Early Firearms

[GaryB]

For the past week I have been researching early firearms. Everything from the earliest chinese armament to the 18th century. Largely it appears up until the early 19th century Flintlocks were the most widely used firearms. However, the only predecessors I could find out about just before flintlock weapons are matchlocks. However, I have found mentions and such of Wheellock and I am wondering what exactly was involved with these firearms? What were the differences between it and Match and Flintlock weapons?

[John Desmarais]

Re: Early Firearms

 

For the past week I have been researching early firearms. Everything from the earliest chinese armament to the 18th century. Largely it appears up until the early 19th century Flintlocks were the most widely used firearms. However' date=' the only predecessors I could find out about just before flintlock weapons are matchlocks. However, I have found mentions and such of Wheellock and I am wondering what exactly was involved with these firearms? What were the differences between it and Match and Flintlock weapons?[/quote']

 

Nice brief description of wheelocks here: http://www.rickard.karoo.net/articles/weapons_wheellock.html

[GaryB]

Re: Early Firearms

 

I must have been tired. Thanks for the link. I had seen that one. However, I did another search doing a little change up on the word order I was using and found.

 

http://www.silcom.com/~vikman/isles/scriptorium/firearm/firearm.html

 

Which...is perfect since it describes them in order and has some comparisons.

 

Thank you much though!

[TheImperialKhan]

Re: Early Firearms

 

For the past week I have been researching early firearms. Everything from the earliest chinese armament to the 18th century. Largely it appears up until the early 19th century Flintlocks were the most widely used firearms. However' date=' the only predecessors I could find out about just before flintlock weapons are matchlocks. However, I have found mentions and such of Wheellock and I am wondering what exactly was involved with these firearms? What were the differences between it and Match and Flintlock weapons?[/quote']

 

Matchlocks were far more primitive, they used a length of slow match (a slow-burning fuze basically) to ignite the gunpowder. As such they were prone to misfiring and in wet weather they were useless.

 

Flintlocks used a piece of flint which struck a steel igniter when the triger was pulled, creating sparks, which ignited the priming charge and that in turn ignited the main powder charge. It was more reliable and far less vulnerable to wet weather or flying spray.

 

In the early years of the 19th century the flint and priming charge were replaced with the percussion cap, making them more reliable still and largely invulnerable to wet weather.

 

There was also a weapon called a Doglock which was used in the 17th century. It was a varient of the flintlock with a catch or dog on the hammer to prevent the weapon from being fired accidently. These weapons fell out of favor as too many people would forget to release the dog in the heat of the moment with unfortunate results.

[shadowcat1313]

Re: Early Firearms

 

one useful source for wild west era firearms is the Knuckleduster Firearms Shop

by Forrest Harris

 

4http://www.knuckleduster.com/compendium.html

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Early Firearms

 

Here's a bunch of rules I've thrown together for early firearms. Not that you asked. You're getting them anyway.

 

General: All gunpowder weapons have Concentration 1/2 DCV throughout the loading and firing process. All except the Fowling Piece and the explosive weapons are considered to be Armor Piercing vs low tech armors (ie all armor in the campaign except natural armor and magic force field type defenses). The explosion from a mortar shell or grenado is non-selective.

 

Powder usage:

Most small arms get 12 charges from a pound of powder. Swivel guns get 10 charges from a pound. Grenado guns fire a grenado with 1/4 pound of powder. Multiple barrel weapons must use a charge and a ball or shot for each barrel. All small arms use corned powder.

Cannons and mortars can use either serpentine powder or corned powder. If using the less powerful serpentine powder, a rabinet gets 3 charges per pound of powder, a falconet gets 1 charge per pound, a minion uses 6 pounds per charge, a quartocannon uses 12 pounds per charge, a demicannon 32 pounds, a cannon 50 pounds, and a basilisk 90 pounds. A mortar uses 8 pounds, a pedrero 40 pounds, and a heavy mortar 75 pounds. Corned powder is twice as powerful, so a rabinet gets 6 charges per pound, a falconet 2 charges per pound, a minion uses 3 pounds per charge, a quartocannon 6 pounds, etc.

 

Match burn rates:

Quickmatch comes in several varieties, with burn rates ranging from 10-100 feet per second. Slow match burns at 1 foot per hour. Characters may specify which type they want when they buy it. Match found while adventuring will need to be tested in order to determine how fast it burns, in most cases. Using match without testing it can be embarassing or even very dangerous.

 

Volley Guns:

A volley gun is a multi-barreled smoothbore musket with one lock. Firing the weapon fires all the barrels at the same time. Due to the added recoil, the STR Min of a volley gun is increased by 1 for a two barreled version, by 2 for a 4 barreled version, and by 3 for an 8 barreled version (the maximum size). The weapon is considered to have AF equal to the number of barrels.

 

Variant ammunition:

Black powder weapons can be loaded in many different ways: with shot, with ball, with stones, with shot and ball, with two balls, or with a double charge of gunpowder. Cannons have even more options available. The weapons table shows the ballistic characteristics of the most common type of ammunition for the weapon type, assuming that fowling pieces are loaded with either shot or stones (or other junk), that mortars are loaded with shells, and that all other weapons are loaded with a single ball. Variants follow:

Double shot: Loading two of the standard type of ammunition is called "double-shotting". Double shotting a weapon takes an extra phase and confers AutoFire 2 on the weapon's standard damage. If the attacker rolls a 16 or higher on the attack roll, the powder charge was not powerful enough to move the extra ammunition from the barrel, and it will take at least several minutes, if not hours, and a gunsmith roll to clear the weapon.

Double charge: Loading an extra ration of gunpowder into the weapon is called "double-charging". Double charging takes no extra time, and gives the weapon an additional +1 OCV, +2 RMod, and +1 Damage Class. If the attacker rolls a 16 or higher on the attack roll, the powder charge blows the weapon apart, causing the same damage to the attacker as would have been inflicted had the weapon hit. If a weapon is double-shotted and double-charged, then this failure result takes precedence.

Loading shot into a ball-firing weapon: Loading shot into a ball-firing weapon gives the weapon an OCV modifier of 0 and a RMod of -2 regardless of what it is when firing ball ammunition. Damage is the same, but it becomes Reduced by Range, and Reduced Penetration (not vs worn armor).

Loading stones or junk into a ball-firing weapon: Loading stones or junk into a ball-firing weapon affects OCV and RMod the same as loading shot. Damage is the same, but it becomes Reduced by Range, and Reduced Penetration.

Loading a ball into a fowling piece: Loading a ball into a fowling piece gives it a -1 OCV and a -3 RMod. Damage is 1d6+1, but it loses the Reduced by Range and Reduced Penetration limitations.

Mixing shot and ball: When mixing shot and ball in any firearm, the weapon gains AutoFire 2. If only one attack hits, it is assumed to be the shot, and damage is inflicted as normal for shot fired from that type of weapon. If both attacks hit, the ball also hits, doing damage as normal for ball ammunition fired from that type of weapon. The weapon is considered to be double-shotted for misfire purposes.

Bar shot, chain shot, and expanding shot: These are all different types of shot for naval artillery. They are only made for Quartocannons and larger, and cost the same as a regular ball. These types of shot are not affected by a ship's natural Damage Reduction when they hit sails and rigging. They do full regular damage to personnel and half damage to the keel or hull.

Grapeshot: Grapeshot is a case of large balls (each equivalent to a minion ball) fired from a Quartocannon or larger, essentially turning it into a large blunderbuss. Grapeshot gives the cannon +2 OCV, a RMod of -2 and a STUNx of +1 regardless of what it is when firing a ball. It is generally used at short range against personnel. A canister of grapeshot costs the same as a ball for the same weapon.

Red-hot shot: Many coastal fortresses, especially those of Costaron, have furnaces for heating balls to a glowing red heat. These red-hot shot can set a ship aflame if they lodge in the hull, with an 11- chance per Turn. Dousing the shot with water causes this chance to drop by 1 per Turn; neglecting to do this means the chance only drops by 1 every Minute.

 

Crew-served weapons:

Most artillery is crewed by more than one man. The crew sizes listed are the minimum effective crew sizes. Military units will tend to have larger crews; the extra men tend horses while the weapon is in action. Naval gun crews will adhere more strongly to the minimum effective crew size. Artillery which is crewed by fewer than the minimum effective crew will have their reload time increased by a factor equal to the effective level of the Time Chart (ie 1 Turn, 1 Minute, or 5 Minutes) used by the weapon, multiplied by the number of crew missing. For example, a rabinet with only one crew member will take 2 Turns (standard) + (number of missing crew members x effective level of Time Chart = 1 x 1 Turn) for a total reload time of 3 Turns. A single crew member trying to reload a basilisk will take 10 Minutes (standard) + (5 missing crew members x 5 Minutes) for a total of 35 minutes.

 

Organ Guns:

Any cannon-type gun can be built as an organ gun -- a gun with multiple barrels. This gives the weapon autofire at a value equal to the number of barrels used. Each barrel must be reloaded separately, at full standard reload rate each. An organ gun does not have to fire all of its barrels at once.

 

Carronades:

Artillery pieces of quartocannon size and larger can be constructed as a carronade, if desired. A carronade has a shorter, heavier barrel, giving it reduced range as compared to a long gun, but it can hold a heavier charge. A typical carronade charge is 50% heavier than a powder charge for a comparably sized long gun. This carronade charge can be doubled, following all normal rules for double-charging. A carronade has a RMod of 2 less than normal, +1 Damage Class, and costs the same as a comparable long gun.

 

Use of firearms vs non-firearm wielding opponents:

Using firearms against opponents without them has some important effects on morale. Any character using a firearm and making an appropriate Presence Attack against an opponent without firearms gets the +1d6 bonus for superior technology. Furthermore, the flash, noise, smell, and general destructive capacity of a gun is so disconcerting to those who are not armed with them that their OCV is reduced by half when in combat against firearm wielding foes.

 

Naval Gunfire:

Because of the action of the ocean's waves in rocking the ship, gunners on a ship suffer an additional RMod penalty equal to (the wind's Beaufort number minus 4) x2. For example, in a gentle breeze (Beaufort number 3) the penalty would be (3-4 = -1 which is less than 0) no penalty at all, but in a strong gale (Beaufort number 9) the penalty would be (9-4 = 5 x 2 =10) -10 to all RMods.

[Andrea]

Re: Early Firearms

 

Hey thanks Captain Obvious very interesting rules idea for my Hornblower Hero pet project..

If only I could learn all the Hero rules......

 

Ciao

[Edsel]

Air Guns, the Other Lead Ball

 

Though not actually a "firearm" air guns, especially the early ones, were fascinating and deadly weapons. In 1600's and 1700's many European nobility considered them to be non-chivalrous, and too dangerous to allow. Their developement was therefore discouraged.

 

This website gives a brief rundown on just how effective a weapon they were. I provide the link to it since it gives examples of caliburs and muzzle velocitys that were attained. One wonders what sort of air guns would be around nowadays if air guns had been given the same attention toward developement that gunpowder weapons were. It is hard to find much information since these weapons are now mostly forgotten.

 

The version used by Austrian Sharp Shooters against Napoleon's troops used an air reserve that could be changed out, thus there was no need to manually pump them up in combat. The French would hang any enemy they caught with these "monsterous" weapons.

[Toadmaster]

Re: Air Guns, the Other Lead Ball

 

Though not actually a "firearm" air guns, especially the early ones, were fascinating and deadly weapons. In 1600's and 1700's many European nobility considered them to be non-chivalrous, and too dangerous to allow. Their developement was therefore discouraged.

 

 

Even current modern airguns can be deadly, a 2 year old was recently shot and killed with one in Scotland, the jerk shooting was taking a shot at a firefighter working at a house fire, he missed the firefighter striking the child in the head which makes me think this was not at particularly close range. There are already people talking about banning airguns .

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4317423.stm

 

 

As far as interesting air guns I thought the dynamite gun used by the US Navy around the Spanish American War was an interesting idea, it used air to lauch a shell filled with dynamite, air was used since it was thought an explosive charge could set off the dynamite at launch (with rather bad results for the ship).

[Toadmaster]

Re: Early Firearms

 

Captain Obvious, looks good. I think I will steal it for myself , Thank You.

[Spence]

Re: Early Firearms

 

When I run games with early firearms I have loading and firing as separate skills. Loading skill affects speed of the reload and whether is is properly loaded. Firing is whether you hit or not. It adds a lot of "color" to the game. I had one game where the PC's held off the "savages" by having the "crack shot" do all the shooting and the others were "loading like He**".

 

Just a thought.

[gewing]

Re: Early Firearms

 

Check out this guys airguns.

 

http://www.glbarnes.com

 

the .58 yukon will kill wild boar. Or just about anything else on this continent! 500-650 ft lbs of energy doesn't sound all THAT high, until you realize he is throwing 500+gr slugs!

[Edsel]

Re: Early Firearms

 

I found another good page about early air guns.

 

It is here.

 

Apparently even the Pope considered them evil weapons. It was realized that a unit of men equipped with air guns could easily defeat troops armed with the conventional flintlocks of the time. This was bad for the status quo of 18th & 19th Century Europe.

 

I still wonder what modern guns would have been like if everyone back then had discarded their black powder guns in favor or the air gun. Today's air guns are quite impressive but what would military rifles be like today, if air guns had become the predominate weapon back then?

 

"We're comming up on a hot LZ, so fire up the compressor and man the door gun!"

[Glupii]

Re: Early Firearms

 

I know this is a long lost post and likely nobody is interested in this but I was stationed in Berlin GE. during the occupation and during this time we were told during our indoctrination for the Berlin Brigade that while the Politzei (sp?) were not allowed to carry any cartridge charged weapon (aka gunpowder weapons) that they should not be underestimated because their air guns were extreamly lethal. No idea how much fact there is in what we were told but there you go.

[Captain Obvious]

Re: Early Firearms

 

I don't think it was mentioned earlier in the thread, but the Lewis and Clark expedition carried an air gun or two along with them, that they used mostly for hunting, but also occasionally for the "impress the natives" bit.

[Escafarc]

Re: Early Firearms

 

[brionl]

Re: Early Firearms

 

Meh. "Banned by the Pope" never stopped any development of truly useful weapons. Airguns are too complex and fragile, and not soldier proof. You can fire fairly quickly. Until the air-reservoir runs down. Then you spend however long pumping it back up again. All those air seals are prone to wearing out and leaking. They just aren't as all around useful as gunpowder weapons.

[Sundog]

Re: Early Firearms

 

Uness you use pre-pressurized gas cylinders. Then replacing a discharged cylinder takes no longer then reloading.