Mental power

[Hugh Neilson]

Mind Scan fro Scry & Fry?

 

Why would you want to KILL them?

 

Margarita Man, while designed for Supers, could easily be re-skinned to use spells instead.  The power suite costs 137 points without limit. Toss on 1 handed Gestures, Incantations and 0 DCV Concentration (or any other combination of magic spell limitations to get to -1) and he's spending less than 70 points on his spells.

 

Of course, if my character can buy those spells, so can any other character.  In a Fantasy game, even more easily justified - watch out for the Wizardry College of Daiquiri!

[unclevlad]

Margarita Man is a great example that what is allowable is a small subset of what is technically legal.  On the flip side:  given a choice between a clearly abusable ruling (clairsentience does create line of effect) versus one that doesn't (no, it doesn't create line of effect)...the latter is generally preferable.  Otherwise, the game can deteriorate into little more than an arms race between the players and the GM, and rules arguments tend to displace actual play.  It's not fun.

[Christopher R Taylor]

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For the same 55 points I can purchase 8d6 Mind Scan that affects Humans, Machines, and Animals. 

 

The Categories of Mind thing was dropped in Champions Complete.  You get 12d6.

[Hugh Neilson]

22 hours ago, unclevlad said:

Margarita Man is a great example that what is allowable is a small subset of what is technically legal.  On the flip side:  given a choice between a clearly abusable ruling (clairsentience does create line of effect) versus one that doesn't (no, it doesn't create line of effect)...the latter is generally preferable.  Otherwise, the game can deteriorate into little more than an arms race between the players and the GM, and rules arguments tend to displace actual play.  It's not fun.

 

 

I agree with the first part.

 

The second?  It is also a choice between allowing judgement to permit interesting concepts with a need to assess whether those concepts are appropriate to the specific game in question, or making a flat-out denial of those interesting concepts in the interest of enforcing play balance.

 

I'm not sure whether either is objectively superior game design.  I am much more confident which is better suited to deliver on a commitment to

 

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allowing players to create any sort of character, power, gadget, spell, vehicle, monster, or weapon they can think of. Whatever you want to do, in any genre, setting, or time period, the HERO System 6th Edition rules let you do it!

 

I can think of Margarita Man.  I can design and create him.  And I can decide he would not be fun to play, not be a fun adversary for my players or otherwise be a poor fit for my game.  Or I can decide that there is a place for him in my game (maybe the Heros are the only, or among very few, people somehow immune to his powers, and that frames the game...not sold that I want to play or run that game, but someone might).

[HeroGM]

APG roughly puts LOS as 100m.

[BoloOfEarth]

On 4/12/2021 at 8:12 PM, Grailknight said:

Clairsentience doesn't have a defined way to be blocked like other Senses that can penetrate barriers (snip)

 

Darkness vs. Clairsentience, or indeed vs. any senses used through Clairsentience, would work fine for blocking it.  

 

In my past Champions campaign one of the PCs had Precognition / Retrocognition (based on psychometry - she touched people or things and got visions of the past or future related to that person or object) and frequently used it to figure out various mysteries.  I set up one crime where a mage had a spell for Darkness vs. Clairsentience so she couldn't see what had happened.  (Another time, he committed a crime and then monologued / gloated at her as if she was there at the time - knowing she'd get a vision of it.  Man, did that piss her off!)

[Grailknight]

30 minutes ago, BoloOfEarth said:

 

Darkness vs. Clairsentience, or indeed vs. any senses used through Clairsentience, would work fine for blocking it.  

 

In my past Champions campaign one of the PCs had Precognition / Retrocognition (based on psychometry - she touched people or things and got visions of the past or future related to that person or object) and frequently used it to figure out various mysteries.  I set up one crime where a mage had a spell for Darkness vs. Clairsentience so she couldn't see what had happened.  (Another time, he committed a crime and then monologued / gloated at her as if she was there at the time - knowing she'd get a vision of it.  Man, did that piss her off!)

 

That would work but I think you'd have to buy the Darkness against every Sense(Group) the Clairsentience covers.  A properly defined Darkness is the defense against any Sense Power but within limits. After all, Darkness vs Sight has no effect on Radar or Sonar.

 

It wouldn't actually be anything but a regular Darkness, though I'd probably give it at least a +1 Limitation if it only stopped Clairsentience. 

 

When I was saying that Clairsentience had no way to be easily stopped, I was referring to the fact that all the other Penetrative Senses either require the user to define a way to stop them or that the power(Mind Scan) has built-in limits. Mind Scan requires an Attack roll, a Level of Effect roll and is subject to a Breakout roll in addition to revealing the attacker's location(unless you pay extra). The right Darkness or Invisibility will stop it, just as buying either of those Powers vs the Mental Group will stop Mind Scan.

[Chris Goodwin]

On 4/12/2021 at 11:33 PM, Ninja-Bear said:

Duke Bushido as usual had some good points and did everyone else. Now let me pose this question. CCTV is usually presented as Clairsentience. Now if would it not be reasonable to allow the Viper goons to use the the CCTV to attack the fool heroes when they show themselves on camera?