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Building real ranged weapon


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#21 dsatow

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 11:50 AM

Regular wings used to be done as OAF back in the day, even non-detachable ones.

 

Restrainable (-½) plus Only in Alternate ID (-¼) would do for their harness version without needing to involve Focus. You end up with -¾ worth of limitations, which nicely straddles the cost between OIF and OAF.

 

Yeah I thought of that, but in several stories where the JLA/JSA were captured, Hawkman would lose his wings but not his mask.  So the villains knew it was a focus.  Even with this reasoning, OAF and OiHID are both valid builds and I have no problem with them.  

 

The only problem with OAF is that it can be taken away with a successful grab and disarm.  Kind of like gas masks you see in movies and comics where the villain comes up and pulls them off the agents. 



#22 mrinku

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 02:16 PM

Focus has specific effects but is not the only way to model objects. Most Restrainable powers would be considered obvious (certainly huge freaking natural wings that let you fly would be).

 

Edit:

 

I reckon there's a strong case to roll Restrainable and Focus together. It feels correct that there should be a -¾ Focus option midway between OIF and OAF, for a focus that can be restrained but not removed outside of combat. You CAN build one by applying a -¼ custom limit to OIF or Restrainable (or use Only in Alternate ID, as I did above), but it'd be more streamlined to merge the two closely related mutally exclusive limitations together.

 

One problem with allowing Focus plus Restrainable is that OIF plus the grabbable level of Restrainable is a net -1 limitation, same as OAF, but without all the limitations of OAF (no disarm or direct targeting to damage).



#23 dsatow

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 05:03 PM

Yeah, but on the other hand you can hand it off easily either.

 

magical wing harness might not be taken away from you in combat but it can't be given to someone else in the middle of combat like a magical broom can.



#24 Christopher R Taylor

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 05:06 PM

I think the minimum active cost of a CSL with limitations is 5 points.
 
In 6th you can put limitations on any but 2 pointer specialized levels, I'm pretty sure.  I'd say it definitely but sometimes my memory does not serve me well any more.

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#25 mrinku

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 09:22 PM

 

 
 
In 6th you can put limitations on any but 2 pointer specialized levels, I'm pretty sure.  I'd say it definitely but sometimes my memory does not serve me well any more.

 

 

Champions Complete doesn't seem to limit that at all (i.e. it's definitely fine to have even a 2 pt CSL for +1 OCV on a single weapon - that's how all the weapons are built). There is a rule that CSLs with limitations ONLY apply to OCV, though. CSL (DCV only) doesn't really exist in 6e... you're expected to buy DCV directly for that. In effect, the 5 point minimum rule is preserved for DCV providing gear, since that's the cost of +1 DCV.



#26 Ninja-Bear

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Posted 15 October 2017 - 12:23 AM

Mrinku CC explicitly states that you can’t put limations on 2 pt CSL. I’ll post page number later but it’s the last line under 2pt csl description.
The main object of the game is for the players and the GM to have fun. Champions 3rd ed. Pg 130

#27 Christopher R Taylor

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Posted 15 October 2017 - 09:16 AM

Its kind of pointless anyway, given how cheap they are.


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Elenthar's Tower

 

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#28 mrinku

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Posted 15 October 2017 - 10:34 PM

Yeah, there it is. Sorry for missing that! 3pt ones appear to be okay, though.



#29 Ninja-Bear

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Posted 16 October 2017 - 03:28 AM

Yeah, there it is. Sorry for missing that! 3pt ones appear to be okay, though.


I is very easy to miss! NP. Though I thought in some older editions, they bought levels at 2pt but just didn’t put any limits on it. Could be wrong.
The main object of the game is for the players and the GM to have fun. Champions 3rd ed. Pg 130