Greyhawk, ToEE adventures

[Edsel]

Merely pleased with myself for coming up with this so I thought I would post. The party is currently in Hommlet and will be eventually procceding onto the Temple of Elemental Evil. The game system is Hero (Fantasy Hero), so basically I have converted the AD&D modules into Hero System.  I will preface by saying that the character said they have no idea about the birthmark and left the specifics up to me.  They were also leaving the deal about attracting people who think she is a "chosen one" of some sort up to me.  I think they rolled up a random background using the "Heroes of Legend" book (an OOP generic suplement produced by Task Force games in the distant past).  The player still doesn't know what the birthmark means or who these weirdos are that are following her around.

• Distinctive Feature: Alchemical symbol on arm (Easily Concealed; Is Noticed and Recognized) [5-points]. This has the ability to change. It is currently an eastern (in our world Chinese) alchemical symbol for mushrooms. It is often a harbinger of what ever the current plot is. The mushrooms are fungi and therefore a part of the domain of Zuggtmoy (Demoness Lady of Fungi). She is sealed in the Temple of Elemental Evil and perhaps Kaitra will be instrumental in freeing her.

• Hunted: Religious Zealots Frequently (Less Pow; PC has a Public ID or is otherwise very easy to find; Watching; There are lots of them) [7-points]. A group of 4 zealots have wandered into town while the part is away at the Moathouse. When they arrive back in Hommlet they may cause a scene. “Your eminence! Show us the way!” Every week from this point forward in Hommlet 1d6 more pilgrims will arrive, it will eventually cause issues with the townsfolk. They are devotees of Zuggtmoy (Demoness Lady of Fungi), whether they are sober enough to realize it or not. (They eat funny mushrooms).

Her birthmark became more defined and prominent in the last month or so. It had been rather indistinct but now it is a symbol that means mushrooms (a fungi). I got the symbol from here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhi_(excrescences). Since Zuggtmoy is sealed within the depths of the temple our unsuspecting character may somehow be the key to releasing the demon, or further sealing them, or whatever. I will go with whatever fits the narrative at the time. The nice thing about this "birthmark" is that it can change to attract a different group of cultists at a later date. For instance, once the ToEE is dealt with perhaps a symbol of fire or ice when they move on to something like "Against the Giants."

Edited May 13, 2023 by Edsel
Grammatical errors

[Doc Democracy]

I am currently planning to run Greyhawk using Fantasy HERO.  I am musing about it on a thread here, would be interested in knowing what you did to tailor the system.

[Edsel]

First off.  If any of my players are reading this thread.  STOP.

 

I am afraid that I have done very little conversion work.  Our D&D 5E group became disillusioned with all the shenanigans going on with the publishers and community.  We then reverted back to AD&D 2E with an all new campaign, but that only lasted a few sessions before some of the younger members in our group made it know that they really didn't like the system that much.  So now we transitioned over to Hero System.  At first people attempted to replicate their 1st level D&D characters in Hero which is possible but you end up with some really wonky builds.  After that first attempt I encouraged the players to just keep their background and history and rebuild the characters using the published Hero System sources.  This has worked much better.  The elves used the elf template from Fantasy Hero, the Gnome and Halfling did the same (6-players, 2 elves, 1 gnome, 1 halfling, 2 humans).

 

Since it is new to most of the group, I started them off in the Village of Hommlet.  In AD&D they made one foray to the moathouse (where one got eaten by a big lizard) and then retreated to regroup.  We transitioned the campaign to Hero system.  Four of the characters kept the same character idea that they had.  One player changed.  And the deceased character was a new build as well.  I have pretty much just gotten the equivlent critters from the Hero System Bestiary where possible and just made a quick build for the few I did not have (Bugbear and Gnoll).  I have even used the Hero System Ghouls even though they lack the paralytic power of the AD&D versions.

 

So basically I convert as little as I can get away with.  And since most of the group was not familiar with Greyhawk, they do not necessiarly come across as typical Greyhawk characters.  One guy is running a character based on Bell from a certain popular anime.  And then the Complications that players have put on their characters have given me all sorts of material I can use as, well Complications.  I am trying to bring those complications to life using Greyhawk background where possible.  And at least one character is familar with the background and so is essentially running a former Scarlet Brotherhood monk who is being hunted by them as a traitor.  

Edited May 13, 2023 by Edsel
Fixing grammar and spelling.

[Doc Democracy]

Thanks.  If I was getting something out short-notice I reckon I would gave done the same.  Unfortunately I have time and so my brain refuses to allow me to do less work...  🙂

 

How are you handling alignment?  Physical limitation (as alignments make you susceptible to some nagics and nit others), psych limitation as they should drive behaviour, reputation (because they can be detected etc), or something else?

[Edsel]

We did not take the concept of alignments into Hero System with us.  Which also means things like "Protection from Evil/Good" are no longer applicable.  For turning undead I have already told the character that wants to be a sort of cleric that most undead take increased effects from PRE attacks by holy men (just needs to profess that is what he is and buy the perk to be a priest).  I did write up this scroll which they may find if they look in the right area.  

 

Scroll: Protection from Undead:  Telekinesis (30 STR), Area Of Effect (3m Radius; +1/4), Persistent (+1/4), Affects Desolidified Any form of Desolidification (+1/2) (90 Active Points); 1 Continuing Charge lasting 20 Minutes which Never Recovers (-2 1/2), Limited Power Only vs Undead and Physical Missiles They Fire (-1 1/2), OAF Fragile (-1 1/4), No Range (-1/2)

 

Probaby need to add Requires Light (-1/4) to that as well but since it is a consumable magic item I am not very concerned about the Real Point cost.

 

I guess magic items and spells from AD&D are about the only thing I have done significant work on.  If I can replicate the Greyhawk item or spell I do so.  If I can't then I just substitue something of similar worth that can be built in Hero System or taken from the published sources.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Edsel

[Christopher R Taylor]

I build "turning undead" as a huge presence attack, so the priest gets a bonus, and as you say, undead take increased presence attacks from holy men.  Between the two, that will tend to make undead cower and flee.  I ruled that very weak undead simply die at PRE+30 as part of their complication.

[Khymeria]

7 hours ago, Christopher R Taylor said:

I build "turning undead" as a huge presence attack, so the priest gets a bonus, and as you say, undead take increased presence attacks from holy men.  Between the two, that will tend to make undead cower and flee.  I ruled that very weak undead simply die at PRE+30 as part of their complication.

Somebody had asked me about why I built the Challenge the Unnatural (turning the undead) Talent in Gaslight: Horror and Heroism in the Victorian Era as potent as I did, and the reason was it had to be smashingly successful in that setting, 100 pt. Competent Normals as the baseline. If the vicar holds out his holy symbol and fail to hold the vampire back, everyone in the room is likely dead. There was not much room for wiggle there. In a Fantasy game you usually have a bit more pop to the PCs, but decently powerful undead will likely shred characters in that genre quickly as well.  I dig that destroy rule for just cleaning things up when the gods favor. 

[greypaladin_01]

So the equivalent of "Turn Resistance" from  later editions of D&D would just be something like  +10 PRE, only to resist Turn Undead PRE Attacks?

[Khymeria]

42 minutes ago, greypaladin_01 said:

So the equivalent of "Turn Resistance" from  later editions of D&D would just be something like  +10 PRE, only to resist Turn Undead PRE Attacks?

That sounds like an easy way to handle it, assuming you are using the standard Fantasy Hero rules. 

[Cloppy Clip]

Don't have much to add, but this is a fascinating project so I'd love to hear more! It's been years since I've read TOEE, but I think I remember the gist of it. Still, it sounds like you're expanding on it and adding new elements based on your players, so my memory might not be as much help as I'd hope here.

 

I was thinking about the zhi marking one of your characters has. The wikipedia article says it's used in Daoism, which puts me in mind of those cultivation stories that have popped up recently. I've not had much luck with them, but the idea of developing increased power by consuming alchemical herbs and potions might be a good outline for what these zealots who are popping up believe in and practice.

 

Whatever you decide, I'm definitely looking forward to finding out what comes of this.

[Edsel]

I would like to post more about my ideas and GM schemes, but I fear that some of my six players might drop in on this forum from time to time.  I have written a two and half page summary of the Complications that the characters in the group have.  In those notes I put forth my ideas for how to make those complications as detrimental as they should be.  Several of them have complications that will have direct implications into the activies of the ToEE even if they haven't realized it yet.  A few others will probably spawn side-quests as their weaknesses are exploited.  Our second session, in Hero System, will be tomorrow night and I am looking forward to it.  I have been away from Hero for years and the bug has bitten me again.  They have nearly cleared the ground floor of the Moathouse, they have yet to delve beneath the surface.

Here is the Moathouse drawn in dry-erase markers on the hex tiles that I have.  Originally I had this built with Warlock tiles but they have nearly finished the ground level so those tiles have gone into building the underground.

[greypaladin_01]

Those hex grids looks very cool.   What are they?

[Edsel]

They are made by a company named Role 4 Initiative. 

[Cloppy Clip]

That looks like a great solution to the battlemap question, and much more artistic than I could manage. If you don't mind my asking, how many points are your players working with? And how are you handling the conversion of D&D monsters to HERO - are you using some sort of system, or do you just substitute whatever seems reasonable? Hope your second session goes well!

[greypaladin_01]

It certainly looks impressive, I'm sure they will all have a good time.   Also to add to the questions from @Cloppy Clip how are you handling combat size with your group?   I know when I have run champions in the past combats can take some time, and when running low level "standard" battles in 5e D&D they can go much faster by comparison.    Are the players staying interested in the combat or is it taking a long time and they drift some?

[Edsel]

43 minutes ago, Cloppy Clip said:

That looks like a great solution to the battlemap question, and much more artistic than I could manage. If you don't mind my asking, how many points are your players working with? And how are you handling the conversion of D&D monsters to HERO - are you using some sort of system, or do you just substitute whatever seems reasonable? Hope your second session goes well!

Actually, I misspoke, I have seven players in the group (only six will be here this evening).  We started with 160 points with 40 points of matching complications.  I lessened the points from the traditional 175/50 because I do have so many player characters.  We had started this campaign using AD&D 2nd Edition, but that only went about four sessions before some of the less "old timers" were not very happy with the system.  We then converted the whole thing to Hero 6E.  Four players kept their original concept and started with 5 XP each, the other three started with new characters.  Essentially, we just switched systems.  I am just using Greyhawk as the setting and using ToEE as material for the general course of the adventure.  I use stuff pretty much straight out of the Hero System Bestiary when I can and make what I don't have.  It isn't really converting AD&D to Hero so much as simply using the background material.  For example, one pre-existing character was a halfling thief/psionicst with telekinesis.  He just made a Fantasy Hero halfling and took some thief skills and built a telekinesis multipower.  We pretty much gave up on trying to build direct conversions because we are playing Fantasy Hero and trying to play AD&D with a different rules system is just too much of a headache.

[Cloppy Clip]

That makes sense, and is probably a much better way than tinkering endlessly with conversions, no matter how tempting that may be lol. Are your players all familiar with HERO, or do they need some help with the mechanics. And if the latter, how easy are they finding the combat? I have a sneaking idea that HERO combat gets much simpler for new players if you have someone experienced who can break down each option at any given point into "roll these dice, try to get 12 or under" and other similar examples, but unfortunately I'm the closest thing to an experienced player my table has, so that doesn't work out so well in practice for me!

[Christopher R Taylor]

Yeah unless you really want the exact D&D setting and magic, etc, I recommend using some other source of magic and system instead of converting D&D.  It has been my experience that when you do a full conversion of most spell systems to Hero, it exposes a lot of raw problems with "levels" of spells and utility.  Some stuff is just way underpowered and some over powered.