it works.  You just don't sweat that kind of stuff.  I mean, you're willing to accept that a man can lift an ocean trawler and fly around with it, but not accept that he can stop a plane?


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#42 dsatow

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Posted 14 August 2017 - 04:04 PM

Just one more simple note.  Under RaW, (I would rule otherwise and allow the vehicle to break free given a sufficient roll) I believe an entangle will stop the vehicle cold, regardless of movement velocity.



#43 mrinku

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Posted 14 August 2017 - 06:20 PM

...unless special effects or modifiers still allow the target to keep moving. And entangling a target won't stop it falling - in fact it can often start it falling if it shuts down Flight :)  But yeah, in some cases that effect needs extra attention.

 

If the entangle definitely does affect the movement it's largely a judgement call. At normal combat speeds it's probably simplest to run RAW. For fliers who have definitely retained their movement velocity, you should probably give them a compulsory deceleration at some appropriate rate (NOT 5m per metre - that's meant to be full reverse thust) - maybe 1m per metre?

 

For ground hugging targets, friction is going to slow them down a lot faster, and depending on the Entangle maybe even faster than if the foot was simply taken off the accelerator. However, I'd usually allow noncombat speed targets to get some kind of breakout roll. Maybe use the Strength and Movement rules, letting the residual movement add to STR at some rate.

 

On the other hand, it could be potentially handled just by the roll to escape the Entangle on the ground vehicle's next movement phase. If they manage double remaining BODY and get a full move you might allow them to retain some of the residual (especially if they exceed the BODY by a lot).



#44 dsatow

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 01:23 AM

It really depends on the special effect, but RaW basically says

Typically an Entangle completely immobilizes a

character, making it impossible for him to move
or use any Movement Powers except Teleportation,
but the exact effects depend on the special
effects of the Entangle and Movement Power.
So a entangle defined as a telekinetic hold could be used.  For most ground vehicles, an 11Def 1 Body entangle should hold the vehicle in place(most normal vehicles are about 25-45 STR).  RaW could declare the wheels being frozen in place as limbs to only allowing the STR of the vehicle for movement.  


#45 mrinku

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 03:57 AM

11 DEF is some pretty serious Entangle active points, though. Extra PD or ED can't exceed twice the base dice, so the minimum there is a 6d6 entangle (60pts), and +5 PD (12pts). Even if you make it 1 BODY, that's just a Limitation and you may have troubles getting a 72 active point power approved. ;)



#46 DasBroot

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 10:33 AM

At the same time to cold stop a vehicle travelling 24 m by the rules you'd have to have 24m/2 * 5 str per 2 meters = 60 str.

 

That's not 72 but it's the same as the base entangle ... and the entangle is ranged and doesn't care if the target is going 24, 30, 50, or 1000 unlike str (which is good for something going up to 28 m/phase at 72 points) so should cost more.


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#47 dsatow

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:36 PM

11 DEF is some pretty serious Entangle active points, though. Extra PD or ED can't exceed twice the base dice, so the minimum there is a 6d6 entangle (60pts), and +5 PD (12pts). Even if you make it 1 BODY, that's just a Limitation and you may have troubles getting a 72 active point power approved. ;)

If allowed by GM approval per the rules, but a 6def 6 Body entangle is just as good.  Its just the single body allows the sudden snap and burst of acceleration while having a greater amount of body means that the vehicle would loose half a phase (and those have a slower start).