Fantasy Hero Schtick

[Christopher R Taylor]

Yeah each of these is an attempt to replicate simple moves that the rules can do without needing special rules, maneuvers, etc.  Stuff anyone can try without special training or a talent, even if they are very difficult to attempt (Like shooting an arrow in half ala Robin Hood).  Yes, you could build it as a martial arts maneuver or a power, but then someone has to buy that in particular and I want to encourage players to go wild with the Hero System, not feel constrained by it.

 

GM discretion allows a lot more than may be especially obvious in some write ups.  The way I see it, Talents are restrictors: they allow people to do special things if the GM permits and they pay for it and these stunts are open to anyone. That keeps just everyone from doing that special thing; it sets apart the character "he's the guy that can sense trouble, she's the one that can fight in the dark" (incidentally this is a big part of my problem with stuff like Deadly Blow and Combat Luck; they are too efficient and useful to not buy, which makes them not special any longer, ala Syndrome).

 

That said, if someone constantly uses an ability like this, its probably worth requiring them to buy it as a power to justify their amazing stunt.

[Ninja-Bear]

2 hours ago, Duke Bushido said:

According to _a lot_ of previous discussions, that _must_ be a martial maneuver, becauase only the "Target Falls" element allows you knock people down.  Without it, you're going to have to kill them to make them fall.

 

There, now that's out of the way...

 

 

That is right up there with fastballing your Claymore-  you've seen it a zillion times, and yet you still get mad about it. 

 

good choice.  Entangle: requires skill roll (grab), range based on STR (throw), Area of Effect (perhaos it varies depending on the crowd?  Some movies Will show forty soldiers completely incapacitated by this maneuver), OIF: Large crowd of opportunity.

 

Make it a full-on power!

 

 

 

 

 

Sticky. If there was ever a time to use Sticky it would be this. You have a pile of guards and you throw on another into the mass.

[Lord Liaden]

5 hours ago, IndianaJoe3 said:

 

 

The canonical replacement is to use a Naked Advantage on Armor Piercing or Penetrating (typically taking a Half Phase or longer and requiring a skill roll).

 

3 hours ago, Duke Bushido said:

 

 

Yeah....

 

I'm not doing that when I have all these books with Find Weakness laid out all nice and clean, but I genuinely appreciate the information.

 

Thank you.

 

 

 

I really like and still use Find Weakness. I get the arguments for mechanical consistency, game balance, etc. but nothing else feels so natural to me to replicate the "Karnak feat."

 

That said, I do believe FW should stay within superheroic games, as IME it can be a literal killer in heroic-level ones.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Quote

I get the arguments for mechanical consistency, game balance, etc. but nothing else feels so natural to me to replicate the "Karnak feat."

 

Yeah I kinda feel the same way, it was clearly introduced into the rules to replicate Karnak's ability to find the perfect spot to hit and do tremendous damage like a Bene Gesserit.  But it is kinda broken and an odd way to handle defenses, so I leave it out.  Almost nobody ever took it in my campaigns, honestly.

[Duke Bushido]

13 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

 

I really like and still use Find Weakness.

 

Ditto, as noted.

 

 

13 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

 

I get the arguments for mechanical consistency, game balance, etc.

 

 

Given the things that were not changed in spite of beinf abke to meet the same criteria as those that were (such as the recent conversation about why clairsentience was not rolled over to using modifiers on senses.  The give answer, of course, was "the rules say you can't.'  Given that the rules say you can't use T-form on yourself and yet the revised Instant Change is exactly that--....

 

Why is any "valid argument" only valid for the things someone wants to,change anyway, but not valid for the things they like the way they are.

 

It works great if you standaed policy is to not field questions about design ir design changes, but it leaves a very glaring "was there really,a bigger reason than "I like it better this way?"  and "was there actually a rationale at all?"

 

Again-  it doesn't matter; we will never know.  But with all that going into the editions, I do get a not tired myself of being told why it's better almost every time I say I don't like it, or that it is functionally the same every time I say I dont use it.

 

If it was truly functionally the same, there wouldnt be much reason for a cash-strapped small publisher to put out a couple thousand pages of it, would there?

 

 

 

  :

 

 

13 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

 

but nothing else feels so natural to me to replicate the "Karnak feat."

 

Unless you are talkint about the old and obscure-even-in-it's-own-time Data East fighting Game "Fighter's History," or it's prequel / sequel for the old NES, I have no idwa what you are talking about, Sir.

 

Please enlighten me. 

 

 

 

13 hours ago, Lord Liaden said:

That said, I do believe FW should stay within superheroic games, as IME it can be a literal killer in heroic-level ones.

 

I mostly agree; I find it had uses in other genres, within tight constraints (such as an Imperial gunner having it Ships Guns versus a particular class of ships (that's what they flew against us in the war.  Eight years,in orbit around an alien sun.... I bet I shot down a thosand of them...)  or an archer who knows how to skip his arrows up the scales of a red dragon's underbelly-  that sort of thing.

 

As a General Use, any fight thing?  Yeah, definitely a superhero Schtick, though I have noticed a years-long trend in any genre that everyone at my tables who makes a martial artist character wants it; it seems many people just assume that it is part and parcel of every martial art.  (My usual reply is along the lines of "the great masters teach us that the greatest devastation is Boot to the Head-- and another one for Jenny and the Wimp! Thump; thump!")

 

 

[Lord Liaden]

27 minutes ago, Duke Bushido said:

 

Unless you are talking about the old and and sure-even-in-it's-own-time Data East fighting Game "Fighter's History," or it's prequel / sequel for the old NES, I have no idea what you are talking about, Sir.

 

Please enlighten me. 

 

 

Karnak is a member of the "royal family" of one of Marvel's superhuman offshoots of humanity, the Inhumans. (Not the Eternals, the other ones.)   Karnak has the mental ability to pinpoint the weakest, most vulnerable spot in any material, structure or being, and the skill to strike that spot with great precision and force. Karnak can shatter walls or trees with this technique.

 

In some incarnations of the character, this ability is the product of the mutagen called Terrigen Mist, which unpredictably gives the Inhumans their powers and sometimes unusual appearances. (Karnak is often depicted with an enlarged cranium.) Other versions state Karnak developed that technique through intensive training; that version is also an exceptional martial artist.

 

[steriaca]

Technically "Instant Change" Transformation is NOT on yourself. It's on your clothing. You have to be wearing SOMETHING to activate it (even if that something is just a ribbon around your neck or a nipple piercing, or...I'll stop right here thank you).

 

Note: when it was it's own power, you could use it when you were naked. And it still takes a girl on a date an hour to decide what to wear.

[Christopher R Taylor]

THis is my favorite Karnak moment, from Byrne's Fantastic Four

[Lord Liaden]

56 minutes ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

THis is my favorite Karnak moment, from Byrne's Fantastic Four

 

But you left out the part where Karnak's blow only did a relatively small amount of the damage needed to break the city loose. Gorgon had to finish the job by stomping at the same spot.

[Ninja-Bear]

I was was a recipient FW Roll and my Defenses was cut to either 1/4 or 1/8.  This was due to the character has a great run of rolls. However that stunk to to me at the time.

[Lord Liaden]

Yeah, that's the biggest negative about Find Weakness, if you keep succeeding at your roll you can reduce an opponent's Defenses to nearly nothing. The cumulative penalty helps with that, as well as failing a roll means you can't try further. But it's kind of like the 4E/5E Stun Lottery, where you can luck out big, or crap out altogether.

 

6E eliminating FW means you don't need to buy Lack of Weakness for your high-Defense characters, but 6E also broke apart Hardened working for both Armor Piercing and Penetrating attacks, so now you also have to buy Impenetrable. Neither net gain nor loss.

[Christopher R Taylor]

Now up at the plate, a classic in real swordfighting and especially fiction: the feint

 

Quote

DISGUISED ATTACK

There is a trick used in actual swordplay, and in fantasy media, to trick one’s opponent into not realizing what is being done.  This is often called a feint and can give the person fooling the other a slight advantage in combat.

 

To do this, the character can use Sleight of Hand or attempt a distraction (either physically or by a Presence Attack) which misleads the opponent into your intentions.  If this succeeds, its worth a +1 OCV bonus for that phase only, against that opponent only.  The GM should also give the defender a penalty for how they react, perhaps not blocking or otherwise not making any smart combat move such as holding an attack.

 

D-Fence: This trick can also be used defensively, fooling the opponent into thinking they have an opening or that you stumbled and are easier to attack.  If successful, the result is a +1 DCV against that opponent only for this segment only.  This is a Defensive Action, and can be Aborted to.

 

Repeat Performance: Succeed or fail, the next attempt (defense or offense) should take a -1 skill roll (-1d6 Presence Attack) penalty for the remainder of the fight, and each time attempted this increases by an additional increment.

 

Use sleight of hand or concealment or a distraction to hide what you’re trying to do.  This can give a slight OCV bonus, or even prevent a target from reacting intelligently (such as blocking).

 

[Ninja-Bear]

2 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

Now up at the plate, a classic in real swordfighting and especially fiction: the feint

 

 

Good luck! I’ve seen several versions done throughout the Martial Arts Sourcebooks and none seem to quite do feint right. Not bad though and serviceable. Just not-it.

[Christopher R Taylor]

The tough part is that since combat is fairly abstracted in Hero, specific things don't translate very exactly.

[Duke Bushido]

23 hours ago, steriaca said:

Technically "Instant Change" Transformation is NOT on yourself. It's on your clothing. You have to be wearing SOMETHING to activate it (even if that something is just a ribbon around your neck or a nipple piercing, or...I'll stop right here thank you).

 

 

I can instant change from a college professor to a werewolf.  Tht is more than clothes-deep, I think

 

 

[steriaca]

4 minutes ago, Duke Bushido said:

 

I can instant change from a college professor to a werewolf.  Tht is more than clothes-deep, I think

 

 

Not with the 4ed power Instant Change. That only changes clothing or turn a nude self into a clothed self. Same with the 5th and 6ed version, which is Cosmetic Transformation (and is only buyable with Cosmetic Transformation).

 

What your looking for is Multiform (Champions Complete pages 80-81). What I am talking about is the Instant Change on page 210 of Champions Complete. It is also in a sidebar around the Transformation power in Hero System 6ed.

[mallet]

Well it works if it is a college professor to a college professor wearing a werewolf costume. 

[Chris Goodwin]

On 11/11/2022 at 5:37 PM, steriaca said:

Technically "Instant Change" Transformation is NOT on yourself. It's on your clothing. You have to be wearing SOMETHING to activate it (even if that something is just a ribbon around your neck or a nipple piercing, or...I'll stop right here thank you).

 

Transform targets can include "thin air". 

[steriaca]

22 minutes ago, Chris Goodwin said:

 

Transform targets can include "thin air". 

True. But close to air would make you a pervert. Like Ataru or Happosai. And air to close makes you anti-Shinimeta.

 

But...you can technically go from nude to clothed with one "Instant Change", and cycle clothing with another. It only cost 3 Total Points to do one, and another 3 for the other. And remove the no range limitation to become Mr. Moth, eater of clothing.

 

(Expects to be beaten up to death by white knight types.)

[Duke Bushido]

15 hours ago, steriaca said:

Not with the 4ed power Instant Change. That only changes clothing or turn a nude self into a clothed self.

 

 

Had to look that up; it has been a couple of decades. since my last reading of 4e.   

 

 

There are four sentences under instant change in 4e.  They are simple sentences (in terms of grammar and construction- as opposed to compound, complex, or compound complex sentences, I mean, and as in any sort of snarky remark about comprehension: please remember that I do not sarcasm; I want to make sure that "these are simple sentences" did not come across as sarcasm; sincerest appologies if it did).

 

Taken together, they form a list:

 

2: a character may change into a specific set of clothes.

3: a character rmay change into one additional set of clothes

4: a character may change into any set of clothes.

The first sentence is " A character with this Special Power can instantly change from one identity to another and back again."

 

The second sentence says change into one other set of clothes.  

 

Each of these actions has a price (each is five points).

 

My take on this is that is that "identity" is not clothes, though there may be clothes that go along with it.  Green Lantern is always Green Lantern; he merely changes clothes to bevome recognizable as Green Lantern and not hidden as his Secret ID.

 

One could argue that Iron Man's suit is clothes, I suppose, and give him Instant change for that bit in the last movie where his armor comes flying in from off-camera and assembles itself on him.  I find the gifts these clothes bequeath him and the washing instructions (do not tumble dry) to make them something a little different than just clothes, but I accept that the argument can be made.

 

Of course, I don't have to accept the argument  to accept that  Tony's armor flying down in bits and pieces from beyond the clouds and Lego-locking themselves about him is a,change of identity, nor do we have to accept the clothes argument to accept that this is T-form: sharply-dressed Tony into well-armed-and-armored Tony, but if we accept that this is T-form, and we accept that Tony is doing it to himself, then we have to accept that it is violating the "you can't T-form yourself" rule.

 

 

 

The clothes argument also kind of leaves a gaping hole: the Hulk isn't zipping on two thousand pounds of muscle; Ghost Rider (    sorry!  Autocorrect made That "Goat Rider," and the imagery was hilarious! So guess who simply _must_ appear at some future point in the youth group game....?)  Anyway, Ghost Rider isnt unzipping a hundred and eighty pounds of meat and organs (which the British tell me are also meat) and putting them a hanger like so much Johnny Blaze suit.  (Can you imagine how hard that would be to undo? Sitting there, and legally-wondering if you should get dressed, knowing full-well that staying dressed in your flames-all-over suit meant that you did _not_ have to look like Nicholas Cage? )

 

 

 

Though if we stick with the Instsnt Change means T-form clothes thing, then we have to accept that this power was listed twice for a couple of editions (since clothes are not self)

Unless we get all comic-booky or first-year philosophy student though, a nude cosmonaut is going to die, since vacuum is the absence of everything else, he has nothing to turn into a vac suit!  (Sunlight?  Transform sunlight to precious, precious space suit?)  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

15 hours ago, steriaca said:

Same with the 5th and 6ed version, which is Cosmetic Transformation (and is only buyable with Cosmetic Transformation).

 

Sticking with the above named characters:

 

Green Lantern changes his clothes.  This is cosmetic without question.  Of he is changing "jogging attire to costume," though, is it still cosmetic?  It went from a sweat-filled T-shirt and basketball shorts and well-worn sneakers to a nice clean suit that allows him entry into places that don't have gas pumps out front, and it seems nigh-impossible for it to stay damaged- or even dirty- for more than a panel or two.  Does it offer defense?  (I genuinely don't know, and I have seen varying write-ups across the net over the years).  On a scale of barely clothes to super-powered clothes, this seems pretty significant; certainly more than just cosmetic.

 

Now if we are changing Hal Jordan in jogging clothes to Hal Jordan in Green Lantern Suit, this is more-or-less cosmetic (assuming the suit provides _no_ abilities of defenses at all and if torn, stays that way until mended or replaced), but it violates the "cannot T-form self" rule.

 

I know: we moved it to Instant Change, which is T-form self, but only for super-narrow instances of T-form, etc, etc.  I am looking at the building blocks here; that is all).  Most importantly, ONLY FOR SELF-ONLY!

 

The emphasis is _super_,important, by the way (and,not,as redundant as it sounds; indulge me here...)

 

There is an implied "self only" with instant change.  Don't believe me?  Buy Instant Change, take the Limitation "Self Only," and submit it to your GM.

 

So way, _way_ back when gaming was still loose and fun and new- before everyhing had a thousand or more pages of rules--- back when you could read the rules aloud in a group and stsrt playing with bits of them immediately because it would not be four of five hours before you ran into a relevant caveat or restriction- 

 

Back when people writing games _wanted_ you to explore your their products and create an experience using the skeletal guidelines they provided, and wanted you to put your group's spin on things, and trusted you to create an enjoyable experience using what they had offered.. In short, before there were rules supplements that specified clockwise or counter-clockwise for the final swipe of the Charmin-

 

The first thing we would do, after gettin a four-minute crash course in character creation- was look for _advantage_.  That is probably the nicest way to say "do our damndest to bend, twist, and otherwise break the rules, but generally as a _fun_ exercise.  We were all rules-rapists, at least for a bit.  It helped us-  more than any thousand word treatise or list of hyper-specificity such as X must always do Y, except in the presence of Z, at which time A must B,,and C is disallowed, unless N is waning and M is in the shadow of Jupiter and on and on.

 

We got to siacover the corner cases ans resolve them, and we got to figure out where the rules were wrong (yeah. That happens.  Ultimately, they are written by one guy or one small team, and no one will ever think,of everything,  this gets worse on really big projects, where even a comitte eventually become a sounding board- or worse! An echo chamber!  But I think I have wandered off far enough.  Let me find that trail again...

 

A few hastily thrown together characters and a few combats, even before we figured out some of the other rules (like healing or encumbrance or such).

 

We are squared off on a plastic hex map: villains,in two corners and one in the center.  Heroes in two corners and one in the center.

 

The important things to note:

Jim,has based,this entire combat around a hulk knockoff in the center of the map, with two other villains to distract us (bwcause we were getting better at taking down his hulk knockoff).

 

Straight John has built an immortal outside-of-time-looking-in mystic type.  He has built this character _specifically_ because Jim kept throwing this hulk knockoff at us (come on, guys: he is just muscle. Lots of it, but not a lot of brains.  Work together, be a team!  This should be easier and all,manner of nonsense intentes to make us think like a team and not like interstellar Scouts and dungeon crawlers who suddenly had superpowers!)

 

Anyway, Straight John's character (none of these early test characters had names; we were just trying to find the limits and get a feel for the genre (so _many_ murdered villains from the dungeon crawlers in those first few days....  ) had a handful of spells, one of which was True Self.  This spell ripped off the facade you had crafted in your mortal life and made you as the universe saw you: you became,your true self.

 

What was it?

 

Instant Change, Usable as attack. 

 

So the Hulk knockoff went down very, very quickly, and we all understood that this was going to be a no-no once the game started "for real."

 

   :rolf: 

 

 

15 hours ago, steriaca said:

 

What your looking for is Multiform

 

I promise you that it is not.  We played with Multiform (again, trting to break both it, and then the game via using it), and we came to the conclusion that it was (during 3e, with the restrictions on "base character, etc" both redundant and over balancing unless _everyone_ took it, and we never all wanted it.  In summation, it was very much "only in X ID, but with a limitation bonus somewhere around -5 or so...

 

No thanks.  Only in X ID existed and worked well.  5e removing some of the restrictions it had did _not_ endear it to us.

 

Getting whackier was the idea That "well, instant change isnt it's own thing, and is really just T-form, and so it should be built that way, but changing forms _this_ was is clearly not changing forms,_that_ way, and so both should exist."

 

I have segued and trailed and run down,side trails enough that my phone is nearly dead; I need to get on track, but I stand by a statement I made a long time ago:

 

Imagination is different.  Like any other drug, imagination will be experienced differently from one person to the next.  Possible reasons include upbringing, friend groups, personal, interests,  favored fiction- the list goes on forever.

 

Interpretation, similarly, varies from person to person.  Words are _hard_, and from a purely conceptual science point of view, the fact that we can, as individuals, express even some small portion of what is win our minds in a way that makes it at least _partially_ understood to a completely separate consciousness is a miracle that I will never not equate with the existence of life itself versus nothingness.  Think about it: at one point, one mind wanted to share a complex thought, and even in that moment, there existed absolutely no way to so it.

 

One mind wanted to know what wxisted inside another-  and there was no way to do it.  

 

Really-  seriously think about how amazing communication is, because at some point,  it _wasn't a real thing!  And two or more minds has to work together toward creating rhis something from absolutely nothing while not having it until they were done!

 

Sure, ir can be dismisswd as "microbes bumped into each other until one of them moved," but that does absolutely no justice to the reality that the existence of communication is very much "concept of zero" earth-shakingingly miraculous!

 

Because of the prevalence of sarcasm and other insults-as-speech today, I have to say all of that-- ALL OF IT, EVERY TIME- to get across the point that communication is _hard_, and that I _understand_ that just to make certain that everyone understands that I am _not_ being insulting or derisive when I say that I one-hundred-percent believe- without insult- that a lot of the new stuff exists only because a numbrr of people did not fully understand the old stuff, or did not fully imagine what they could do with the old stuff, or interpreted it in only one,or two of multiple possible ways (one of the down sides of communication, until we can transplant concepts,and their underpinnings directly from mind to mind, is interpretation, and it is made worse through choice of medium, and even choices within that medium:  I have chosen the written word, which has its own set of problems, which can be compounded by the individual words selected and rhe combinations into which they are arranged).

 

 

So I get that some people were using OHID to build Iron Man, others were using it to build Larry Talbot, and others were using it to build Beast Boy.

 

I get that, and I have _zero_,derision or animosity or snark for those who were going "I wish there was a power that I could use to build the Hulk."

 

There always was none; it didn't click with everyone.  I am _fine_ with that.  But keep in mind that _there really was a way to do that_, and the difference between spending a few minutes hiding behind boxes in a warehouse, going through the glowing contact lenses and watching Ferigno flex enough to rip the stiching out ofba demon shirt, then tearing a pair of pants, and then stomping his big bare foot on top of a pair of docksiders and then standing up flexing a couple of times and then takinf a moment to cast aside a shredded shirt (which is now plaid, for some reason), and then leaping forward, finally ready to fight crime, having thus become  the hulk or "I put a gun in my mouth and the other guy spit the bullet out" is Instant Change: it is today as much as it was forty years ago.

 

Whichever version you like, of course.  I prefer the version that doesn't have to tunr a blind eye to its own violation of the rules- yes; costs the same; end result the same, but without having gone to the trouble to justify itself as just a tweak on another power in spite of having to break that power's rules a tiny bit.

 

And doesnt mandate that I use a power construct that I find unneccesarily complicated and somewhat abusive (that being Multiform) to get the samenexact effect I can get from Instant Change and OIHID.

 

15 hours ago, steriaca said:

(Champions Complete pages 80-81). What I am talking about is the Instant Change on page 210 of Champions Complete. It is also in a sidebar around the Transformation power in Hero System 6ed.

 

 

Yes; we both were- at least mostly.  The version that folds itself into T-from,in spite of the fork of rules violations.  I say fork; refer to the Green Lantern example above.  Either it is a cosmetic t-form the character is using on himself (the accepted and overlooked violation of the t-form rules to make this work, or it is potentially a major change (jogging atire to Iron Man suit floating just off camera) to the clothing itself that is priced way wrong- again overlooked to make this work.

 

Both versions work the same / cost the same, according to the 6e pundit.  That is fine.  I still prefer to stick with the concept that doesn't require me to accept a few rules violations as an intellectual exercise.  I just dont think that was ever necessary or even proper.

 

 

Notes from other bits (I have about 30 percent battery, and I would like to at at least _attempt_ to edit out some of the autocorrect problems):

 

 

Chris is quite correct in that one of the targets for Transform is thin air, and we should be glad of it, since your own examaple of "nude self" to "clothed self" is transform: self, which 4e says is forbidden (but it also notes that T-form can be used to create objects, which solved that problem until we broke it again some years later)

 

At any rate, I shan't (      autocorrect has never heard of shan't, but seems to find "shart" to be a  perfectly acceptable substitution.  Autocorrect does not speak english; I swear it doesn't....  )

 

[Christopher R Taylor]

The proper, uncontracted version is shannot

[Duke Bushido]

23 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

The tough part is that since combat is fairly abstracted in Hero, specific things don't translate very exactly.

 

I am not sure if you are actually quoting something or have cut in a quote block for calrity, but I rather like using slight of hand.  Props to the creator!

 

 

[steriaca]

@Duke Bushido, I wish they didn't get rid of the Instant Change power. It does, along with Only In Alternate Idenity, make a good alternative to Multiform. I don't exactly have a 4ed BBB, so how much did it cost?

 

I would love to see it as an Alternative Optional Power in an Advanced Player's Guide 3. Same with Transfer (I'm ok with buying ranged advantages twice because it is actually two two two powers in one, same with extending duration advantages.). Will probably never see it.

 

On the other hand, I am fine with Force Field be folded into Resistant Protection. There is no real difference except that one cost Endurance to use and the other doesn't cost Endurance to use.

[Duke Bushido]

7 minutes ago, steriaca said:

@Duke Bushido, I wish they didn't get rid of the Instant Change power. It does, along with Only In Alternate Idenity, make a good alternative to Multiform. I don't exactly have a 4ed BBB, so how much did it cost?

 

I would love to see it as an Alternative Optional Power in an Advanced Player's Guide 3. Same with Transfer (I'm ok with buying ranged advantages twice because it is actually two two two powers in one, same with extending duration advantages.). Will probably never see it.

 

On the other hand, I am fine with Force Field be folded into Resistant Protection. There is no real difference except that one cost Endurance to use and the other doesn't cost Endurance to use.

Out with the family right now (I am taking a breather while everyone else runs around the store)  if we what back at a reasonable hour, and no one else has offered the pricing, I will (barring memory issues) get the pricing for you.

 

 

[steriaca]

Just now, Duke Bushido said:

Out with the family right now (I am taking a breather while everyone else runs around the store)  if we what back at a reasonable hour, and no one else has offered the pricing, I will (barring memory issues) get the pricing for you.

 

 

Thanks. I'm thinking a simple 5 point spread, as it was the standard for such things. But of course my memory might be faulty.

 

Transfer I believe was 15 points per 1d6. Again, don't quote me because faulty memory. (I bet someone will anyways).