Knightgoblin Posted November 22, 2017 Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 I’m sure this has been discussed several times before. But I couldn’t find the info and I’ve been wondering. How through the games rules (6e preferably) could someone teleport a power armor guy out of his armor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christougher Posted November 22, 2017 Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 At the basic level, you don't. You could buy a Dispel vs Armor, with that as the Special Effect, though. Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted November 22, 2017 Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 In your example teleportation is the special effect but probably not the best mechanic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassandra Posted November 22, 2017 Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 Mind Control Set Effect Remove Armor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted November 22, 2017 Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 Transform armored target to unarmored (armor nearby): Minor. Also an option. If a focus is inacessible (as a suit of armor would be) I would rule that you cannot simply teleport it away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmjalund Posted November 22, 2017 Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 You'd need to invent a level of Indirect to do this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 22, 2017 Report Share Posted November 22, 2017 Dispel is the cleanest option to my mind. The power isn't destroyed - they can potentially put it on again. If you also want the target moved somewhere, you'll need to link it with a Teleport UOO. Teleporting the armour off the target could be done with just Dispel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 Off the top of my head, i’ll Say Dispel also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 13 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said: Transform armored target to unarmored (armor nearby): Minor. Also an option. If a focus is inacessible (as a suit of armor would be) I would rule that you cannot simply teleport it away. Yeah technically you can’t remove an OIF but you can damage it. (I believe though in one of my martial arts books there is a Dispel Armor Power).However considering the cost involved, I’d allow it. FWIW though, the transform should be Major not minor, imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 Ok I believe why you can Dispel Armor is because Dispel is an attack Power. The words of can’t remove armor is with Disarm to mean that as a normal means of removing something in combat is undoable. The problem I have with that is that in some instances of both cartoon and comic books, items which would normally described as OIF being removed during combat. The best e ample of this was an old James Bond movie where during a free fall action scene Bond fights a bad guy and removes his parachute to wear (he had none) and the poor guy falls to his death. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 First, what version of Champions are we talking about? 6th edition doesn't have Armor as a power anymore per se. Even so, I find the Dispel vs Armor to be flawed in its' attempt to create the effect of teleporting someone out of their armor. Power Armor can be built so many different ways, not just with using the old power Armor. Assuming it's used, Dispel vs Armor feels more like someone creating a hole in the armor temporarily to pull the person through the hole - an interesting attack power but not the effect wanted. I think Teleport UOO as as attack, possibly with Indirect, would be more accurate. I also think possibly a linked enhanced sense to detect the person inside the armor might be needed since, in general, you can't see the target inside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christopher R Taylor Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 Quote The best e ample of this was an old James Bond movie where during a free fall action scene Bond fights a bad guy and removes his parachute to wear (he had none) and the poor guy falls to his death. Yeah but it took him a turn to remove it, at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DasBroot Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 Since the target likely has other powers on the armor besides Armor I don't think Dispel could ever really get someone 'out of' their armor. A focus isn't the same as linked, after all - if you have Armor (15/15) with IAF (Power armor) and Chest Beam (IAF Power Armor) there's nothing in the rules that would stop them from blasting you with the chest beam after you 'took their armor off' with dispel (unlike Linked - if the chest beam was linked to the Armor it couldn't be used as long as the Armor power was unable to be used). Sensors, jet pack, etc... all components that could be part of the same focus. To get all of those I think you'd need a Dispel with expanded effect to get the 'power armor' or 'technological' SFX. But let's step back for a second and say 'why'? A 60 point dispel shouldn't be able to remove a greater amount of points of overall power from a target, ever (the hero might have 300 points of powers in that power armor): It's a severely unbalanced trade. A Usable as Attack 3 meter teleport combined with a penetrating targeting sense is even worse. I think Transform, under the section on adding or removing powers' is about the closest one can get to this effect - and the high cost makes it the only way that *should* be able to pull this off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 Yeah, points are going to make the thing impractical for most power armour supers. Dispel to make the armour fall off or move two metres to the left is probably only practical for heroic level stuff. As far as terminology goes, old edition Armor is the same power as default 6e Resistant Protection, so that matters not. Has anyone mentioned Mind Control to make the target take their suit off yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 I would into Drain. Drain can affect Body. Mutlipowers and Unified are considered one power for the purpose of Draining. An object drained to zero is “broken”. In this case teleported off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 17 minutes ago, Ninja-Bear said: I would into Drain. Drain can affect Body. Mutlipowers and Unified are considered one power for the purpose of Draining. An object drained to zero is “broken”. In this case teleported off. You still run into the issue of Drain vs the Resistant Protection but not the other powers bought through the suit. Dispel and Drain aren't much different for the purpose of this discussion, though if the effect doesn't damage the suit, Dispel seems better. Supress might also be worth considering. Both can be justified to target the Resistant Defense using other special effects (magically making the suit transparent to damage; ripping great holes in the carapace; putting the outer shell out of phase with this dimension etc). None of that has to care about the other suit powers, while removing it does. Of course, if all the suit powers are bought with Unified Power, Drain and Supress work on all of them at once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 Individual powers in a multipower would have to be targeted separately unless a separate advantage is taken on the drain OR the multipower has th unified limitation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrinku Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 ...and Dispel doesn't work on Unified Power, since it's not a negative adjustment power (Sorry, HM - we posted at the same time!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 39 minutes ago, Hyper-Man said: Individual powers in a multipower would have to be targeted separately unless a separate advantage is taken on the drain OR the multipower has th unified limitation. No I believe if you look under objects that it automatically counts as one power. (Of course I could be wrong) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 And let me throw out this idea. Even if the rules don’t explicitly state this, I can see the argument made that no matter what, all you should have to Dispel/Drain/other should be Armor only if all the other powers also have the focus limitation-armor. I mean it is a limitation after all. And for clarity I’m referencing Powered Armor like Defender’s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted November 23, 2017 Report Share Posted November 23, 2017 41 minutes ago, Ninja-Bear said: No I believe if you look under objects that it automatically counts as one power. (Of course I could be wrong) See 6e1 page 140. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 24, 2017 Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 33 minutes ago, Hyper-Man said: See 6e1 page 140. Can’t don’t have the book but I’ll take your word on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted November 24, 2017 Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 1 hour ago, Ninja-Bear said: Can’t don’t have the book but I’ll take your word on it. Also in 5er 109. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninja-Bear Posted November 24, 2017 Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 Well according to CC a power frame work is considered as one power for these purposes. Pg 105. As long as the focus takes Body damage. I’ll check 5thr when I get a chance (away from the books-well most of them ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper-Man Posted November 24, 2017 Report Share Posted November 24, 2017 Are you talking about a FOCUS taking BODY or a FRAMEWORK power being DRAINED? I was only talking about the later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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