Designing martial maneuvers for TK

[unclevlad]

Rules allow purchasing martial maneuvers for use with TK, with GM permission and Fine Manipulation.  Your TK STR is replacing your normal STR, but the HTH rules generally apply...except that, since you can use TK at range, the range mods also apply.

 

So...would you allow a move like this:

 

Sucker Punch (5 points):  +1 OCV, +0 DCV, +2 DCs, +2 Range Mod

 

where the character's HTH DCs apply as well?

 

The alternative, of course, would be Penalty Skill Levels with TK+martial maneuver combos;  it's likely this would be cheaper if it was gonna apply to multiple maneuvers, whereas the range mod in the maneuver might be cheaper if only a few maneuvers would have it.

[Duke Bushido]

3 minutes ago, unclevlad said:

 

 

3 minutes ago, unclevlad said:

So...would you allow a move like this:

 

 

Before I say anything (as I may not belong in this conversation, and I am not looking to stir up a rash of ill will), may I ask for a clarification of your question:

 

Are you asking a general audience if we would allow martial arts on TK, or are you asking specifically about the build's legitimacy as a telekinesis MA build?

 

(Not being obtuse; I just dont want to butt in where I cant offer anything).

 

Thanks, Vlad.

 

 

 

[unclevlad]

The assumption is that martial arts and TK is allowed.  The question is, given that TK is "HTH at range"...would you allow an HTH maneuver to be built with a Range Mod incorporated?  This is a combination of features that only works with TK, or with Stretching with the Range Modifier Applies limitation, but I'd be really dubious about that combo.  (It's quite possible there'd be no point savings, too.)

[BNakagawa]

Functionally, what is the difference between a maneuver that has +2 OCV and +2 range mod levels? Clearly, the +2 OCV is universally better, so I can't imagine the 2 range mod levels to be an issue.

 

The real issue for me is that allowing things like martial throw at range is a non-starter.

[unclevlad]

On martial HTH maneuvers, OCV is capped at +2.  So you could do, for example, +2 OCV, + 2 Range Mods, and +1 DC for 5 points.

 

But generally, you're right;  +OCV with an HTH maneuver is the same cost and is more flexible;  with ranged combat, +OCV is 2 points per.  So on HTH, you're right;  unless you're planning on taking both, the range mod gives a bit less.

[Hugh Neilson]

The character has paid 150% the cost of STR for TK (that is, the price of STR at range) plus the Fine Manipulation modifier.  Given that, I don't see any reason he should be prevented from using HTH type MA modifiers at range.

 

While I see the "+2 range mod and +2 OCV mod", what would 2 PSLs against range modifier for a single maneuver cost outside martial arts?  I don't think this is a game-bender, much less a game-breaker.

[unclevlad]

PSLs for a specific OCV penalty (range mod)...with 1 maneuver, 1 point;  with a small group, 2 points.

 

So yeah, this is probably more of a philosophical question than a practical one.  

 

(Ohhh...kkkayyy....just saw a really kinda bizarre ad for a line of wines called St Huberts...The Stag...mind...blown.......)

[Grailknight]

I've done this in a short-term campaign. We just ported over the Grab, Block and NND based maneuvers and used the Ranged Martial Arts for the Strikes and Throws as there are already maneuvers written for those.

[LoneWolf]

Since TK can be used at range I don’t think using the HTH rules are appropriate.  They should be built using the rules for a ranged martial art.  That means you HTH DC do not apply to maneuvers designed for use with TK.      

[Hugh Neilson]

TK falls into an odd middle ground. If we allowed Range on STR (just like many other naked advantages can be used on STR), the power would not be needed at all.  It's not like you must be at range to use TK.

 

Stretching is also HTH usable at range.

[Asperion]

This seems no different from allow a blaster to use their blast for certain attacks like disarming, tripping, blinding, etc that would only be useful for someone with x power. RAW allows it,  so the only real question left is up to the gm.