Rerednaw Posted March 18, 2003 Report Share Posted March 18, 2003 I am of four minds (pun intended) defining this mental power: Entangle -Based on ECV -EGO to break not STR -and (forget the last modifier) Mind Control. -One command. "Do absolutely nothing!" -Drain (Ego) -Transform (normal to completely paralyzed). Which would you use and why? Just looking for opinions on this. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Archer Posted March 18, 2003 Report Share Posted March 18, 2003 Re: How would you define Mental Paralysis? Originally posted by Rerednaw I am of four minds (pun intended) defining this mental power: Entangle -Based on ECV -EGO to break not STR -and (forget the last modifier) Entangle takes no damage from attacks. I've always gone with the Entangle option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Hiemforth Posted March 18, 2003 Report Share Posted March 18, 2003 Re: How would you define Mental Paralysis? Originally posted by Rerednaw Which would you use and why? I'd use Entangle with the modifiers. (Takes No Damage From Physical Attacks is the third one.) I think it's the most elegant solution, because it literally does what you're after: it forces the target to stand still unless they can break free with their mind. Each of the others has problems, IMV. Mind Control: This one gets weird because the target can subtract their Mental Defense, which isn't analogous to a physical Entangle (wherein the target's defense is irrelevant). Also, it can make it harder to affect a low-EGO character with a hyperactive personality than it is a high-EGO character with a more sedate personality. Impulse (the bratty little Flash clone) might have a low EGO but a severe aversion to standing still, while Professor X has a huge EGO but doesn't mind being motionless. It might end up actually being easier for Impulse to break out than it is for Professor X, and that's probably not what you're after. (This effect is often used specifically to stop people like Impulse.) Drain vs EGO: This one doesn't do anything to actually make them be motionless. They can still move easily, provided they have reason (or someone gives them reason). Plus, Power Defense is applied to it, which seems weird for an Entangle-type effect. Transform: I'd stay away from this one on the grounds that there are at least two other ways to build the effect with varying degrees of success (Entangle and Mind Control), and you should generally avoid using Transform to duplicate the effects of other Powers. Plus, it defaults to working against BODY instead of EGO, which isn't quite right, and they get Power Defense against it, which (as with Drain) seems kind of weird. So to some extent, the Entangle method is just the one with the least problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEmerged Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 Personally, I've always used Mental Illusions at the +30 EGO mark myself. I especially like the way it keeps the victim from perceiving anything, but that would be a drawback for most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobGreenwade Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 Actually, any of the five methods given here (the four original ones, plus Mental Illusions) are legitimate, depending on the dynamic of the power being modeled. As a side note, for Entangle I prefer a straight +2 Mental Paralysis Advantage; the math is smoother, and it can also include (in addition to those given in the "official" version) full conversion into a Mental Power, with all of the properties thereof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BNakagawa Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 Basically I define it as nearly instantaneous death for martial artists. $0.02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaosliege Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 I personaly would use the Entangle option. I looked at the drain and it would take too long or be huge points as it would have to be a DEX or SPD drain based on ECV. Same with Transform. Mind Control I agree with Derek, It's too unreliable. Mental Illusions I like. This is a cool idea, although still not as effective as the Entangle option. Entangle always has an effect, even if it is short lived. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaughterj Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 Entangle as described by various people here is what we've used, but unlike Derek, I've always been annoyed that Mental Defense didn't somehow factor into defending against this, though I haven't put any effort into trying to create a "fix" for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vondy Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 High School. On a more serious note: I would probably define it as Mind Control with the apropos advantages and lims, though an entangle BOECV with a limit on its duration, or being linked to the mentalists consciousness might work. The latter of those is more abusive, and the first is generally cleaner from a design perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkusDark Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 Oh, takes no damage from attack! I FORGOT! Dang, now when my mentalist hero does the entangle, I'll just 'slap' him awake with an ego attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 The entangle is an expensive one. If it's mental then it would need the BOEVC advantage. If it's a mental entangle it would need takes no damage. I have used both entangle and Mind Control in the past. Both work well. Once the Mind Control is in effect they are held, but Mental defense do apply, but this is offset by the limitation 1 command only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Hiemforth Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 Originally posted by slaughterj Entangle as described by various people here is what we've used, but unlike Derek, I've always been annoyed that Mental Defense didn't somehow factor into defending against this, though I haven't put any effort into trying to create a "fix" for this. There's a fix in 5E already if you want one. On page 110, while describing how to build a Mental Paralysis-type power, it says that you can apply a -1/2 Limitation if you want the target's Mental Defense to add to their EGO for purposes of breaking free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillS Posted March 21, 2003 Report Share Posted March 21, 2003 I don't know if this helps but I gave my mentallist an attack where the bad guy thinks he's been handcuffed/tied up. It's an entangle vs. Ego. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slaughterj Posted March 21, 2003 Report Share Posted March 21, 2003 Originally posted by Derek Hiemforth There's a fix in 5E already if you want one. On page 110, while describing how to build a Mental Paralysis-type power, it says that you can apply a -1/2 Limitation if you want the target's Mental Defense to add to their EGO for purposes of breaking free. Cool, thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syberdwarf2 Posted March 21, 2003 Report Share Posted March 21, 2003 Mental Paralysis: PS: McDonald's Drive-Thru Attendant 8- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted March 21, 2003 Report Share Posted March 21, 2003 I still use a 3rd Edition Champions power for Mental Paralysis, called... Mental Paralysis. 15 pts for 1d6, 1 Def gained for every 30 pts put into the power. Defense could not be bought to my knowledge. Use Ego as Str to break out. Whether others use this or not, it works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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